# Tormach automatic band saw



## Janger (Jul 26, 2020)

I saw an interesting video on a new bandsaw Tormach is selling with auto feed and auto cutting. $5K USD which is pretty low for an automatic saw. I see it's based on the usual 7x12 frame but has good features, blade tension gauge, angled hydraulic ram, coolant and spinning chip brush.

Here's the marketing and a guy talking about it and showing it working. See below for more questions...










I was looking closely at how it works and grabbed this screen shot. I didn't recognize some of parts and couldn't explain some details. The thing I've labeled Air Motor seems to be an air powered actuator of some sort. It has an air line I think going in and one of those air muffler/silencers on top. This motor shoves the vise jaw against the stock and also loosens it. Watch the video. So how does an air actuator motor move backwards? I don't see any other control lines going into that motor so how would the motor be activated one direction or another?

The air piston I've labeled seems to move the bandsaw arm up and down. I can understand up - push air into it. So how does down work? open a valve and let the air out? It's hard to see in the video. Given it's located close to the arm axis it would have to push pretty hard. ?

And finally the material advance is perhaps driven by a lead screw. It's also hard to see. is there another air motor down under the table or maybe a stepper motor? Zooming in under the table also looks like a ruler or scale is installed - looks metric too which surprises me.

Anybody got any more insight?


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## Johnwa (Jul 26, 2020)

I would guess that your air motor is a single acting/spring return air cylinder.  The muffler would filter the air going in and out of the un-pressurized side.  PA sells a small one like that.


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## kylemp (Jul 27, 2020)

I looked at the tormach one a long time ago, not sure if any changes were made but they worked pretty much exactly like the HEM saw I used at a shop I worked at..
Thsy have 2 single acting pneumatic cylinders for feed, the front is stationary like a normal vise would be, the rear is the shuttle.. The front and rear are both engaged for cutting probably, then the front releases and the rear stays engaged, the the shuttle is advanced and the front clamp locks down and the rear releases. The one I used had a leadscrew and encoder for its length with an air cylinders for the travel. If you gave it a dimension it would adjust the leadscrew to the length and then the air cylinder runs between two hard stops. If the dimension was too long it would do multiple indexes to make the part. 
The lift and downfeed cylinder keeps pressure on the blade not much different than the smaller saws with the spring. It's critical to keep the blade pushing into the material and not allow the blade to bounce, once it haps it will probably blow some of the teeth out of the blade. Stalling isn't an issue on a 5hp saw, so the pressure helps the blade keep a constant force on the workpiece.


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## Janger (Jul 27, 2020)

mcMaster description of various air cylinders:

https://www.mcmaster.com/air-pistons

Thanks Johnwa for identifying the part type!

When the cylinder is activated does it consume air continuously even when at maximum stroke?


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## kylemp (Jul 27, 2020)

Janger said:


> mcMaster description of various air cylinders:
> 
> https://www.mcmaster.com/air-pistons
> 
> ...


Single shot, once its aired up as long as there's isn't any bleeds it doesn't consume any more. You can buy them at princess auto.. 
https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/aluminum-single-acting-spring-return-cylinder/A-p8041394e


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## CalgaryPT (Jul 28, 2020)

kylemp said:


> If the dimension was too long it would do multiple indexes to make the part.


I got to use one years ago. It was an earlier model that didn't index, so it had limited functionality. It could only cut the distance between the fixed vice and the shuttle. The guy who owned it told me it was used in a production environment and had originally been retrofitted with a special vise insert for round tubing. When he bought it at a bankruptcy auction he said they also had a much bigger one. That one interfaced with CNC and could cut variable lengths based on operator input from either a keypad or via computer input. It also had power in-feed and out-feed tables.

I've always enjoyed manufacturing videos, but I don't see as many high end automated bandsaws as I used to. I suspect it's because they are too slow for many production environments. Also, the mechanics (shuttles, in and out-feed tables, etc.,) represent points of failure. Looks like the advent of affordable CNC plasma pipe cutters that can cut on two additional axises has taken over much of this market—at least for round tube and pipe. I think the target customer for automated saws like you see in the video is the small to medium sized production facility.

One of these saws would certainly be a cool addition to a hobby shop. I'm just not sure what project I'd have come up with to trick my brain into believing it's justified. But hey, I've climbed that mountain before.

Thanks for sharing the vid @Janger. Cool machine.


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## Chicken lights (Jul 29, 2020)

CalgaryPT said:


> I got to use one years ago. It was an earlier model that didn't index, so it had limited functionality. It could only cut the distance between the fixed vice and the shuttle. The guy who owned it told me it was used in a production environment and had originally been retrofitted with a special vise insert for round tubing. When he bought it at a bankruptcy auction he said they also had a much bigger one. That one interfaced with CNC and could cut variable lengths based on operator input from either a keypad or via computer input. It also had power in-feed and out-feed tables.
> 
> I've always enjoyed manufacturing videos, but I don't see as many high end automated bandsaws as I used to. I suspect it's because they are too slow for many production environments. Also, the mechanics (shuttles, in and out-feed tables, etc.,) represent points of failure. Looks like the advent of affordable CNC plasma pipe cutters that can cut on two additional axises has taken over much of this market—at least for round tube and pipe. I think the target customer for automated saws like you see in the video is the small to medium sized production facility.
> 
> ...


Let me see if I can explain this- 

So there was one robot that had a vacuum attachment on the arm that could lift a stick or sticks of steel on a conveyor from a stack 

Then they moved into a CNC room where they were cut to a certain length 

Then, there was a shuttle that moved the cut pieces outside the room onto a table 

There, another robot, with a vacuum head, could pick up 12-20 (?) of the cut pieces in one lift, then swivel to place them neatly on a skid 

Apparently the factory owner designed/built most of the processes 

I don’t know any more than that, no idea how the pieces were cut, it wasn’t a fast process but I thought it was neat to see the machines. Full blown factory not a hobby shop or a small fab shop 

Also I have no idea if humans could do this faster, more likely it’s like Alex said it can be run 24 hours and not need to be shut off


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## DianaPowell (Jan 13, 2021)

Thank you for sharing this video. That’s quite interesting, but I don’t think that a lot of people will use it at their homes. Maybe this stuff is useful in large manufactures, but keeping this at home is pointless. I do some wood working crafts and arts, and sell them online. I would say, I prefer to use some manual tools, rather than automatic choppers and saws. Now, I need a new scroll saw, and I search for different reviews about a few models I keep my eye own. Now, there are a lot of different saws and brands available on the market, and it’s hard to choose something specific. I just narrowed my search to a three different models, and can’t decide which one I should buy.


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## Janger (Jan 13, 2021)

This person dianapowell was on the site from LA, Kansas, and Atlanta. Spammer.


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## David_R8 (Jan 13, 2021)

Janger said:


> This person dianapowell was on the site from LA, Kansas, and Atlanta. Spammer.



I thought I recalled her name.


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