# King 10"x 22" Modern 11"x 26" or BB 10"x 22" or 7" x 12" and mod it?



## JohnnyTK (Feb 14, 2020)

Currently looking at making the jump to a larger machine and have put these on my list to explore. With the import and exchange rates from the states, not looking at any machines from US. Also I have looked at some used machines, but some looked so great on Kijii cause of a fresh coat of paint, but in real life just a paint can rebuild Any input on the above machines or others to consider, would be appreciated. Was thinking of a 7" x and buying "The Complete Mini-Lathe Workshop" and making upgrading part of the learning process to making the step at a later time to a used lathe.


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## Bofobo (Feb 20, 2020)

I tried this, my mini mill has now $750 extra base parts to make it physically better (long travel kit, belt upgrade, treadmill motor and fabrication to make this all work),  plus DRO making it around $3000 for that one machine, I’ll never see that back, so I’m suggesting go just beyond Bench top size unless you have serious space limitations. And then go biggest bench top you can find. 
For lathe, I got the biggest 110v (a 13x24) I could after owning a 7x12 and quite like it, it could be a bench top but came with stands. I would however buy another 7x12> if I am forced into another minimalist situation


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## JohnnyTK (Feb 21, 2020)

Bofobo said:


> I tried this, my mini mill has now $750 extra base parts to make it physically better (long travel kit, belt upgrade, treadmill motor and fabrication to make this all work),  plus DRO making it around $3000 for that one machine, I’ll never see that back, so I’m suggesting go just beyond Bench top size unless you have serious space limitations. And then go biggest bench top you can find.
> For lathe, I got the biggest 110v (a 13x24) I could after owning a 7x12 and quite like it, it could be a bench top but came with stands. I would however buy another 7x12> if I am forced into another minimalist situation


What is the 13"x 24" model?
Thanks


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## Dabbler (Feb 21, 2020)

If history can be our guide, very good work has been done by many thousands of people on small-ish lathes.   For instance a South Bend 9" lathe can do very accurate work.  The Standard Modern lathes proved very good as well.  I'm not dissing the 7 X xx  series of lathes and watchmaker's lathes.  They all can do good work.

This logic does not follow to milling machines.  Cutting tool pressures as significantly higher on a mill, except for using very small cutters.  There are greater impact forces because interrupted cuts on a mill are very often encountered, such as entering a new cut.  There is a tendency (or is it a need) to use larger cutters and face mills that need very good rigidity to do their job (well). 

If you don't want to spend your money several times, you are better served by buying a larger, heavier, more rigid mill. Mills are very spendy to upgrade (experience speaking here).  The difference in ability of a heavier, more rigid mill is astounding.

If you don't have the space, or a restricted budget, get what you can use, but stick to tooling that is appropriate for it.  When you can hear your machine complaining, you have to back off.

JohnC


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## Tom Kitta (Feb 21, 2020)

The 13 x 24 is my old lathe - it was OK but not that great - it is however for sure a step up from a mini. The old model is 089. Its from Busy Bee and you can get it cheaper online. 

Dabbler has it hands down correct above - with lathe vs. mill. My exact experience. Mini mill was a piece of crap for me - but 13 x 24 was by comparison a real machine! 

I would also concentrate on the mill - just as Dabbler said - you can still do good small work on a mini lathe or 13 x 24 but working on a light mill is an issue. Get biggest mill that you can pay for / have space for. Lathe - even small one is not as problematic.


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## JohnnyTK (Feb 21, 2020)

Always appreciate the input and as I think about it, the only time I really wished I had a larger lathe was for turning a larger flywheel for a steam engine build, but that is why we have friends. I'm a tool hoarder, got start using them more and to full potential, before I keep purchasing something else. Still have so much tooling to purchase or upgrade in regard to my lathes and mill. More of a want then a need!


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## Tom Kitta (Feb 21, 2020)

As per title of the thread the answer which one will be heavily dictated by how much you have to spend.

Generic 7 x 12 is the cheapest - more deluxe models include better motor.

Then there is 7 x 16 - for example http://www.mini-lathe.com/Mini_lathe/Reviews/mm_7x16/mm7x16.htm

Then we have King and BB which are very similar and at similar price. 

Then we have more well outfitted Modern that is also a bit bigger - expect to pay more.

Modifying a generic 7 x 12 is possible - some people for example replace the bearings to more of a precision bearing. Some even create a Frankenstein lathe using two beds. You can get new motor into it to make it more powerful etc. However, all these will cost money and will not make small machine perform like large one. Its just easier to sell and buy bigger. Unless your goal is for example to turn 7 x 12 into CNC or a watchmakers precision lathe - these do make some sense as mods.


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