# First Lathe, any tips on getting it up and running?(picture heavy)



## Delamont (Feb 22, 2019)

So after many years of wanting a metal lathe I was finally able to get one. An old Logan Model 210 lathe came up on Kijiji that was cheap so I jumped at the chance to get it. What I would love input on is tips on how to best clean and prep the unit and works-pace for use. What sort of things should i be specifically inspecting? What sort of steps should I take first before I attempt working on a piece? Tips on setting up older style tool holder?


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## PeterT (Feb 22, 2019)

There are some good Youtube channels I'd recommend for off hour gazing that pertain to lathe/machine restoration. There is a more complete list of favorite Youtubes somewhere on our forum, but these come to mind. There may also be 'groups' dedicated to your specific model & that can be very valuable networking knowledge & maybe even parts. Yahoo Groups still exists although they are slowly giving way to more general hobby machinist forums.
- Keith Rucker vintagaemachinery.org
- Basement shop guy 
- Keith Fenner turn wright machine works


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## Delamont (Feb 22, 2019)

Thanks Peter I'll check them out.


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## Johnwa (Feb 22, 2019)

Is that the one that was on for $250?  With all the accessories you got that would have been an incredibly buy.
At a minimum I would go through all the bearings and oiling points.  It’s amazing how much sludge can accumulate over time.  Disassembly of the headstock and apron are good ideas.

I’d get a better toolpost. There’s enough flex in these sized lathes already.

John


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## Delamont (Feb 22, 2019)

Johnwa said:


> Is that the one that was on for $250?  With all the accessories you got that would have been an incredibly buy.
> At a minimum I would go through all the bearings and oiling points.  It’s amazing how much sludge can accumulate over time.  Disassembly of the headstock and apron are good ideas.
> 
> I’d get a better toolpost. There’s enough flex in these sized lathes already.
> ...



Yep this is the one for $250 ! i couldn't believe it. thanks John I'll be sure to look at those points. on bearings do people normally upgrade these older models with new bearings or is that only if they are really bad?


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## Johnwa (Feb 22, 2019)

My Southbend spindle runs in the cast iron headstock so I never had that choice.
Personally unless they were noticeably bad I wouldn’t change them out.

According to http://www.lathes.co.uk/logan/page5.html the spindle bearings are sealed so there may not be much you can do other than inspect them.

John


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## Dabbler (Feb 22, 2019)

If you shop around you can find inexpensive 4 way and Aloris AXA tool holders. I've done a ton of work with a SB9a using Anderson/Rocker tool posts and you can do great work with the one you have, at least to start.  

Use you lathe for a while before worrying  about your bearings...  Chances are they are fine.  If not, you can only know by using the lathe anyway.


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## RobinHood (Feb 22, 2019)

I would de-grease / clean everything really well. While you do that, get rid of any rust. Then inspect all the parts prior to reassembly and make a list of items that need attention right away and things that can be improved / replaced at a later time (using your lathe perhaps to make the part). Sometimes you need to put things together with a faulty part to make a new one - that’s ok.


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## Dabbler (Feb 22, 2019)

+1


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## Delamont (Feb 22, 2019)

RobinHood said:


> I would de-grease / clean everything really well. While you do that, get rid of any rust. Then inspect all the parts prior to reassembly and make a list of items that need attention right away and things that can be improved / replaced at a later time (using your lathe perhaps to make the part). Sometimes you need to put things together with a faulty part to make a new one - that’s ok.


Perfect based on Peter's suggestions above I looked closer at the apron today and discovered a broken "transfer gear" not sure what you call the gear that engages power feed on the cross slide. So I'll have to figure out why that broke and if I can replace it.


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## Dabbler (Feb 22, 2019)

That won't stop  you from reassembling the machine and turning chips.  I have used mine exactly twice in the 39 years I've had my 12X37.


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## RobinHood (Feb 22, 2019)

Delamont said:


> So I'll have to figure out why that broke and if I can replace it.


Check for shear pins in your drive train. Folks are notorious for replacing the designed “weak link” (aka shear pin) with materials that will not shear under excessive load. They use steel instead of brass  or aluminum for example. So in case of a mishap, the “weak link” now becomes some other part - like your broken feed gear perhaps.
I have seen this in the 4 lathes I worked on thus far. Lucky for me, no other parts “took the fall” for the shear pins; there could easily have been major damage done...

Great job by the way cleaning and “getting into the meat of things”! That’s an excellent way to learn your new machine and it helps you understand how things work and what the capabilities/limitations are.


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## Delamont (Feb 22, 2019)

RobinHood said:


> Check for shear pins in your drive train. Folks are notorious for replacing the designed “weak link” (aka shear pin) with materials that will not shear under excessive load. They use steel instead of brass  or aluminum for example. So in case of a mishap, the “weak link” now becomes some other part - like your broken feed gear perhaps.
> I have seen this in the 4 lathes I worked on thus far. Lucky for me, no other parts “took the fall” for the shear pins; there could easily have been major damage done...
> 
> Great job by the way cleaning and “getting into the meat of things”! That’s an excellent way to learn your new machine and it helps you understand how things work and what the capabilities/limitations are.


Ok great tip on shear pins I was not aware that was a thing. I did notice a brass key on the lead screw (I think) side of the broken gear, part of it may have been bent I'll start there. Great forum guys thanks for the help.


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## Johnwa (Feb 22, 2019)

Rudy
Where can you get brass shear pins for the SM lathe?  Is there a source other than LeBlond?

John


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## Johnwa (Feb 22, 2019)

Here’s a Logan forum
https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/loganlathe/info


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## Dabbler (Feb 22, 2019)

My friend Bert just makes shear pins when he needs them... (usually out of brass)


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## RobinHood (Feb 23, 2019)

Johnwa said:


> Where can you get brass shear pins for the SM lathe? Is there a source other than LeBlond?


John, as Dabbler mentioned what his friend does, I make them myself.


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## PeterT (Feb 23, 2019)

Maybe someone can confirm but I think this is how you figure it out
- determine your pin taper either by PN or measuring big end diameter D. Example #2 = 3/16" so D = 0.193".
careful measuring because if the head was beat down & distorted it may give you false micrometer reading
- measure taper pin length, example L = 1.25"
- diameter reduction *Dr = L * .02083* = 1.25 * .02083 = .0260"
- small end diameter *d = D - Dr*      = 0.193 - .0260 = 0.167"
- so offset or infeed depth of cut on the small end is half of Dr if you prefer,  *DOC = Dr/2 *    =   .0260 / 2 = .013"
** metric taper pins use a different taper factor ***

So the way I made mine was
- turn the stock down to major diameter (0.193" in this example)
- mark out the length (1.25" in this example)
- turn the small diameter down (0.167" in this example) to outboard shoulder which is pin length
- blued the stock & used a file to connect the 2 diameters ensuring taper was straight (teeny straightedge & flashlight)
- part it off & finish the ends

This is kind of crude. You could set up a compound taper angle, My hole/shaft was already mangled by the factory driving a steel roll pin in there. My taper pin fit but I'm pretty sure so would a 0.193" straight pin LOL


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## RobinHood (Feb 23, 2019)

Your procedure looks good.

I have used the compound angle method in the past. I have learned to make the angle too steep initially as I can go back and decrease it if required for better fit. I leave extra length just in case. The toolpost grinder is a great tool to just take off a little bit if required.


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## Johnwa (Feb 23, 2019)

I did make a couple using my little unimat lathe.  I wasn’t sure regular brass rod was an appropriate material or not.  It was a slow process on the Uni because I couldn’t support the end, it took many many teensy cuts.


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## RobinHood (Feb 23, 2019)

Here is a chart of shear strength of different metals:






You can see that very low carbon steels and brass (other than cold worked brass) have similar shear values. Since I had no way of knowing what kind of steel pin was in the drive (one had a roll pin => very hard!) and I was not about to pay LeBlond prices for replacement parts, I just used brass. I annealed it to be sure it would be soft and called it good.


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## Johnwa (Feb 23, 2019)

I didn’t realize I should anneal the pin! 
Thanks for the info
John


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## RobinHood (Feb 23, 2019)

Johnwa said:


> I didn’t realize I should anneal the pin!


Unless you know for sure how they made your brass stock material. If they hot formed it, then probably no need. Since I have no idea how the stuff I have was made, I annealed it. Maybe overkill, but for sure better than what was in there....


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## TheLocalDrunk (Feb 25, 2019)

Ewwww, Yeah, I just used brass turned it down, stuck it in and didnt think any more about it :s


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## RobinHood (Feb 25, 2019)

TheLocalDrunk said:


> Ewwww, Yeah, I just used brass turned it down, stuck it in and didnt think any more about it :s


To be honest, I would not worry too much. You will be fine with brass.


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## Delamont (Feb 25, 2019)

Any other sage wisdom on getting a new (to me) machine space ready? Or any thoughts on sourcing toolholders, just need something cheap to start or if there's a used market for them some place? Also any tips on leveling a bench mounted lathe or should I make the lathe it's own custom frame/stand?


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## Johnwa (Feb 25, 2019)

In case you haven’t got one, here’s a manual for your lathe
http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/2093/3353.pdf. There is a short section on leveling.  
I use this
http://manuals.chudov.com/Rollies-Dads-Method-of-Lathe-Alignment.pdf to check for level as it doesn’t require a precision level or test bar.

An AXA quick change toolpost is ideal for your lathe but does cost $.
In the meantime the rocker post will work.
I have a 4 way post that you can have if you want.  It’s a bit more solid but every tool has to be shimmed to height.


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