# Everlast all in one



## ShawnR (Dec 22, 2021)

I am thinking about replacing my Miller  Syncrowave180 sd and chinese plasma cutter with this









						PowerPro 256SI  * CHRISTMAS SPECIAL *
					

Recommended Areas of Use:   Farm/Ranch portable repair Motorsports/ At the track/off road repair and light fab projects HVAC Factory maintenance and shutdowns Custom prototyping/ welding   Recommended Metals:   Steel Stainless Chrome-Moly Aluminum Titanium Virtually any weldable metal




					www.everlastwelders.ca
				




Just a space thing. I also have a Miller 180 Mig with spool gun so the larger aluminum is covered. My tig skills are not only poor but slow so the Mig gun is best for the larger projects I have done.

I know some members here have Everlast equipment and my impression is that it is decent. Anyone have any more input? Are the specs fairly accurate? It says this machine can cut at 40 amps at 100% duty cycle. My chinese Plasma has been great the few times I have used it. I would like to get one unit that does stick and ACDC Tig but this one came up so figured I would look for input. 

Shawno


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## Susquatch (Dec 22, 2021)

No experience at all. But looking to learn from yours. Please keep us posted!


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## Safarir (Dec 22, 2021)

I don't have experience with this particular machine but I have some with Everlast. I use to have an Everlast PowerMTS 251Si, which is Mig/Tig (DC)/And stick, for about 3 years. It was an awesome machine, I only have good think to say about it.

However, I rarely used the Mig functionality and really wanted to try aluminum TIG welding so I sold it and just recently purchased an PowerTIG 210EXT and watercooler. We will see in a couple of years how this machine compare to the mig.


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## Scattered Parts (Dec 22, 2021)

That looks like an interesting unit. But……why is only Everlast making these combined welder/plasma cutter all in one units and not the other big names like Miller, Lincoln or ESAB? While Everlast welders have a generally good but not excellent reputation, a quick search of real world users shows a high level of dissatisfaction with these units. Now of course there are haters of each manufacturer but what i have seen most about Everlast is there poor warranty service. Since you are happy with your current plasma cutter, I would steer clear of this unit and buy something without a plasma cutter. I use an ESAB 205ic. It is a wonderful unit but quite expensive now compared to when I purchased mine. I purchased it because i wanted to TIG weld aluminum. Still waiting to do that though. Needs versus wants and wants won. Buying today I would most likely look at either a Miller or Lincoln unit. Mostly because there are local welding shops familiar with these units.


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## Tom Kitta (Dec 22, 2021)

I have Everlast for about 5 years now plus. Their warranty used to be 5 years but now is just 3. So far no issues. Price for this unit is excellent. I am a bit worried that quality may have gone down since their first units. Or they are doing some price magic. My 200 amp Tig / Stick AC/DC (so aluminum capable) welder cost 1500 but that was whopping 6 or so years ago. For a stronger machine plus plasma that usually costs in 60 amp version from cheap Chinese 400+ to cost only less then 700 more then mine after 6 years is a great deal unless they went down with quality. 

If you are happy with plasma cutter I would not get rid of it. There are few all around everything in them machines out there - TIG / Stick / Mig / Plasma - at least as far as I remember. Problem is you have a complex machine that has all eggs in one basket - something PROs hate.


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## Tom O (Dec 22, 2021)

I agree with the all the eggs in one basket from Tom mine are all separate but pulse would be nice. What will you be doing with it using it as a stationary machine or something to pack around to different locations? I do wonder about these compact units I went the other way bigger, heavier, you know “ try to walk off with this you Bas*ard “


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## kevin.decelles (Dec 22, 2021)

I have a multi-process machine (Longevity WeldAll256pi) bought in 2008.  I like it, hasn't failed me yet, specs were to be believed.    This was a bit before the Everlast brand getting its legs, and if I were in the market again I wouldn't hesitate to get an Everlast based on members that I know who have them and like them.   The value/$ factor is high in these machines.  Based on recent marketing, I see Everlast over Longevity by 100:1.

That said, I also have additional standalone machines (Millermatic 211) and Lincoln Tombstone AC225 that I use in tandem to prevent switching of cables etc. .    I'm also looking at upgrading to a standalone TIG machine (probably Everlast!)


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## ShawnR (Dec 22, 2021)

Great input everyone. Thank you. 

I am contemplating trying to free up floor space and the big Miller 180 takes up a fair amount, and sits beside the Lincoln cart, and then beside the (empty) Hobart cart....  I don't need to combine the plasma at all with a welding machine but since Everlast combines that function with so many in their lineup, I thought it might be a good justification. But I am in the "don't put eggs in the same basket" camp as well so maybe will watch for a Tig/stick unit only. It would be nice to stack the Mig and Tig units into one nice cart. I think some members here have nice jobs on that.

I will look into the Everlast lineup for the welder only units and maybe go in that direction. 

I will report back.

(Sorry @Susquatch not much for you yet ...  )

Thanks
Cheers,


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## ShawnR (Dec 22, 2021)

Looking a little deeper into the Everlast line, if I wanted to keep the Plasma, (which tucks away nicely under my cutting table) this product looks interesting









						PowerTIG 200DV * CHRISTMAS SPECIAL *
					

Recommended Areas of Use:   Hobby/ DIY Motorsports/Offroad Farm/Ranch Production welding/ Fabrication Shipyards Piplelines Industrial maintenance/HVAC Portable Repair   Recommended Metals:   Steel Stainless Steel Chrome Moly Aluminum Titanium Copper Virtually any metal




					www.everlastwelders.ca


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## LRSbm146 (Jan 8, 2022)

I don’t know if this got mentioned but a big thing to consider with all of the different machines and processes is the consumables... cost and availability. 
It’s always nice to be able to pick up a part on a Saturday.... even if it costs too much


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## Six O Two (Jan 12, 2022)

Just chiming in to add - I have an older Everlast PowerPro256 with tig, stick and plasma, and it's easily lasted through my hobbyist abuse through the years. The stick stinger was kinda junky, but that's a cheap fix. I'd buy another Everlast machine. I'm actually thinking about it pretty seriously to upgrade my cheap mastercraft mig machine that keeps tripping the breaker in my shop...


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## ShawnR (Feb 10, 2022)

I pulled the trigger on the Everlast (post #9) 

I guess I will be using the new welder lots in the next 30 days cause if there are any problems in the first 30 days, they pay shipping both ways. After that, the customer does. That is not so great but not enough of a deterrent.


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## Tom Kitta (Feb 10, 2022)

ShawnR said:


> I pulled the trigger on the Everlast (post #9)
> 
> I guess I will be using the new welder lots in the next 30 days cause if there are any problems in the first 30 days, they pay shipping both ways. After that, the customer does. That is not so great but not enough of a deterrent.



If you don't have issues in the first 30 days you should be good for next few years. Until some electronics die - depending on use it can be 5 years or 10 years. But I doubt my Everlast will last more then 15. Even not being used a lot and just sitting.


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## kevin.decelles (Feb 10, 2022)

My Longenvity multi-process is on year 14..... something probably just popped on it now that I said that.  I'd do the adventure again.


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## ShawnR (Feb 15, 2022)

Received the new Everlast yesterday. It was ordered on Thursday afternoon. Granted, shipping was my cost at $95 so I guess I paid for great delivery!  

I have not fired it up yet but so far, it looks good. I wanted to go get some tungsten and collets and opened the box to see what size they sent me. I was pleasantly surprised to find the Tig cable wrapped in a zippered cover, three collet sizes, three cups and both the standard and stubby caps for the torch.

Not much of an update but something to mull over. Got fridge issues today and the service guy is here so can't go play in the shop for a while.


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## DPittman (Feb 15, 2022)

ShawnR said:


> Got fridge issues today and the service guy is here so can't go play in the shop for a while.


Let me guess the fridge isn't more than 5 years old?


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## Susquatch (Feb 15, 2022)

DPittman said:


> Let me guess the fridge isn't more than 5 years old?



I'm guessing it's just overloaded with beer bottle cycles......


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## ShawnR (Feb 15, 2022)

About 7 years. Slow leak apparently. Supposed to be able to draw a vacuum to 50 (units?) and only goes to 30.  No obvious leaks so no idea where.  Tech was good. Honest. Said since it is not an apparent leak, it could be buried somewhere in the structure. Better to put the money into a new one. The display has been funky for years, typical LED's when the drivers get soft. Not worth repairing. Still cooling ok but not freezing. Spent the afternoon shopping, ....without management...seldom a good thing. 

Not much available in stock and only a few with guaranteed dates of delivery. And the sales people say the manufacturer might quote a date, then change it anyways. I think I found a good model, in town, discontinued so I am taking the floor model, but, $1050 off of list price. Gotta get it past the boss tonight...... 

Could be chilling cans of morale boosters tomorrow!


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## DPittman (Feb 15, 2022)

ShawnR said:


> About 7 years. Slow leak apparently. Supposed to be able to draw a vacuum to 50 (units?) and only goes to 30.  No obvious leaks so no idea where.  Tech was good. Honest. Said since it is not an apparent leak, it could be buried somewhere in the structure. Better to put the money into a new one. The display has been funky for years, typical LED's when the drivers get soft. Not worth repairing. Still cooling ok but not freezing. Spent the afternoon shopping, ....without management...seldom a good thing.
> 
> Not much available in stock and only a few with guaranteed dates of delivery. And the sales people say the manufacturer might quote a date, then change it anyways. I think I found a good model, in town, discontinued so I am taking the floor model, but, $1050 off of list price. Gotta get it past the boss tonight......
> 
> Could be chilling cans of morale boosters tomorrow!


It seems modern large appliances have gotten more bells and features, complexity and reliability has gone dramatically down.  I hear of more people with problems with their few year old appliances than what I think there should be.  I have a 65+ year old fridge in my basement that has NEVER missed a beat.  I also have a  deep freezer that is about 50 years old and it keeps going although I believe it had some sort of repair about 40 years ago.  I'm afraid of buying any new appliances.


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## ShawnR (Feb 15, 2022)

Yes, I agree @DPittman Couple people said today that 9 years is the expected life. Those old fridges used to run for decades! We just keep filling our landfills! 

(Insert rant here)


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## Chicken lights (Feb 15, 2022)

ShawnR said:


> Yes, I agree @DPittman Couple people said today that 9 years is the expected life. Those old fridges used to run for decades! We just keep filling our landfills!
> 
> (Insert rant here)


If they built them to last they couldn’t sell you another one. Kind of ironic but that has to be how the sales department looks at it. No more of the “good enough for my grandpa, I’ll get one too” type of sales strategy. 

But then again, my generation loves ikea-esque crap that isn’t designed to be moved more than once

Back to welders. How many farms had a Lincoln tombstone welder that never broke down?


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## DPittman (Feb 15, 2022)

Chicken lights said:


> If they built them to last they couldn’t sell you another one. Kind of ironic but that has to be how the sales department looks at it. No more of the “good enough for my grandpa, I’ll get one too” type of sales strategy.
> 
> But then again, my generation loves ikea-esque crap that isn’t designed to be moved more than once
> 
> Back to welders. How many farms had a Lincoln tombstone welder that never broke down?


Yup if they are still farming the welder is probably still there and still working. I know Mty brothers still have one (although they also have newer upgraded welders and probably never use the old one)


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## ShawnR (Feb 15, 2022)

I ran a few rods on the new welder. Pretty smooth arc. Not that I have a lot of diversity in my experience, but it is about the smoothest I have used for stick. Since I am a nerd, I actually started reading the manual...I know, sorry fellow men....but I found an excerpt on Tungsten that relates to Inverter type welders. Up to now, I have only used Red and Green banded and the manual states to not use Greens.  Coincidentally, I have used, broken, dipped, ground to a stub most of them anyways so not many left. 

Here is an excerpt from the page on tungstens. In short, I am going to explore blue banded. My last machine was a transformer so makes sense that the newer technology might affect the process. 

"......

For welding in AC and DC consider the following types.
• Lanthanated 2% (Blue Band). Overall this is one of the best choices for TIG welding and can be used for AC and DC weld-ing. It has great arc starting characteristics, and its point hold-ing capability is excellent.
• Ceriated 2% (Gray Band or Orange Band, depending upon brand and country of origin). This is a good choice for welding with both AC and DC, but doesn’t hold up as well.........
• Thoriated 2% (Red Band) Still considered the best for DC, works ok for AC, but has been banned in many markets outside the US due to a small radiation risk posed as an alpha emitter.
*Do not use the following types of Tungsten.*
• Pure Tungsten (Green Band). This will create arc instability. The tungsten will not stand up well to the more intense arc created by an inverter welder.
• Zirconiated Tungsten (White Band). This was created as an alternative for Pure Tungsten for Transformer


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## Degen (Feb 15, 2022)

Go Blue, I did my OCD research, Blue is the new RED.  Some rods are extremely good at one thing and suck at the rest.  Blue on the other hand does everything well and doesn't suck at anything.

Blue is a relatively new rod as far as development goes which is why it is not readily acknowledge.

Me I only have blue.


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## 6.5 Fan (Feb 16, 2022)

Never had a Lincoln but still have the pos Forney that my dad bought in 1953, the year they got power on the farm.


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## Degen (Feb 16, 2022)

As a new TIG welder the best advice I can give anyone wanting to learn tig is pick one setup and only change one thing, in the case of tig power setting (for material thickness).  This eliminates dealing with to many changes and trying to figure out which one is messing you up.

With tig you need left and right hand and foot coordination.

So at the beginning keep it simple, no pulse, use your foot, no fancy settings, use your foot.  The rest is just getting a feel of placement of torch and filler.

One last piece go about 5 to 10 (max) amps above just to give you a bit of overhead, that way full pedal gives you control without worry about too much heat.

Fancy features, come later, when (and if) you need them as mist welding can be done without them.

Its like learning to machining (or anything else), learn and master the basics, makes the advanced stuff easy.

AFTER THOUGHT  Tig is really easy because you have control, lots of it, what is hard is the three limb coordination required, knowing that you know whats required.


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## Susquatch (Feb 16, 2022)

6.5 Fan said:


> Never had a Lincoln but still have the pos Forney that my dad bought in 1953, the year they got power on the farm.



I remember when we got power on the home farm in Sask too. Even then it was just for a few things. We used oil lamps before and even after for years and years. Grandpa only wanted an electric light in the front room and in the yard so you didn't need a lantern going to the outhouse. Wasn't a big light like today but better than falling into one of the old outhouse pits......


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## Tom O (Feb 16, 2022)

Lol ah yes dragging the bucket out to the s*it pit sounds like the first place we rented we had electricity though as well as 8 acres to play on.


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## Susquatch (Feb 16, 2022)

Look how far we have come in our lifetime! Gone from laughter and talking to each other to TV and Video Games, coal oil lamps to electric lights, horse drawn cabooses to school buses, playing on 8 acres to video games and corner stores with weed, Sh-t pits to flush toilets. 

My wife got me a bidet for Xmas - I told her I didn't need it. Neighbours dog does a better job and the cleaning system is infinitely better than cold water. She gave it our middle son. He added robotics to it.


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## Janger (Feb 16, 2022)

DPittman said:


> It seems modern large appliances have gotten more bells and features, complexity and reliability has gone dramatically down.  I hear of more people with problems with their few year old appliances than what I think there should be.  I have a 65+ year old fridge in my basement that has NEVER missed a beat.  I also have a  deep freezer that is about 50 years old and it keeps going although I believe it had some sort of repair about 40 years ago.  I'm afraid of buying any new appliances.


Put an electric meter on that 65 year old fridge. One old fridge we owned of the almond side by side generation used 1800 kwhr/ year which is 1800 kwhr * $0.18 /kwhr (all in alberta price) = $324/year. The frigidaire we have now uses about 350 kwhr/year by the energuide label. I measured it and it really does. That's $63/year. It's 13 years old. No fancy features on it.


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## StevSmar (Feb 16, 2022)

Janger said:


> Put an electric meter on that 65 year old fridge... = $324/year.…The frigidaire we have now…That's $63/year…


Manitoba Hydro has lots of promotions for LED lights… the problem I have with the way they are promoted is that by using LED lights it means in winter I’ve got to burn more gas to make up for the reduction in electric heating that I would have got from incandescent bulbs…

(That’s really interesting how much difference there is between your old fridge and the “modern” one)


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## DPittman (Feb 16, 2022)

Janger said:


> Put an electric meter on that 65 year old fridge. One old fridge we owned of the almond side by side generation used 1800 kwhr/ year which is 1800 kwhr * $0.18 /kwhr (all in alberta price) = $324/year. The frigidaire we have now uses about 350 kwhr/year by the energuide label. I measured it and it really does. That's $63/year. It's 13 years old. No fancy features on it.


I haven't done that fridge but I did do the big old deep freezer a few years ago and although I don't recall the exact numbers it wasn't nearly as bad as I was expecting (comparing to newer ones).  I believe the modern fridges use a considerable portion of their energy in maintaining a frost free freezer compartment. My old girl doesn't have that feature either.

Environmentally I think I rather burn a bit more electricity with a less efficient old appliance that lasts 30+ years than have to throw out one every 8-10 years.


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## Degen (Feb 17, 2022)

I'll comment on shorter life span of products (and everything else), about 30-40 years ago there came a change in design concepts that was called Limits State Design (LSD).  Before I go further you need to understand prior to that we had a good idea of what was required for a component to stand up to the hardships of use, what we didn't yet have control over and fully understand was how to achieve material consistence, so we over designed by a factor of 2, 3, 5, 10.... to ensure we covered all possible shortcomings.  Along comes better testing, quality control and improvements in manufacturing and now we able to determine said part fails exactly here.  This brings into play the LSD concept. We are now designing to the limit of the part(s) with an over head of just in case of only 10% because we know the parts go to 15%.  This greatly reduces costs and weight further improving performance.

The only draw back with this system is critical parts are near their limits constantly, which as we all know, makes for excess wear and shortened life should anything just be slightly out of spec.  When failure happens 9 times out of 10 other components are near failure (just not yet failed), hence once the repairs start its not worth the effort to repair at all and becomes cheaper to replace (repair cost wise).

There you have it, we traded lower initial cost and efficiency for the shorter disposable wasteful life.


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## Tom Kitta (Feb 17, 2022)

Degen said:


> I'll comment on shorter life span of products (and everything else), about 30-40 years ago there came a change in design concepts that was called Limits State Design (LSD).  Before I go further you need to understand prior to that we had a good idea of what was required for a component to stand up to the hardships of use, what we didn't yet have control over and fully understand was how to achieve material consistence, so we over designed by a factor of 2, 3, 5, 10.... to ensure we covered all possible shortcomings.  Along comes better testing, quality control and improvements in manufacturing and now we able to determine said part fails exactly here.  This brings into play the LSD concept. We are now designing to the limit of the part(s) with an over head of just in case of only 10% because we know the parts go to 15%.  This greatly reduces costs and weight further improving performance.
> 
> The only draw back with this system is critical parts are near their limits constantly, which as we all know, makes for excess wear and shortened life should anything just be slightly out of spec.  When failure happens 9 times out of 10 other components are near failure (just not yet failed), hence once the repairs start its not worth the effort to repair at all and becomes cheaper to replace (repair cost wise).
> 
> There you have it, we traded lower initial cost and efficiency for the shorter disposable wasteful life.



We are also by far less green as a result, instead of repairing a long lasting product we constantly replace whole product. Even when it would make sense to repair there are barriers put in place & hence the "right to repair" movement. Given rather limited or none at all recycling you get rather nasty picture of the whole ordeal.


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## Degen (Feb 17, 2022)

Tom Kitta said:


> We are also by far less green as a result, instead of repairing a long lasting product we constantly replace whole product. Even when it would make sense to repair there are barriers put in place & hence the "right to repair" movement. Given rather limited or none at all recycling you get rather nasty picture of the whole ordeal.


Absolutely, didn't even want to go there.


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## ShawnR (Feb 17, 2022)

Pet Pieve! I have spent my life enjoying repairing things. First two careers were based on it. (Third one was based on those with no smoke alarms but that is another story) 

 Not being able to fix stuff is like denying a drug addict his fix! And the results fill the landfill.


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## Janger (Feb 17, 2022)

Degen said:


> Absolutely, didn't even want to go there.





Tom Kitta said:


> We are also by far less green as a result, instead of repairing a long lasting product we constantly replace whole product. Even when it would make sense to repair there are barriers put in place & hence the "right to repair" movement. Given rather limited or none at all recycling you get rather nasty picture of the whole ordeal.


True why don't things last longer - way longer. A fridge could go 100 years. How much more would things cost if they had an expected life of 50 or 100 years? As usual we are way off topic. 

I do have some everlast equipment - I've had a few issues with it and had them resolved. So pretty good. I'm not real happy with the dealer - they would not send a part they said was included with a torch I ordered from them. I ended up 3d printing a replacement.


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## DPittman (Feb 17, 2022)

Janger said:


> True why don't things last longer - way longer. A fridge could go 100 years. How much more would things cost if they had an expected life of 50 or 100 years? As usual we are way off topic.
> 
> I do have some everlast equipment - I've had a few issues with it and had them resolved. So pretty good. I'm not real happy with the dealer - they would not send a part they said was included with a torch I ordered from them. I ended up 3d printing a replacement.


I haven't researched them thoroughly but the bit I've read about the everlast line of stuff seems to be largely positive. I'll guess the brand name is a bit of an exaggeration though.


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## Janger (Feb 20, 2022)

StevSmar said:


> Manitoba Hydro has lots of promotions for LED lights… the problem I have with the way they are promoted is that by using LED lights it means in winter I’ve got to burn more gas to make up for the reduction in electric heating that I would have got from incandescent bulbs…
> 
> (That’s really interesting how much difference there is between your old fridge and the “modern” one)


I was really thinking about this - it's interesting @StevSmar. When you remove incandescent bulbs you have to replace the lost heat they provided - I think the answer is not what one would initially think. 

I found this chart from Manitoba hydro explaining annual heating costs for different technologies. 
https://www.hydro.mb.ca/your_home/heating_and_cooling/space_heating_costs.pdf 

Say the heating from regular bulbs costs $10. That is the same technology as radiant heaters which manitoba hydro says costs $1492 year to heat the whole home. Mid efficiency natural gas is $920/year. So natural gas costs this fraction 920/1492=62% compared to electric heat. Therefore the cost of replacing the $10 in regular bulb heating is $10*0.62=$6.20. That is $3.80 less than the heat from the bulbs. Then in the summer if you have AC it's also less - the $10 in heat from the bulbs does not have to be moved outside by the AC. So replacing the bulbs actually has another benefit besides the reduced lighting costs - the HVAC costs are also less.


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## Susquatch (Feb 20, 2022)

Janger said:


> I was really thinking about this - it's interesting @StevSmar. When you remove incandescent bulbs you have to replace the lost heat they provided - I think the answer is not what one would initially think.
> 
> I found this chart from Manitoba hydro explaining annual heating costs for different technologies.
> https://www.hydro.mb.ca/your_home/heating_and_cooling/space_heating_costs.pdf
> ...




This is all true. Around here, the family all knows that dad goes bonkers over lights left on in the summer but not in the winter. 

Gas heating is less in Ontario than electric. 

There is essentially zero difference between the different kinds of electric heating. A watt is a watt is a watt. However, there is a difference in perceived heating. Radiant heating feels warmer at a lower room temperature. So sometimes radiant heating is cheaper. Just not if it is controlled by a thermostat to the same temperature. 

But all in all, you are correct. High wattage lights are never a good thing, but they are not as bad in the winter as they are in summer. It's the lesser evil equation, not right or wrong. 

I'd guess the situation is much more obvious in oil country.


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## StevSmar (Feb 20, 2022)

Janger said:


> I was really thinking about this - it's interesting @StevSmar. When you remove incandescent bulbs you have to replace the lost heat they provided - I think the answer is not what one would initially think.


I also think about how gas heating is not carbon neutral. Manitoba Hydro is essentially a carbon neutral form of energy so does that make electricity a better choice than gas to heat with in Manitoba even though it’s (currently…) more expensive?

To muddy the water even more (unintended pun, but I’ll take it…) the electricity I use in winter could potentially be used to offset non-carbon neutral energy sources in the U.S., however if they’re not buying and the hydro dams are spilling water, then it’s being wasted, so I may as well use it…

One thing is certain, in summer use LED bulbs (or go to bed before the sun goes down). In winter it’s a much more difficult question…


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## Degen (Feb 20, 2022)

I hate to say electricity is not the answer as the infra structure is not in place to supply it.  Either in producing or transport.  Water generated electricity is no environmentally friendly because dams have a life span due mainly to silting.  Besides that they destroy large acreages of land for a long period.

Biggest thing to reduce world wide carbon foot print is small scale localized manufacturing, while produces slightly more carbon it greatly offsets transport carbon in moving raw materials to finished goods.


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## Susquatch (Feb 21, 2022)

I was going to say similar things. But I fear we would quickly degenerate into a very political discussion.

Suffice to say that making concrete for dams is extremely energy intensive. So is electric infrastructure.

We know what we know about what is green and what is not from advocates. They are often self serving.

In my mind, the only fair way to compare any technology is with a life cycle analysis - cradle to grave - all in. From mining to refining to manufacturing to transportation to usage to efficiency to infrastructure to recycling to disposal and every other nuance in between. On this basis, many otherwise attractive options are not so attractive after all. And even then, each situation is different - nothing is universal. We all like to "say they are better". But are they really? Do we really want to make a difference or do we just want to say that we do?

All this is just to say that it's all VERY complicated and VERY political.


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## Chicken lights (Feb 21, 2022)

Susquatch said:


> I was going to say similar things. But I fear we would quickly degenerate into a very political discussion.
> 
> Suffice to say that making concrete for dams is extremely energy intensive. So is electric infrastructure.
> 
> ...


Don’t quote me but I’m pretty sure there was a study/video done on the Prius. All of the parts being manufactured and shipped plus the mining for materials far outweighed the potential fuel savings. Plus there was no clear plan to recycle the battery bank.


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## Susquatch (Feb 21, 2022)

Chicken lights said:


> Don’t quote me but I’m pretty sure there was a study/video done on the Prius. All of the parts being manufactured and shipped plus the mining for materials far outweighed the potential fuel savings. Plus there was no clear plan to recycle the battery bank.



My biggest complaint is the government intervention in the marketplace. I understand incentives to help with a low volume test program. But we should not be doing that with high volume production to bias the market to do things that would not make sense otherwise. 

And if they are going to do it, I'd rather see it right on my tax return where it belongs. Ie a $2000 tax to help my next door neighbour afford his Tesla. I don't like subsidies period but if they are gunna do it I want it out in the open rather than hidden away in a shell game.


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## DPittman (Feb 21, 2022)

Ahhh!!!! I should have never commented about the refrigerator.  I'm sorry I will try to do better next time. Sometimes it's just too hard not to comment huh?


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## StevSmar (Aug 21, 2022)

ShawnR said:


> I ran a few rods on the new welder. Pretty smooth arc. Not that I have a lot of diversity in my experience, but it is about the smoothest I have used for stick. .....


How have you made out with your Everlast PowerTIG 200DV welder, are you still happy with it?

I’d love to get a better welder, though I should really exhaust the capabilities of my AC stick welder first.


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## ShawnR (Aug 27, 2022)

I am loving it. I have AC and DC tigged and stick welded with it. All seems good. The features are nice. I don't think my welds are better but it is nice to use nice equipment. So in a nutshell, no complaints so far.


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## StevSmar (Aug 28, 2022)

ShawnR said:


> I am loving it…


That’s great to hear. It looks like a great welder for a hobbyist.


ShawnR said:


> …I don't think my welds are better but it is nice to use nice equipmen…


No doubt I’ll be similar if/when I get another welder.

Thanks for responding to my question.


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## Degen (Aug 28, 2022)

ShawnR said:


> I am loving it. I have AC and DC tigged and stick welded with it. All seems good. The features are nice. I don't think my welds are better but it is nice to use nice equipment. So in a nutshell, no complaints so far.


Once you figure out your TIG settings and learn how to use the pedal, smiles abound!


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