# Pm research #1 steam engine build



## phaxtris (Nov 12, 2022)

Damn you blondihacks, such a bad influence.

Here is my start to the #1 kit, I figured finally having a long weekend off it would be a good chance to jump in with both feet.
 I've watched both blondi's and Joe pies build logs for inspiration on the process/techniques...and doing my own spin with what I have available, and with what makes sense to me with my fabrication/layout/drawing experience

Casualty count so far...1 2mm end mill (got greedy) and 1 5mm end mill (part moved...nst)

Included is a picture of the tap "handles" I whipped up for the tiny little taps


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## 140mower (Nov 12, 2022)

Will be following along with this.... I have been so looking forward to shop season.


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## PeterT (Nov 12, 2022)

Cool project!

Re your tapping handles, maybe you know this already but just in case - you can position the disc lower down the tap so that you have sufficient amount of shank to be guided by the drill chuck jaws. To tap, just crack the jaws open a bit vs grip so that the tap shank can rotate freely but is still being guided by the jaws. Wider discs provide more leverage & feel while tapping, but can also block out what you want to see if  they are too big.


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## phaxtris (Nov 13, 2022)

@PeterT thanks, my intent was to tap like you describe, but I found with the larger 5-40 size tap I could not get enough bite on the shank after the first few threads and it would just slip, so I moved up to the flats...I think its maybe because I put two set screws 180 apart...not enough surface area providing the necessary friction maybe

Keeping them straight seems to be ok by hand, I bought a taper and a plug for each size, taper first then plug seems to be working good, I'm sure it would be a different story if I went straight away with a plug though


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## Susquatch (Nov 13, 2022)

phaxtris said:


> Keeping them straight seems to be ok by hand, I bought a taper and a plug for each size, taper first then plug seems to be working good, I'm sure it would be a different story if I went straight away with a plug though



That's what I always do too. For some jobs you never need the plug - eg through holes and deep holes. But I almost never buy just one tap - I buy the pair even if I only need one of them. I stopped buying complete sets a very long time ago. I just buy a quality tap pair for what I need as I need them. Once in a while I buy a die too.


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## PeterT (Nov 13, 2022)

Yes, from what I've seen of others, they grind a small flat on the tap shank to give the set screw something to land on, a rudimentary key.

I use this homebrew version. Set screws engage tap flats, no tap grinding, use as a shank to power tap or use the tommy bar. I could have slimmed it down a bit but the set screws need some minimum thickness.
Anyway, didn't want to digress your engine project into a tapping discussion. Its good that you are thinking of this in advance, fiddly fine threads is a thing with these models. Things that help with tap alignment & reducing chance of breaking them off is worth the effort.


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## YotaBota (Nov 13, 2022)

Nice to see another steam engine thread, I'm just getting my head around starting back on my Stuart 10V.
Did you buy the kit from PM? If so and you don't mind sharing, what did the shipping cost?
Just a note on house keeping, it's a good idea to cover the ways as cast dust is hell on sliding surfaces.


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## phaxtris (Nov 13, 2022)

YotaBota said:


> Nice to see another steam engine thread, I'm just getting my head around starting back on my Stuart 10V.
> Did you buy the kit from PM? If so and you don't mind sharing, what did the shipping cost?
> Just a note on house keeping, it's a good idea to cover the ways as cast dust is hell on sliding surfaces.



I did yes, buy it directly from PM.

 The shipping was expensive, I think it was like 80 usd, to justify the high shipping to myself i bought the #1 and the #5 on the same order, I believe it was the same shipping for the one kit as it was for the two...so why not....total for the two kits and shipping was 332usd ( i found the email with the price quote). However I don't believe i got dinged with any duty/tax when it arrived.

Figured i would start with the #1 as there is some guidance out there in the world of YouTube.


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## Janger (Nov 13, 2022)

phaxtris said:


> Damn you blondihacks, such a bad influence.
> 
> Here is my start to the #1 kit, I figured finally having a long weekend off it would be a good chance to jump in with both feet.



I don't follow what are you making a model steam engine? Besides tap handles.


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## YYCHM (Nov 13, 2022)

Janger said:


> I don't follow what are you making a model steam engine? Besides tap handles.








						Steam Engine #1 | PM Research
					






					www.pmmodelengines.com


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## phaxtris (Nov 13, 2022)

This is all i have time for today, laundry, paperwork, grocery shopping are all calling my name......and according to my wife....."chippers" as well (potato chips)

Casualty count for today : 1 - 7/64 drill bit...snapped as i broke through on the first steam hole into the steam inlet....switched to a cheaper, softer bit for the remainder (and used the called out 1/8...(there is a reason i used a 7/64, but thats another story). Problem solved, no more broken bits to try and remove.....although i was lucky enough to remove the broken bits without much trouble

Locating the steam port holes seems to be a bit of a contentious item between the two youtubers.....BlondiHacks eyeballed it it happened to work out for her, Joe Pie goes on a great big tangent with some kind of fancy layout ball and a bunch of math (and lets be honest...is kind of a dick about it the whole time). Although this is probably the absolute most accurate way of locating those holes....I don't have a fancy layout ball...and would wager most hobbyists don't either...
Not wanting to eyeball it, and being used to working with drawings that are missing the dimensions that would make life easier, it was not hard to see the missing right angle triangle created from the edge of the bore and the called out dimension (that makes the hypotenuse) . I used fusion 360 to do the math for me....because...it gave me a nice screen shot and....technology. Used an edge finder to find the edge of the bore (i know not perfect...but this is only half a piano), took off the radius of the finder, edge found both sides and halved (also not perfect)...then went off the dro for the remainder...i am off a few thou left to right....but all of the steam holes busted into the steam chest at a nice elevation, i would call that a success 

i also did not have any way of indicating the center of the bore for the head bolts....turned a chunk of scrap into a tight plug i could use to center everything up.....seemed to work well enough

for the keen viewers, the reason im using an er32 collet chuck instead of r8 collets in the spindle....the collet chuck is very close in size to my drill chuck...i have a round column mill, this is a bit of a work around for not having to raise the head when going between a drill chuck and a short endmill

@PeterT no worry's, i dont mind tangents, its a forum after all, one thing leads to the next


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## Janger (Nov 13, 2022)

YYCHM said:


> Steam Engine #1 | PM Research
> 
> 
> 
> ...



PM.... hmm private message? project management? preventative maintenance? pm research ah! 

I renamed the thread Ryan hope you don't mind.


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## phaxtris (Nov 14, 2022)

"oh it's a week night...I'll just do something small"

Well that escalated, not having any way to actually hold this little guy I had to spend some time making clamps and a sacrificial fixture board thing

I tried the superglue thing...my superglue must suck, because it definitely didn't work for me

I centered up the casting on the center boss...but I don't think the boss was really centered on the rest of the casting so the one bolt hole is a few tho closer to the edge than I would like, maybe there was a better way, possibly the holes first...oh well


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## Janger (Nov 14, 2022)

Good results. How to hold it is half the battle.


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## phaxtris (Nov 19, 2022)

A few more little pieces completed today and over the week

Pressure turning seems to be the name of the game for a lot of it

The little clamps and clamping plate have been invaluable for quite a few of these little pieces, glad I spent the time to make that stuff

Also included is my poor man's er collet chuck...straight shank er32 collet holder and a 4j.....seems to work pretty good...and it was cheap


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## Tomc938 (Nov 19, 2022)

Thanks for the pictures and explanation!

I also ordered the number one and number five at the same time to save on shipping. Likely won't have time to work on mine and until into the new year.

I like your suggestion of using fusion 360 to calculate the steam port angles. Joe Pye has more toys than most of us can afford.

And Janger more right than he knows - figuring out how to hold the small pieces to machine them is *more* than half the battle!


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## phaxtris (Dec 18, 2022)

A bit more progress, most of this is over a week old, I was waiting on a reamer, then off to mexico, and now back at it today. Included are pictures of the two bit extensions i needed to make in order to spot/drill the set screw hole in the flywheel, and the little bit of setup/work i have done on the base, and a video of the flywheel running at 900 rpm. I realized after the fact i should have been turning it on an arbor, so time will tell if it runs that true with its on the crankshaft, wost case i can turn an arbor later and skim the flywheel so it runs nice and true...oh the things you think of after your done for the night and in the shower

I am changing the plans up a bit, and have gone with 9mm for the reamed holes relating to the crankshaft (flywheel, crank caps, eccentrics....), reason being a 9mm spiral reamer is like 1/4 the price of a 3/8 reamer, i will just turn the crankshaft to suit the 9mm bores


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## DPittman (Dec 18, 2022)

phaxtris said:


> A bit more progress, most of this is over a week old, I was waiting on a reamer, then off to mexico, and now back at it today. Included are pictures of the two bit extensions i needed to make in order to spot/drill the set screw hole in the flywheel, and the little bit of setup/work i have done on the base, and a video of the flywheel running at 900 rpm. I realized after the fact i should have been turning it on an arbor, so time will tell if it runs that true with its on the crankshaft, wost case i can turn an arbor later and skim the flywheel so it runs nice and true...oh the things you think of after your done for the night and in the shower
> 
> I am changing the plans up a bit, and have gone with 9mm for the reamed holes relating to the crankshaft (flywheel, crank caps, eccentrics....), reason being a 9mm spiral reamer is like 1/4 the price of a 3/8 reamer, i will just turn the crankshaft to suit the 9mm bores
> 
> ...


Love following along your build.  Forgive me if you already mentioned it...are you using  British Standard threads with it or are you going to use similar imperial threads instead?


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## phaxtris (Dec 18, 2022)

DPittman said:


> Love following along your build.  Forgive me if you already mentioned it...are you using  British Standard threads with it or are you going to use similar imperial threads instead?



Thanks

I don't think I ever did mention specifically. I am using the fasteners that came in the kit, imperial, 2-72, 5-40, etc. I am ok with the look of the kit fasteners...and it was not an extra cost


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## DPittman (Dec 18, 2022)

phaxtris said:


> Thanks
> 
> I don't think I ever did mention specifically. I am using the fasteners that came in the kit, imperial, 2-72, 5-40, etc. I am ok with the look of the kit fasteners...and it was not an extra cost


Oh I guess I had "Stuart" steam engines in my head as I'm pretty sure they all still use British Association threads in them.  Lucky you.


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## PeterT (Dec 19, 2022)

PM is USA based so IMP sizing. They also use IMP pipe threads here & there from what I've heard (no first hand knowledge or affiliation, friend of mine has built some kits).





						PM Research | Model Engines and Accessories for Hobbyist and Machinist
					






					www.pmmodelengines.com
				




Yes Stuart is from UK.








						Stuart Models | Steam Engines | Model Engineering | Executive Toys
					

All of our models are supplied as sets of castings with drawings and all necessary materials, fixings and fittings to machine your own model steam engine



					www.stuartmodels.com
				




Depending on one's current state of tooling & financial means, even some of them who live close by suppliers are getting grumpy about the cost & availability of BA type fasteners/tooling & have opted for metric equivalents. But depending on the model, especially steam related, other specialized fittings may also be required & may only be offered with specific threads or sizes.



			https://www.stuartmodels.com/products/fittings-tools-accessories/tools/


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## phaxtris (Dec 20, 2022)

if the kit came with ba stuff i probably would have considered going to metric, as it is easy to source, and cheap.....but alas the imperial taps were available, not insanely priced and switching over 2 entire kits didnt seem worth the effort


Anyways, with the weather i only had a few hours of actual work to do today and was able to put a bit more time into the steam engine project. The base isnt completed yet, there are quite a few steps to complete it and didnt want to overload one post.....so here it is so far

the V grove that you can see milled in the end of the base is to locate the crankshaft CL, the corner of the groove is the CL of the crankshaft. I left a small nail catching line in the casting to help me line everything up when it comes time to drill/ream the casting/main caps for the crankshaft. It was a pretty simple way to locate that feature with the dro. The photo you can see with the tap..that was the only think i had with a precision ground point that i could toss in a collet to get zeroed on the y axis for the holes/step on the cap, i eyeballed that...so im sure its not 100% perfect, but good enough

to get the casting in the 45 to mill/drill/etc the main's i copied what blodihacks did, 123 block in the vise, bolt and square up the casting on the 123 block, then set the 123 up at a 45...checked the grove with a small drill bit and an indicator...seemed to be straight, and after milling to the groove i made earlier im confident that it is reasonably square with the other features....yey!

Things still to do.... machine the main caps so that they can be bolted on and the crank bore completed, the cylinder ends needs to be faced and drilled,  the packing gland mount needs to be drilled/tapped and at some point i will have to drill the mounting holes so the model can be screwed down to something


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## DPittman (Dec 20, 2022)

Good work. And no doubt posting pictures and write up is work too...we appreciate it.


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## phaxtris (Dec 21, 2022)

Thanks @DPittman 

The cold weather has been a boon for the steam engine project it seems. Some more work completed on the base, the only things outstanding are to drill the oilers for the main caps and the mounting holes

fist thing up was to machine the bearing caps, no pictures here, nothing special, the only thing i did differently than the other two is that i did them while still connected together, cut apart and machined off the sprue once bolted down

I milled out a small block for use as a jig to facilitate easy setup for the crankshaft boring. it simply indexes on the cross slide and holds the base square, this little block was also turned into the drill guide and then into the last clamping fixture to complete cylinder end machining 

With no surface plate or height gauge I had to drill the hole for the piston rod in the same manner as blondihacks, through a drill guide and with a homemade drill extension...... probably the best one i have made to date. This worked out well enough, and only a few minutes of extra work.

I also had to carry up the small fingernail line for the crank centerline, an olfa knife made a well enough mark. drilled/reamed with no excitement, the hole appears to be centered well on the parting line.....time will tell how easily the crank plops in as to how centered it is

enough blabbing, on to the pictures already...


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