# Sanders



## Janger (Oct 5, 2017)

I know the knife crowd likes these VFD super fancy and expensive sanders. I use an alternative which might work for some. I have one of those belt and disc bench sanders for wood. I use it for metal and it's my go to  tool for any deburr work or rounding and some finishing. Belts are cheap at $6 (BB or KMS) It's my alternative to those $1000 metal sanders that are about 3-4' long.

Photo attached. I use a twist tie and the vacuum wand for dust control and the funny beige stick is to clean the belts.  Works surprisingly well. It really just a big eraser. I got it at kms. These sanders new are about $160 - 200 depending - I managed to find a used one. It's been a great tool for me. I use it on probably every project.
Similar to this one
https://m.kmstools.com/king-canada-benchtop-belt-disc-sander-117779

What do other people do?


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## CalgaryPT (Oct 6, 2017)

I have an Ellis 6000 Belt Grinder that I like ( http://www.ellissaw.com/ellis-6000-belt-grinder/ ) and a Kalmazoo 20" Industrial Disc Grinder ) https://www.kalamazooind.com/products/disc-sanders/ds20-20-disc-sander/ ) that I love.

My lessons learned:

1) splurge for the zirconia (blue) belts and discs for metal work over wood abrasives. The turnaround time for replacing a PSA disc on my Kalamazoo taught me to never cheap out on these again. A heat gun, Acetone, Goo-Gone, scrappers, razor knives, etc, and hours of downtime convinced me never use wood Aluminium Oxide (brown) discs on a metal machine again.
2) plastic Shop Vac hoses attached to metal working machines catch fire/melt. I replaced mine first with HVAC duct and later with flexible exhaust tube to solve the problem.
3) some of the machines intended for woodworking have internal plastic parts around the exhausts that can not only melt with hot sparks, but tend to clog more than cast. I had a Busy Bee one year ago that clogged constantly. When I removed the plastic exhaust port, the problem disappeared.
3) research the FPM / RPM as metal machines often use a higher speed than wood. I don't see a huge difference in my newer metal-devoted machines over previous Busy Bee/KMS ones that said "wood/metal" on them, but perhaps this is more apparent on thicker stock. I normally work with 1/8" and max out at 3/16" A36. I think knife guys prefer high speeds, but I could be wrong.

I read once that the funny beige sticks (erasers) aren't recommended for metal, but I use them too John.

Having said all this my fav was on old Crappy Tire 12 Disc sander that warned it was not for metal. But it was great for years and years before I burned it out! Great value.

Have you ever used one of those inflatable drum sanders? I know they are for wood, but I saw a guy that did metal spinning use one once and it did a great job on contours.


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## Dabbler (Oct 6, 2017)

I've used an old Busy Bee 6X48 inch sander for my metalwork since 1981.  Works fine-  Just about any grinder/sander will do, - Buy good belts - they do all the work, after all!


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## Janger (Oct 7, 2017)

What's a good belt? Where? I've noticed 3M sandpaper is better but I have no idea where to get better belts than the klingspor stuff at kms or busy bee brand.


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## CalgaryPT (Oct 7, 2017)

My last two orders came from these guys - ( http://www.sandpaper.ca/ ). Pleased with the 3M products from them.  You can also get from Grainger, but I've never had a special order from them they delivered on properly.


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## Dabbler (Oct 8, 2017)

I wish I knOw where I goT my 40 grit zirconia 3M belt from.  It has lasted over 20 years grinding and deburring metal, and it is finally dull!!


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## CalgaryPT (Oct 8, 2017)

I  know that Richelieu has a good assortment ( https://www.richelieu.com/ca/en/category/abrasive-and-finishing-products/1064524 ) at least online. I've only ever ordered hardware from them down east, and had a good experience, and I know they have a Calgary location on 52 and 52. However, I have never been there, and never ordered abrasives, just hardware.

The sanderpaper.ca link I provided above has been great for me. I think it is family-run. The person who answers the phone has a thick Russian accent that reminds me of "Red" in _Orange is the New Black.  _But she was GREAT with my order, charming to deal with, and the only company that didn't let me down (and yeah--Canadian!)  They followed up with status reports when asked, their estimates were on time, and the product was good. I will use them again in a few months when I order the more expensive blue disks. The only downside (for me) was because my order was non-standard (they do not regularly stock 20" PSA discs), it took 2 weeks. I don't think this is the case for standard belts though. They have a minimum order of $50.00, and for non-standard sizes be aware most manufacturers (e.g., 3M) don't ship quantities less than 10 units/order. I did price-check at KMS, and had them call their 3M supplier, but the price was higher and the delivery time was 3 months. This was too long for me, but I must admit my experience with special orders from KMS has not been bad. I ordered a 7x12 King Bandsaw through before that went smoothly.

When I looked at the stock numbers it was clear both sandpaper.ca and Grainger order from the same 3M contact. But Grainger messed up the order for months, which is how I ended up with sandpaper.ca. Perhaps Calgary Fasteners can order as well, but as much as I like them in general, they too get a "F" from me on any special orders. 

My biggest lesson learned the hard way is buy the best (@Dabbler should convince everyone who is unsure), and not regret it later. For PSA discs this is especially important.

I think there is a special order house in Edmonton that also does custom sizes, but I can't t find them online anymore. I think they were affiliated with a Vancouver location.


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## Janger (Oct 11, 2017)

20 years Dabbler? That's amazing.


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## Dabbler (Oct 11, 2017)

For the first 10 years I didn't do a lot with it, perhaps deburring a couple times a week. In the past 5 it has been heavily used.  Funny, though - the belt is still okay, but the zirconia is all worn down.    It won't cut steel even with a lot of pressure... I think I'll keep it as a souvenir...

Moral of the story - if you want to grind metal, you can't beat zirconia with a quality backing.

BTW I bought 2 belts at the same time, and i made a mistake and ripped the first one in less than a week.  I learned my lesson and started to respect the belt and not exceed the machine's capabilities.


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## Bert the Weldor (Oct 14, 2017)

My current, but about to be replaced, is a 15 yr old delta 6x48 belt/disk combo. It blew up about 5 yrs ago. So I took it apart, turned the rotation horizontal and used the motor off a dead, Mastercraft drill press. Power goes through a single belt and pulley. Got me through in a pinch(they always pack it in when your doing a job with a deadline!) One thing I didn't like and during the rebuild took off, was the graphite pad stuck to the platen, under the belt. I use it mostly for deburing round rod and tube and found that it wore divots in the graphite leading to belts tearing. No problem once removed. 
I always say whatever tool gets the job done within your budget is the best/perfect/right tool for you. Nice thing about those little belt grinders is they are cheap enough you could pull a Norm Abram and get one for each grit!!!


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