I was going to ask the same thing. While it's a bit annoying I think i could change mine in 3 minutes to any position.
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RF30 Basement Install
- Thread starter YYCHM
- Start date
historicalarms
Ultra Member
Well...let me explain...chronological advancement has severely affected my"nimbleness" that you fellers might no be experiencing yet...and then you add in echanging & finding the appropriate metric wrenches to replace the SAE wrenches that I regularly use...and then, because my mill is set so the table top is about mid-chest level so the chronologically taxed eyeball that I have left can see the cut happening means that the belts are "way up there" out of easy reach without a step ladder...so off to find the step ladder that the wife borrowed to trim tree branches(it might be anywhere's around the 5 acre estate...its just a farm yard but all our urban relatives call it an "estate). Climbing that ladder and pulling on wrenches and pry bars (to tighten the motor mount belt) is where the chronological advancement "nimbleness" really comes into play....your turn's are coming.
It's not 30 min, it just feels like 30 min LOL. But ya, it means dragging the step stool out, loosening the motor tensioner, climbing up to loosen the idler bracket, only to find out you grabbed the wrong wrench, back up jiggle the belts loose, reposition the belts, climb down, tension the motor, back up to tighten the idler bracket. It's time consuming. I'm trying to find that one speed that does 80% of what I typically do, which is milling with 1/2" endmills and drilling up to 1/2".
Gotcha!
One thing I've learned over years is to dedicate wrenches to tools.
I buy singles of whatever sizes I need for the machine adjustments and keep them on or near the machine. Definitely saves the frustration of having the wrong size.
One thing I've learned over years is to dedicate wrenches to tools.
I buy singles of whatever sizes I need for the machine adjustments and keep them on or near the machine. Definitely saves the frustration of having the wrong size.
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Having the required tools dedicated to the machine saves time and you add less money to the swear jar.
I've bought a lot of extra wrenches and "stuff" at the local "ReStore" Habitat for Humanity outlet. They usually have used and sometimes new wrenches, sockets and lots of brass plumbing stuff for a good price.
I've bought a lot of extra wrenches and "stuff" at the local "ReStore" Habitat for Humanity outlet. They usually have used and sometimes new wrenches, sockets and lots of brass plumbing stuff for a good price.
These should be close. Measured in mm.
Head 158 180 200 218
Idler 146 121 92 64
Motor 40 60 84 99
You mount your DTI in the spindle and lock it (to stop the spindle from rotating & thus the DTI). Or you can use the DTI on a mag base and mount it to the head on a flat spot so that the stylus reaches the fixed jaw. Back off the tie down bolts so that one is snug and the other is a little more. You must be able to bump the vise with your hand or a soft mallet. Traverse the table side to side (x-axis movement) and watch the needle. If it rises (or falls) bump the vise to stop the needle from moving. You may have to traverse a number of times to achieve zero needle movement. Once you have it, start tightening the bolts, a little each until they are tight. Watch the DTI needle while tightening - it should not move. If it does, traverse, bump if required, and tighten. With a bit of practise you will be able to do this in a few minutes. So taking the vise off for a different set-up and putting it back on becomes a non-issue in the future.
That would be great thanks. I'll get you to recheck my tramming measurements as well.
Looks like I have....
0.002 tilt on the x-axis over 22"
0.004 tilt on the y-axis over 8"
0.006 yaw on the x-axis over 22"
+- 0.001
These were measure with a DI (I gave up on the DTI) and each repeated 3 times.
This is the only way I can figure out for getting the DI on this vise. That's the moving Jaw I'm indicating off. Cannot for the life of me figure how to indicate off the fixed jaw without resorting to using a mirror to read the DI. That vise is indicating a 0.045 discrepancy over 5" that I cannot figure out how to eliminate. Should be more like 0.001 max.
HELP!!!!
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Getting frustrated here
I can indicate off the fixed jaw but have to use a mirror to read (sort of) the DI. Will see if I can square her this way...
I hate these DI mounting contraptions, they never seem to articulate in the manner you need. My mag base holder drives me crazy
I can indicate off the fixed jaw but have to use a mirror to read (sort of) the DI. Will see if I can square her this way...
I hate these DI mounting contraptions, they never seem to articulate in the manner you need. My mag base holder drives me crazy
If you are going to use the movable jaw, you should clamp a 1-2-3 block in the vise. That will align the movable jaw with the stationary jaw and improve the accuracy. Best is still to use the DTI on the fixed jaw.
There should be no reason for having to use a mirror. See pictures below.
There should be no reason for having to use a mirror. See pictures below.
Rudy, I gave up on using the DTI. Was moving to the point of either it wasn't touching the jaw or it was maxed out.
Maybe my reasoning of the problem is flawed? If I DI on the extreme left or right end of the jaw and twist the vise to see what the maximum deflection could be and then position to 1/2 of that, should that not get it closer? That exercise doesn't seem to work at all.
Craig
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Not necessarily Craig because it depends on where the vise is pivoting (which could be almost anywhere). That's why many folks advocate tightening one hold-down bolt more than the other, the looser one being the one that will slide more readily.... but still not a true pivot Before you start reading the dial, just use the DTI ball itself visually get the jaw aligned as close as you can. This will save you lots of spinning needle syndrome. Your eye can see a very tiny gap. So contact the ball on the tight side, traverse to loose side, reduce the gap. Rinse & repeat if necessary. Then when its pretty close, move the table in to read the DTI from there.
Another method is 'lightly bump while traversing'. Again you need to be reasonably close to begin with. btw there are other methods on YouTube, this is just one.
Another method is 'lightly bump while traversing'. Again you need to be reasonably close to begin with. btw there are other methods on YouTube, this is just one.
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Just got back from babysitting the grand daughters, a treat as always
Back to playing with this thing again.
I can get her to within 0.005 by removing one bolt entirely but once you're there you can't install the bolt. I even tried one of my wonky T-Nuts but that only got me to 0.02. Going to try this thing with the swivel base installed next.
Less than 0.002 in three passes with the swivel base install. BUT.... now it really looks like over kill, I think I have a RoboCop thing happening here LOL. AND... the base of the vise bumps smack dab into those two bolts holding the swarf cover, more Y travel consumed. I'll have to crank the head up now to see if I can get a drill bit over it.
Fun and Games....
Craig
Back to playing with this thing again.
I can get her to within 0.005 by removing one bolt entirely but once you're there you can't install the bolt. I even tried one of my wonky T-Nuts but that only got me to 0.02. Going to try this thing with the swivel base installed next.
Less than 0.002 in three passes with the swivel base install. BUT.... now it really looks like over kill, I think I have a RoboCop thing happening here LOL. AND... the base of the vise bumps smack dab into those two bolts holding the swarf cover, more Y travel consumed. I'll have to crank the head up now to see if I can get a drill bit over it.
Fun and Games....
Craig
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Sounds like you have the process down for aligning it.
Ideally you want much better results: like 1/2thou or less across the fixed jaw. As stated before, if you have to use the movable jaw as a reference, clamp a 1-2-3 block in the vise. It aligns the movable jaw with the fixed jaw for better accuracy.
The swivel base consumes a lot of real estate, which you don’t have a whole lot extra of...
Ideally you want much better results: like 1/2thou or less across the fixed jaw. As stated before, if you have to use the movable jaw as a reference, clamp a 1-2-3 block in the vise. It aligns the movable jaw with the fixed jaw for better accuracy.
The swivel base consumes a lot of real estate, which you don’t have a whole lot extra of...
It could be that your casting lug holes are interfering with your ability to fully align. In other words the lugs may not have been milled quite right and the hold down bolts are contacting on either side of the lug itself. More likely explanation is they may have been sized for slightly smaller or metric bolts and/or associated with the swivel base. But you should be able to make it work.
As Rudy says, you should be indicating on the fixed jaw not the movable jaw. Don't worry about the dial reading facing you, the value is pretty much meaningless. You are just looking for needle movement as you traverse across the jaw.
Also (see Rudy picture) try using double washer under the bolt head. You will soon encounter having the jaw set perfectly aligned when vise slightly loose, but the tightening action makes it go out of whack again. Part of that is just experience, going back & forth progressive tightening & checking, but double washers provide a bit of torque slip. I think there are more sophisticated washers specifically for this, but anyways might help.
As Rudy says, you should be indicating on the fixed jaw not the movable jaw. Don't worry about the dial reading facing you, the value is pretty much meaningless. You are just looking for needle movement as you traverse across the jaw.
Also (see Rudy picture) try using double washer under the bolt head. You will soon encounter having the jaw set perfectly aligned when vise slightly loose, but the tightening action makes it go out of whack again. Part of that is just experience, going back & forth progressive tightening & checking, but double washers provide a bit of torque slip. I think there are more sophisticated washers specifically for this, but anyways might help.
Double washers were the ticket for me.
A single washer just made me pull my hair out.
Craig, is that a 6” vise?
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