# Some pictures of possible interest



## Brent H (Sep 3, 2021)

Hey folks!

We are in Pictou Nova Scotia at the ship yard and thought you might like to see a small lathe:





That little beauty has a 1 meter diameter chuck - I think it will fit in the basement - LOL

And here is a sweet old shaper:





The original owners of the yard up and left all the tools to the new comers - the plasma table is awesome - it will cut up to 4” thick plate.  I will grab some other pics if you are interested.


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## YYCHM (Sep 3, 2021)

More pics please  What are they doing to your ship?


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## Brent H (Sep 3, 2021)

We are in Dry Dock - re-machining the propeller hubs and checking the shafting, bearings etc.  Some paint and some fan/heater replacements

I will get some neat pics for you tomorrow Craig!


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## Tom O (Sep 3, 2021)

Nice extension on that shaper.


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## 6.5 Fan (Sep 3, 2021)

Great pics. You may have to reinforce the basement stairs a wee bit before shoving that baby in.


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## francist (Sep 3, 2021)

The full-size shovel for cleaning out the chip pan is a nice touch.


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## CalgaryPT (Sep 3, 2021)

Brent H said:


> We are in Dry Dock - re-machining the propeller hubs and checking the shafting, bearings etc.  Some paint and some fan/heater replacements
> 
> I will get some neat pics for you tomorrow Craig!


Brent, I was going to ask you what your opinion is of the drama on the SV Seeker YouTube channel? The DIY boatbuilder is apparently landlocked in a parking lot at the Tulsa Port of Catoosa because he can't get insurance for his boat he's been working on for ten years. Not sure if you followed it at all... Even Lloyds of London turned him down.


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## YYCHM (Sep 3, 2021)

CalgaryPT said:


> Brent, I was going to ask you what your opinion is of the drama on the SV Seeker YouTube channel? The DIY boatbuilder is apparently landlocked in a parking lot at the Tulsa Port of Catoosa because he can't get insurance for his DIY boat he's been working on for ten years. Not sure if you followed it at all... Even Lloyds of London turned him down.



Post a link please....


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## CalgaryPT (Sep 3, 2021)

The comment section is pretty interesting, particularly when you realize that his motto was "Safety Third," and he documented his lack of certifications for welding below the waterline, etc. I'm sure the insurance industry watched some of this.






Be nice to get an opinion from Brent as most of the comments coming from others on the channel are from people who have no real knowledge of this stuff.


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## Tom O (Sep 3, 2021)

I haven’t followed Sv seeker since he pulled that hoax with the explosion.
https://ktul.com/news/local/tulsa-boat-builders-extreme-prank-stirs-anger-and-support-online


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## CalgaryPT (Sep 3, 2021)

Tom O said:


> I haven’t followed Sv seeker since he pulled that hoax with the explosion.
> https://ktul.com/news/local/tulsa-boat-builders-extreme-prank-stirs-anger-and-support-online


Yeah, once you guys told me about that debacle, I stopped following him as well. Pretty disgusting.


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## CalgaryPT (Sep 3, 2021)

Sorry @Brent H - didn't mean to steal the thread. I should have started a new one.


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## Brent H (Sep 3, 2021)

@CalgaryPT : I think I stopped checking his progress after he tried to blow himself up or something to that effect?  

It would not be surprising that any insurance company would shy away - not sure why you would want to build a vessel on YouTube where the world can watch you cut corners, mess things up or worse….  While he was building he required the inspections of a “Class” inspector.  Big $$$.  Especially for the size of the vessel he built.  
For our ship, Lloyds was the class inspection society and all parts, steel, engines, shafting etc etc all the way down to the dresser drawers in my cabin all had to be Lloyd’s approved and drawings stamped accordingly- crazy!

In the past (pre 2000) things were a bit easier or perhaps companies just towed the line??? Typically during a build there would be a whole team of drafts people updating and providing accurate drawings - the inspection society would approve these and stamp as drawings passed regulations.  
The guy building his Seeker should have been wiser and, basically, had the ship building inspector visiting regularly.  Not a big fan of the “politics” but the rules are out there.  

@CalgaryPT : no worries on a thread steal - LOL - I will post some pics tomorrow- we have inspections up the arse.  That Seeker guy - idiot   - great to build his boat but ya gotta do it right - 10 years flushed …..hahaha


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## CalgaryPT (Sep 3, 2021)

Brent H said:


> @CalgaryPT : I think I stopped checking his progress after he tried to blow himself up or something to that effect?
> 
> It would not be surprising that any insurance company would shy away - not sure why you would want to build a vessel on YouTube where the world can watch you cut corners, mess things up or worse….  While he was building he required the inspections of a “Class” inspector.  Big $$$.  Especially for the size of the vessel he built.
> For our ship, Lloyds was the class inspection society and all parts, steel, engines, shafting etc etc all the way down to the dresser drawers in my cabin all had to be Lloyd’s approved and drawings stamped accordingly- crazy!
> ...


Knew I was asking the right person. Thanks Brent.

Kind of reminds me of the TV series "COAL" filmed in the Appalachian Mountains. Super interesting, but OSHA Inspectors watched it too and shut them down for numerous violations.

Look forward to more pics  I love that lathe...I bet @Dabbler could get it into your basement.


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## YYCHM (Sep 3, 2021)

So why does it have to be insured?


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## CalgaryPT (Sep 3, 2021)

YYCHM said:


> So why does it have to be insured?


If in sinks in port it blocks traffic and shuts down commerce. Just like the Evergreen in the Suez a few months back—millions of dollars of business at stake. That's the issue for now. There will be others if and when it makes it out to sea, not that different from car insurance on the high seas I expect.


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## YotaBota (Sep 3, 2021)

Nobody gonna walk away with that tailstock. lol


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## Brent H (Sep 3, 2021)

@YYCHM : there is the $$ from failure for business purposes as @CalgaryPT refers too, but there is also the safety and security issues that are also out there.  Theoretically the government of any country can just pay for mistakes - billions come in and, well, a federal vessel sank - ooops...pay out the cash.  Well, the inspection agency or "insurance" agency holds the builder and owner accountable for the vessel being constructed and  also after construction to maintain the vessel to established standards of safety for the people operating the vessel.  

The auto manufacturers build thousands of cars and trucks a day, but before they can, all the plans, build specs, options, components etc have to pass a certain inspection/insurance agency.  Stuff like CSA approved, crash test approved etc.  With a ship there are hundreds of regulations dictating construction requirements for the vessel type, Certifications levels for the crew, safety equipment required, size of life rafts etc etc .  For our ship we have an annual safety inspection, monthly safety equipment inspections and we have annual equipment inspections, 5 year inspections, 10 year inspections  as well as we are required to come out of the water 2 x in a 5 year period to have other inspections.  We have tank inspections, piping inspections, life boat inspections, all the navigational equipment and it goes on and on - ladder inspections, fall arrest.......all the way down to a bearing in a fan....someone needs to know. 

So the insurance is for really "me" to make sure I will be safe - driven crazy nuts with inspections - but safe nuts...hahahahaha


If that dude building the Seeker thing took anyone on his wee crap and it sank...holy moly......free to sue his estate into the next millennium!   It would be like you building your own road car and just selling it to people or driving around town - total s!@#$t show.

The environment is now a huge issue as well - build something full of oil and it sinks......OMG


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## Brent H (Sep 3, 2021)

@CalgaryPT : watched the video link you posted: that guy is a ...............................................................................................(.lots of bad foul sailor language) and a complete .................ard!  no way would I even touch that scow with someone else's 10 foot pole........seriously want insurance to put an uninspected vessel in the water  without stability calculations, no electrical, hydraulics etc etc  HAHAHAHAHAHA


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## YYCHM (Sep 3, 2021)

Nope.... I'm not following.  What defines a vessel v.s. my power boat that I use by myself for my own purposes (not commercial in any way)?  Insurance required?  I realize that if I damage someone else's property or person I might be liable for that.  There must be a defining line here with respect to requiring insurance on the open seas?


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## Dabbler (Sep 3, 2021)

I watched a few videos of the guy building that 'Seeker' boat:  NOPE.  nope, nope nope...  He's going to get himself killed or one of his volunteers badly hurt.  It looks like his goal isn't a seaworthy vessel, but a profitable youtube experience 'about' building a boat.

I'm no expert, but for the things I know, he performs very badly.


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## Dabbler (Sep 3, 2021)

arg!  Now that I clicked on the link above (to be sure we were talking about the same guy), now my youtube suggestions are flooded with SV Seeker links...   I _despise _the eye-in-the-sky Google and affiliate linking!


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## Brent H (Sep 4, 2021)

@YYCHM : refer to this : https://tc.canada.ca/en/marine-transportation/marine-safety/construction-requirements

You can build your own boat and drive it around etc., however, should you sink and drown or explode or drive it into someone else chances are your life insurance will be void, lawyers would have a field day suing you and your estate …..


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## Brent H (Sep 4, 2021)

Here are some other pics - check out the size of CNC plasma/submerged arc cut table:





Here is some of the plate that was cut:





And the business end:





That torch is about 3” in diameter.

There is also a 5 position pipe cutter:





Here is a shot of our tail shafts sitting on some rollers:





And one of our rudders:





The tail shafts are about 10 ton each.





Above is the rudder stock.  It is about 5 ton. (We have 2) 

I found the following poor table in the back. (Don’t cry @RobinHood)  the certificate says it was originally a grade “A” certified true slab.  




and here is the ship with its grain elevator style scaffolding covering the main mast for paint work.


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## RobinHood (Sep 4, 2021)

Nice pictures @Brent H . Ships are just in a whole other league of machine size, aren’t they?




Brent H said:


> I found the following poor table in the back. (Don’t cry @RobinHood) the certificate says it was originally a grade “A” certified true slab.



You should see if you can take it with you when you leave. I’m sure there is room for it somewhere. Bring it up the St.Lawrence into the Great Lakes and off load it somewhere close to your shop. Follow Robin Renzetti’s lead and turn it into a AA grade plate with a bunch of elbow grease…


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## 6.5 Fan (Sep 4, 2021)

Keep the pics coming, love seeing the large equipment.


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## Brent H (Sep 4, 2021)

I will snap a few more tomorrow of the giant plate roller, the punch presses and the shear and bender.

This place used to do pipe - probably for Hibernia or such so they have quite a few weld positioning tables for chucking and rotating pipe.   Also a couple vertical mills and horizontal mills, 4 or 5 more lathes and a couple huge radial arm drills.  All the stuff was left to whoever became the new tenant.


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## YYCHM (Sep 5, 2021)

So.... is linking up with your ship an out of pocket expense or covered?

Seen anything showing significate wear during this inspection?


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## Brent H (Sep 5, 2021)

@YYCHM : getting to the ship is on my dime if the ship is in the port where they moved my personal employment #  but is on the Coast Guard dime if the ship is in its own home port or any other location - other than where they decided to move my employee number.  It is a weird situation and affects me only at odd times a year ....very difficult to really explain and a source of a lot of stress so we sorta just leave that one alone.  For me to get to the east coast - that is on their dime or I would not bother going - I could make more money making donuts than pay for all the flights and travel etc.........probably why the marine industry has a difficult time getting people.

So far wear items are all looking pretty good.  We will be doing some significant machining on a few parts coming up so I hope to capture that for you guys  to take a look at - should be very interesting.  I have a few more pics I will upload tomorrow.  Should be able to see a few mills that will not fit in anyone's basement - I will snap a pick of a Gantry Crane that @Dabbler would love - probably no space for, but it is big ass.....


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## Brent H (Sep 6, 2021)

giant plate roller will do up to 2-1/2” plate





A small punch press.  Good for 100 tons 





how would you like to chuck this 3-1/2” MT 6 into your tailstock and make a few chips!





A Couple radial arm drill presses





And a vertical mill !


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## John Conroy (Sep 6, 2021)

The motto there must be "go big or stay home". I'm not sure I could lift that drill bit.LoL


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## Brent H (Sep 6, 2021)

To help lift the drill we have a small gantry crane.  @Dabbler might be able to use a 32 foot high lift?





There are 4 beam crane in the building with each one rated for 20 ton and a combined max of 45 ton.  Not too shabby.












I am hoping to get to the big machine shop next week …..


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## YYCHM (Sep 6, 2021)

Brent H said:


> I am hoping to get to the big machine shop next week …..



Ha.... that should be good.  Is there going to be a lathe with an operators station on the saddle?


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## Brent H (Sep 6, 2021)

@YYCHM : not sure, probably not - I am hoping they have a couple horizontal mills/boring machines and perhaps a bad ass CNC that can machine the blade carriers (about 650 mm diameter). They are a copper/nickel/aluminum alloy - very gold looking.  Will be fun to see shaving and coolant going all over the place.


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## Dabbler (Sep 6, 2021)

nice pictures @Brent H   That gantry crane is a beast!


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## Brent H (Sep 7, 2021)

Here is a rudder pic with one of the guys standing in front of it so you can get a perspective on the size.  





There are void spaces inside the rudder that make it near impossible to ensure the rudders do not rust from the inside out.  To prevent corrosion, a slimy oil like substance is pumped into the bottom of the rudder and then water is slowly pumped in.  The water “floats” the coating as it rises and once you get coating coming out the top you stop. The water is slowly drained and the coating sticks to the sides and frames in the rudder or void space.  The coating is like car undercoating but a bit more “snotty”.


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## YYCHM (Sep 12, 2021)

How long will your ship be in dry dock?


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## Brent H (Sep 12, 2021)

Hey Craig, should be out here (me) for 2 more weeks (ish).......just cooking up some Lobsters and such for dinner.....life is good 

Live lobster: $14/Lb in case you were wondering


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## YYCHM (Sep 12, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Hey Craig, should be out here (me) for 2 more weeks (ish).......just cooking up some Lobsters and such for dinner.....life is good
> 
> Live lobster: $14/Lb in case you were wondering



I wish..... That's not fair to tease like that


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## Brent H (Sep 12, 2021)




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## YYCHM (Sep 12, 2021)

Are you living on the ship while it's dry docked?


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## Brent H (Sep 12, 2021)

No Craig- too many safety issues, no services (like ventilation, toilets, water etc.). Total shut down for work on systems.  We are at a 4 room flat with Batchelor pads.  In the maritimes they do something’s pretty nice - I have lucked in and my Engineers are spot on chefs


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## Susquatch (Sep 13, 2021)

I don't remember exactly where you are. On a few of my trips to Nova Scotia, I had the joy of fresh lobster on the beach right off the boat. Sometimes the boats would catch too much and had to dump it or sell direct to avoid fines. You started a barrel boiling and the boats would come to you. It was a meal to die for. 

Also had all-you-can-eat steamed mussels in Halifax, and sea food chowders in Newfoundland that were out of this world.


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## Brent H (Sep 13, 2021)

@Susquatch : yes by’ those were the days!  We are enjoying the mussels steamed in beer and spices - so much cheaper than our province.  Fish is decent price as are scallops.  Gotta getter in ya while you can!
Not much would be free or really cheap these days.  A lot of the smaller places relied on tourism for the summer dollars.  This area has many pubs and eateries closed and for sale, prices are not that economical for “going out” to dinner.  A large craft draft will cost you $10 with tip and most burger platters are north of $15, some over $20.  Throw in sea food and “boom”! A couple drinks, plate of food and you are over $50 plus tip for one person, if you’re fine dinning you are up around $75 each. 

One cool spot, if anyone is in St John’s New Brunswick is a place called Steamers.  Great food!  The lobster dinner for two is now $79 and includes Lobster, chowder, mussels and a cob of corn.  It was $49 in 2002.  

I am hoping for some machining pics on Wednesday.  Right now it’s all sand blasting and painting.


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## Susquatch (Sep 13, 2021)

Brent H said:


> @Susquatch : yes by’ those were the days!  We are enjoying the mussels steamed in beer and spices - so much cheaper than our province.  Fish is decent price as are scallops.  Gotta getter in ya while you can!
> Not much would be free or really cheap these days.  A lot of the smaller places relied on tourism for the summer dollars.  This area has many pubs and eateries closed and for sale, prices are not that economical for “going out” to dinner.  A large craft draft will cost you $10 with tip and most burger platters are north of $15, some over $20.  Throw in sea food and “boom”! A couple drinks, plate of food and you are over $50 plus tip for one person, if you’re fine dinning you are up around $75 each.
> 
> One cool spot, if anyone is in St John’s New Brunswick is a place called Steamers.  Great food!  The lobster dinner for two is now $79 and includes Lobster, chowder, mussels and a cob of corn.  It was $49 in 2002.
> ...



Scary really. Inflation is running amok. Next is interest rates. Best to keep my political opinions to myself though....... Anyone who is interested in knowing how I really feel can PM me.


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## YotaBota (Sep 13, 2021)

And a loaf of fresh out of the oven whole wheat sourdough bread,,,, tasty.


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## Tom O (Sep 13, 2021)

Susquatch said:


> Scary really. Inflation is running amok. Next is interest rates. Best to keep my political opinions to myself though....... Anyone who is interested in knowing how I really feel can PM me.


Lol even Trudeau is saying PM me!


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## Susquatch (Sep 13, 2021)

Tom O said:


> Lol even Trudeau is saying PM me!



Hahaha.....


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## Mcgyver (Sep 14, 2021)

great photos - thanks!


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## Dusty (Sep 20, 2021)

Is your rusty old tin can still in dry dock, so where are you now? Oh to chow down on a feast of really fresh sea food along with a pint or 2 of grandpa's favorite suds. 

Sounds so good I'm drooling, lucky you!  LOL


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## Brent H (Sep 20, 2021)

Haha!  
Hey Bill, sounds like you have some energy in you again!  Glad to hear you are on the mend!!  
The “bucket” is still high and dry in Pictou NS !  Should be about 4 more weeks (ish).  
Tonight I think is burgers - LOL. 

I will post some machining pics tomorrow


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## Dusty (Sep 20, 2021)

Hey Brent, yes my life is slowly turning for the better although therapy goes slow.

Last time I had a fresh maritime seafood plate was 35 years ago at the 5 Fisherman restaurant in Halifax, NS. Could barely finish that in front of me, perhaps it was the Schooner beer(s).  LOL 

https://www.fivefishermen.com/


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## Tom O (Sep 20, 2021)

MMMMMM Lobster!  
Please send me a beer fridge packed with Lobster and ice.


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## Dusty (Sep 20, 2021)

Tom O said:


> MMMMMM Lobster!
> Please send me a beer fridge packed with Lobster and ice.



Wouldn't that be a Christmas present to remember.  The secret to a fine meal of any seafood is in the cooking.  Just saying!


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## Brent H (Sep 20, 2021)

Hahaha Bill - @Dusty - Alfredo Winestien and Ho, the Graduate, the 5 Fishermen, the Split Crow, Peddlers ….. ah yes…. Upper Deck, Lower Deck…My youth-  hahaha


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## YYCHM (Sep 20, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Hahaha Bill - @Dusty - Alfredo Winestien and Ho, the Graduate, the 5 Fishermen, the Split Crow, Peddlers ….. ah yes…. Upper Deck, Lower Deck…My youth-  hahaha



Are those all bars in Halifax?


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## Dusty (Sep 20, 2021)

YYCHM said:


> Are those all bars in Halifax?



Where else would sailors hang out? Devil made me say it. LOL


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## Brent H (Sep 20, 2021)

@YYCHM - that is but a few- we could adventure to George Street in St John’s Newfoundland- visited very very many - LOL - any place you can tie a ship up - LOL.  Lots of pubs in BC as well - I guess all the way up to the Arctic - I could even pull a few names out from Calgary and Edmonton- may take a few checks on the map!  Hahaha


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## Tom O (Sep 20, 2021)

Good thing Liberace passed he knew “ what to do with a drunken Sailor! “


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## Dusty (Sep 21, 2021)

Tom O said:


> Good thing Liberace passed he knew “ what to do with a drunken Sailor! “
> View attachment 17180


You're a very naughty boy, just saying!  LOL


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## Brent H (Sep 21, 2021)

Blade getting set up for some clean up on the bottom of the palm - need to take off about 0.004"






Machining the hub section of the propeller.  Manufacturer says it was out of spec.  It measured only about 0.0008" out of round - yes 8/10ths on a seriously huge chunk of CUNIAL (Copper Nickle Aluminum) alloy.






A very nice surface finish!






These are the blade "carriers" and essentially will rotate with the blades to increase or decrease the pitch.  By doing so the ship can go ahead or astern.  Same principal as that used on air craft : CPP or controllable pitch propeller.

Pretty nice large mills and lathes.

CNC:


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## ShawnR (Sep 21, 2021)

Nice thread @Brent H . The scale of that place is amazing!

We visited the East coast a few years ago. Loved it. Been drinking Alexander Keith's ever since, after touring the brewery,  lol

Cheers, 

Shawn


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Machining the hub section of the propeller. Manufacturer says it was out of spec. It measured only about 0.0008" out of round - yes 8/10ths on a seriously huge chunk of CUNIAL (Copper Nickle Aluminum) alloy.



Holy cow @Brent H !!!  Although the precision is truly impressive, I can't help but think there is something wrong with anything that big having tolerances that tight. I don't know squatt about it, but it just doesn't square in my tiny little brain.  Water temp variations are not zero - especially for an ice breaker - so I'm thinking the temp expansion alone for such a big part would blow that number out of the water. In fact, is the number a spec for a certain temperature? Then add strain...... It's not a static component! That thing sees several thousand HP. If I were you it would drive me crazy wondering and worrying about stuff like that. Maybe it's a good thing that I don't know squatt..... 

And why the exotic alloy? Are all big ships built like that?


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## historicalarms (Sep 21, 2021)

I was having trouble with the photo of that big collar as well but for a different reason....scarf/cuttings appear to be much courser than a .0008 cut would produce.


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## Brent H (Sep 21, 2021)

Hey @Susquatch, you are correct with your concerns regarding the tight tolerances.  It is pretty crazy.  I had a big fight with the manufacturer many years ago about the tolerances and what were the actual "wear limits" as 8/10ths over 38 years on a blade/hub assembly that beats the shite out of itself in ice is trivial.  The reply was along the lines that I knew jack about machining and tolerances and that I should be "happy" the assembly lasted 35 years.  I asked for the original measurements of our assembly - evidently they lost this data or they are hiding behind proprietary copy write laws etc.  I call the work on the hubs (although pretty cool) a big money grab.

The CUNIAL material is specifically designed for ice breaking purposes.  Strength and ductility I would say.  Prop hubs differ in materials from ship to ship depending on application - Stainless, cast steel, different alloys for different applications.


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Hey @Susquatch, you are correct with your concerns regarding the tight tolerances.  It is pretty crazy.  I had a big fight with the manufacturer many years ago about the tolerances and what were the actual "wear limits" as 8/10ths over 38 years on a blade/hub assembly that beats the shite out of itself in ice is trivial.  The reply was along the lines that I knew jack about machining and tolerances and that I should be "happy" the assembly lasted 35 years.  I asked for the original measurements of our assembly - evidently they lost this data or they are hiding behind proprietary copy write laws etc.  I call the work on the hubs (although pretty cool) a big money grab.
> 
> The CUNIAL material is specifically designed for ice breaking purposes.  Strength and ductility I would say.  Prop hubs differ in materials from ship to ship depending on application - Stainless, cast steel, different alloys for different applications.



That's funny! I was actually gunna suggest a money grab but didn't want to risk offending you. 

With big huge bills like that - especially partially funded by tax dollars, the markups always look reasonable to pass audit. But a 10% markup on $100 is 10x the markup on $10.  So they bake up the base to pad their markup pockets! Accountants and bureaucrats don't challenge technical details. Yup, it smells like a money grab..... 

Two decades ago, I served as an external member of a building committee for a new building at the local university. The base cost plus quotes were mind boggling. You should have seen the various contractors faces when they saw me sitting at the bid table. It's impossible to explain away millions of tax dollar gouging. Chewing on boot rubber really sucks.... 

But I doubt it's even possible to have an industry rep on a new ship purchase contract review......


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## RobinHood (Sep 21, 2021)

How did they measure the out of round? On a CMM?

I know propeller hubs on aircraft have very tight tolerances. They are nowhere near the size of yours though.


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

RobinHood said:


> How did they measure the out of round? On a CMM?
> 
> I know propeller hubs on aircraft have very tight tolerances. They are nowhere near the size of yours though.



The CEO of Pratt & Whitney tried to embarrass me at a conference we both spoke at by comparing the extreme quality of a jumbo jet airplane to a crummy automobile.  Bad move. I didn't choose to embarrass him back about sloppy seats, cheap table trays that sit at 45 degrees, or carpets that look like a 5$ motel room. Instead, I just pointed out that nobody would ever buy a car if they all started at 5 million.

But ya, to your point, an airplane engine is a different beast for sure. You can't pull over and call CAA when it stalls. Even so, there are many car parts that have extremely tight tolerances too. But it's almost never in big parts - only tiny ones.


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## Brent H (Sep 21, 2021)

@RobinHood : the original measurements were done in a pigeon infested warehouse that was open to the weather by an alcoholic that was soon to be fired by the company using an inside mic calibrated to a large outside micrometer.  Just the changing weather over the course of the day would be enough to change everything, not to mention the active shite bombs from the nesting birds taking offence to the techniques being used.  I suggested the measuring be completed at a certified, controlled shop....but ya see...I know jack.....

The way things are going we are being caught up in the inspections being based on OEM recommendations.    Those can either be decent or they can be terrible and expensive.

On this one I just have to accept it before it destroys me as the fight is now a moot point (they have been machined)  Frustrating but I may get a chunk of CUNIAL to make something neat out of


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Machining the hub section of the propeller. Manufacturer says it was out of spec. It measured only about 0.0008" out of round - yes 8/10ths on a seriously huge chunk of CUNIAL (Copper Nickle Aluminum) alloy.



What are we looking at here @Brent H ? Looks to me like we are looking through the mounting hole for one blade through to the mounting hole for another blade. So I assume the hub we are looking at rotates with the drive shaft and the blades all rotate on those openings to change pitch.

If so, what actuates the pitch change? Do the Blades rotate pitch individually to provide differential (collective) thrust like a helicopter hub or do they all change together with thrust changing from prop assembly to assembly (port and starboard props)?

And while I'm asking dumb questions, does that lady of yours have through hull thrusters and/or underwater stabilizer wings?

If it has wings, do the pigeons identify at all?


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

Another dumb question. 

Did those brain dead inspectors also dictate truing of the matching prop plates? And doesn't that all collectively increase clearance between the parts? Or is the precision all in the face?


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

Btw, there is no such thing as a professional career that doesn't have to deal with idiots from time-to-time. Your career choice still looks like a very rewarding one to me.


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## YYCHM (Sep 21, 2021)

@Susquatch check this out https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.c...ation-from-the-home-built-gantry-thread.3226/

And this.... https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.com/threads/home-built-gantry-cranes.3172/page-2#post-41831


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## YotaBota (Sep 21, 2021)

Brent - thanks for the pics, all the machines are interesting. What rpm do the props turn and what is the diameter?


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

YYCHM said:


> @Susquatch check this out https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.c...ation-from-the-home-built-gantry-thread.3226/
> 
> And this.... https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.com/threads/home-built-gantry-cranes.3172/page-2#post-41831



Thanks for the reference!


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

This is AWESOME stuff! I thought touring a commercial fishing boat in Lake Erie was fun! We should all charter a plane from Vancouver to the east coast stopping at every machine shop in between so we could all go visit Brent, tour the facility, render dumb opinions, learn a lot, be entertained, embarrass Brent silly, and fill our belly with fresh seafood for a week.


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## Brent H (Sep 21, 2021)

@Susquatch



> What are we looking at here @Brent H ? Looks to me like we are looking through the mounting hole for one blade through to the mounting hole for another blade. So I assume the hub we are looking at rotates with the drive shaft and the blades all rotate on those openings to change pitch.



Yes, there is a large piston that is moved hydraulically back and forth. Off set pins are fitted with slipper blocks.  These blocks slide back and forth in the blade carriers (the round parts with the 2 pins in the pics) and those rotate through 31.5 degrees ahead and 28 degrees astern.

The Ship has a bow thruster and stern thruster - both are a tunnel type thruster (picture a fan in a tube that can blow either side of the ship).  The bow is 600 hp and the stern is 400 hp.  

The clearances are in the fit between the blade carriers and the big hub holes - 2 o-rings seal the assembly.  The blades are bolted to the carrier and sealed to the face of the hub with a super large viton o ring about 12 mm in diameter.  there are 10 x M72 bolts to holt each blade on and those are sealed to the blade palm with dubo rings (X profile o rings).

The clearances in question were the fit of the hub hole to the round blade carrier.  The new carriers all came oversized and were then machined to the fit in reference to the re-machined faces of the hub.  I am hoping to get those measurements as machining to 0.005mm is pretty darn tricky.

Each prop is driven through a reduction gear box that is powered by either one or two engines.  In 2 engine mode the shaft can rotate at a max RPM of 210 and see's roughly 4400 Hp.  The props assembled are 4 blades and roughly 10 feet in diameter.  Each blade is 1250 Kg with the assembled hub being about 8 tons.


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

Brent H said:


> @Susquatch
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Gotcha!   Yup, I really need to go and lay an eyeball on all that! Very cool @Brent H !!! Very very cool!


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## Brent H (Sep 21, 2021)

Here is the hub Assembled on the shaft.  Hopefully you can sorta see how it goes.  The open space in the middle is the centre of the yoke that turns the blades and you can see the oil feed pipe in the middle.  On the back side is a feed pipe that allows fluid to push the yoke out.  The centre pipe you can see will allow oil out and back to the system. The pipe also acts as a feed back to the controls and will close the hydraulic supply when the desired pitch is met.  







the above picture is the end cap and has an integral piston that fits into the yoke - you can see the piston ring at the top end.


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## Susquatch (Sep 21, 2021)

I still don't see any reason why such close tolerances are required..... 

Also, I noticed earlier that the Blades seem to be oppositely loaded on both sides of their radial axis. I presume that's to reduce the power requirements of the variable pitch system. If so, does that Hydraulic piston really need to be that big? Regardless, I bet it moves those Blades like yesterday! 

I was a guest on a naval frigate 20 years ago doing battle exercises in Lake Huron. I was amazed at how fast that ship went from full ahead to full astern! Those props of yours explain a lot! No need to stop and reverse engines...... Just keep the power full up and reverse the pitch! Gotta wonder what cavitation does to those huge Blades under those conditions!


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## Brent H (Sep 22, 2021)

@Susquatch : the hubs and components are particularly large for the ice breaking requirements of the vessel and also the response time for the propeller - as you mentioned full ahead to full astern.

The props can rotate through the full say 60 degrees in roughly 12 seconds regardless of the loading or shaft speed.  Given that the design of the ship is in the off shore tug category we are designed to push and pull oil rigs, set anchors and we even had a large foam induction fire fighting system that could drop 600 cubic meters a hour on an oil rig (this was removed in 2016 as it was not used and suffering maintenance issues)

With 4 engines running we do 14.7 knots ahead (27 KM/hr).  In heavy ice 3 feet thick we are supposed to do at least 3 knots - however, depending on the ice density we usually clip along at 6 to 8 knots.   We were busting up to 52 inches in Superior with only 3 engines a few years ago.

The blades are pretty much impervious to cavitation, we are still on the same set after close to 10 years service without the need to recondition.  That means we haven't hit anything hard like dead heads, rocks, submerged buoys etc that would tear blade chunks out.  Our last issue with that was sucking in a 4" hawser with a big shackle still attached some Laker dumped in the harbour.  We chewed that up pretty good.  The props are fitted with a Kort Nozzle - that is a mini tunnel to direct thrust that would be lost off the blade tips.  The nozzle is fitted with an annular band of stainless welding that prevents cavitation damage of the nozzle steel.






You can see in the above picture the anti-cavitation band, some blade damage and the ground up shackle.  Divers cut it out with an underwater lance - sort of the same principle as a gouging rod on land.


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## Susquatch (Sep 22, 2021)

Very very cool @Brent H !  Much appreciated! Keep it coming. I have thoroughly enjoyed everything you have provided. It's a glimpse into another world for me from the very viewpoint that I enjoy and appreciate the most!


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## YYCHM (Sep 22, 2021)

@Susquatch Another one of Brent's posts with some interesting info.... https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.com/threads/this-is-where-we-are-today.2901/#post-37071

Some where someone posted a video tour of Brent's sister ship, but I can't seem to find it now.


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## Brent H (Sep 22, 2021)

Thank you @Susquatch and @YYCHM for the support and kind words. I am in my “working for the man” time of lasts - this will be my last Dry Dock so might as well show you guys a different perspective.
33 years ago I was like - WOW!! …. So much information and training etc so glad you appreciate some of the cool things!!

I will try to throw as much out there as I can !!


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## Susquatch (Sep 22, 2021)

No sweat, loving it! 

Are you retiring?


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## Brent H (Sep 22, 2021)

Hopefully this time next year


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## Susquatch (Sep 22, 2021)

YYCHM said:


> @Susquatch Another one of Brent's posts with some interesting info.... https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.com/threads/this-is-where-we-are-today.2901/#post-37071
> 
> Some where someone posted a video tour of Brent's sister ship, but I can't seem to find it now.



Thanks Craig! I enjoyed that thread too!


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## YYCHM (Sep 22, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Hopefully this time next year



Hey Brent, are you advertising your kitchen remodeling / wood working business on-line?


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## Brent H (Sep 22, 2021)

@YYCHM - LOL _not at this time.  Already booked for a while.  Word of mouth is pretty crazy and if you throw in the steel work.....Also just got a request to build another house next year (third one) ....crazy....retirement may not be quite that ....hahaha

If postal service wasn't so expensive in Canada.......................


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## Brent H (Sep 27, 2021)

So for the guys who like the heavy and awkward lifts: this is a pic of our tail shaft going in without the blades on.  Somewhere around 14000 lbs.


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## Susquatch (Sep 27, 2021)

Amazing @Brent H !  My head hurts picturing those straps holding 7000 pounds. Love the leveling chain fall on the one strap. How is it moved side to side?


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## YotaBota (Sep 27, 2021)

Great pics Brent.


Susquatch said:


> How is it moved side to side?


And then there is re-rigging to get the shaft all the way home, is that what all the chain falls hanging from the hull are for? How is the shaft being supported and moved inside the ship?
Last question - how long, time wise, is the process to reinstall the shaft?


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## YYCHM (Sep 27, 2021)

@Brent H must be very close to crew change time for you?


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## Brent H (Sep 27, 2021)

If you look beside the head of the guy standing o the cribbing you will see a small square box.  This is a digital protractor and he is setting he shaft angle to match the angle the stern tube is at.  He adjusts using the chain falls that @Susquatch mentioned.   The crane then swings things in as far as possible and other chain falls are applied for support and for pulling the shaft in.  The stern tube bearing is slathered in soap and the shaft is inched along until the forward sleeve bearing is resting in the stern tube bearing.  After that load is picked up on the other chain falls and the crane is out.  Things then are warped along using the chain falls and straps.  Takes about 4 hours to move things along.  Normally the blades are on and the shaft can be inserted all the way, however, you need to take care to install all the seal parts inside and the coupling parts as well.  The coupling is an SKF type that works : https://www.skf.com/ca/en/products/power-transmission/couplings/ok-couplings

Once the shaft is in position they cut off the lugs that have been welded to the hull for the lifting purposes.  They will get ripped off during ice breaking so better to remove now. - each lug is certified and welded on by a certified welder.


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## Brent H (Sep 27, 2021)

Home a jiggity on Wednesday  - Lobster is $16 at the airport so.........


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## YYCHM (Sep 27, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Home a jiggity on Wednesday  - Lobster is $16 at the airport so.........



When I worked on the arctic drilling rigs, we were two weeks in, one week out.  Getting to site was an all day affair as was coming out.  5am AirBus to EDM (on my dime, it was like $80 one way back then), then company Electra (Ya Electra) 5 hr fight to Melville Island, then wait around for a twin otter flight to your destination rig.  You changed out with a night shift guy so guess what you did for the next 12 hours when you arrived.  It was brutal.  The schedule didn't change if you got weathered out either which delayed crew changes up to 3 days, so sometimes you came home and turned around almost the very next day.

Send some of that $16 Lobster my way please


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## eotrfish (Sep 27, 2021)

Not wanting to hijack this thread but I couldn’t resist…

The good old days


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## YYCHM (Sep 27, 2021)

eotrfish said:


> Not wanting to hijack this thread but I couldn’t resist…
> 
> The good old days
> View attachment 17334



You nailed her  Was at Bent Horn for the longest time, then others.  What were you doing up there?


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## Brent H (Sep 27, 2021)

2 week on and One week off would pretty much shut down shipping at this point.  LOL.  Most trade jobs pay at least as good or better than mine - the home time is the deal or no deal (at least for me)


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## YYCHM (Sep 27, 2021)

Brent H said:


> 2 week on and One week off would pretty much shut down shipping at this point.  LOL.  Most trade jobs pay at least as good or better than mine - the home time is the deal or no deal (at least for me)



As in shutdown the shipping lanes or shutdown your interest in the job?


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## Brent H (Sep 27, 2021)

@YYCHM : I don't think there would be many people wanting to do a 2 week for 1 week off trade at this time in the marine industry (maybe a ferry run in your home town?).  Most shipping companies are pretty much equal time on/off basis just to keep some interest in the job.  check this:

A marine manufacturing/repair company bills out their Technical Reps at about $250/hour plus overtime and living expenses.  The customer has to pay all of this $$ and, due to constraints placed on the ship owner by insurance and certification societies, you have to have a company rep on site.

For a typical job in dry dock we will have about 4 to 5 of these "tech's" doing different things and inspecting things.  They present a report and the vessel passes certification.

At the end of the day the ship owner forks out about $400K for these reports and services to get the approvals in order to go back sailing - this does not include the cost of anything else, just those 5 people's time over an 8 week period.

So in 8 weeks you are forking out $50K a week or $200K in a month.  The tech guy might make about 14 to 16K/ month and I might make 10K in the month. I have to do the following:  Train the people on our equipment, supervise them and approve or not approve their work, sign legal documentation regarding the work performed, including their pay sheets and at the end of their work and things are signed off - I take full responsibility for the work they performed and under the Canada Shipping Act I can be found liable and criminally charged for any subsequent pollution, injury or death as a result of their work.

So at the end of the day, if the time off is not there why bother?  I have the certification to do all the work these technicians are doing, maybe even more in some cases  *BUT *those guys have to travel all over, time off is more rare and they need to fund retirement.  The time off is HUGE 

Shipping companies right now face a huge shortage of certified workers - it is like over 10000 officer positions are open all over the globe and the rate is growing.  Industry has pushed for unmanned engine rooms, lower certification requirements and many other changes that all make the job very challenging to staff.  Not taking into account the mental fitness (or lack there of) a person needs to go away for extended periods of time, isolated on a ship, sea sickness etc etc...  

My job has been super interesting and I have been all over Canada, learned a bag load of things in all different disciplines - awesome!!  I can't complain as you lye in the bed you make and mine has been comfortable for me and my wife (most of the time) hahahaha

If the Time away is not there I think you would see a mass departure from the merchant marine trade in general.  Cruise ships are a bit of an odd ball and I can't really say.....you would need to pull up the bar with Isaac or Goffer and discuss that part of the trade


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## Susquatch (Sep 27, 2021)

You tell us all those things about your complicated world and you always seem to tell them in a positive way. A lesser man would be bitching up a blue storm. 

You are a good man @Brent H !


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## historicalarms (Sep 28, 2021)

Who spec'd the cribbing out for that dude to stand on...one of those 16K-month guys...should hold him tho if he don't eat much from now to eternity LOL

  You mentioned using soap as a slide agent, wonderful stuff for that. When the company I was a supervisor for was moving a lot of houses off acreages before lot construction I got to witness the moves. On the first move, I was very skeptical when I asked the question as to what they would use to push the house onto the foundation and the answer was "4 guys by hand"...this house probably weighed in at around 80,000. 
      The movers foreman used an un-gloved hand and run it over every inch of the slide beams and any time he felt any type of burr or bump on the rail he filled it down smooth and then thoroughly washed every bit of grit off that beam. After washing he liberally smeared common ivory house soap on that beam. Now the house was lowered onto the beam and the beam slope was adjusted to be not more than 1/8th of 1% drop (less than 2" in 100 ft) and then I watched dumbfounded as 4 dudes pushed that house out over the foundation....the biggest concern they had was having a runaway by pushing to hard.  

    When we moved my own house from Calgary, the lay of the land prevented much less than a 1/2 of 1% beam grade and they had to hook a picker truck to the house and just let it slide on its own after a slight nudge to get it started. Those boys let my house down on the basement walls and 2 corners lined up exact and 2 corners were out 1/8 th of an inch...a credit to both them and the basement builders.


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## Brent H (Sep 28, 2021)

Here is a cool pic of the other shaft going in.  The ship is named after a guy so the soap in the hoop is a good thing - LOL





And me and the lads are away tomorrow - lobster here we come!!


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## Chicken lights (Oct 4, 2021)

Hey @Brent H fantastic pictures!! I had a question- do you and your crew have TWIC cards or part of any of the merchant marine programs? Or does being in the coast guard extend that umbrella to allow you to dock places? Just curious


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## Brent H (Oct 4, 2021)

Hey @Chicken lights - we just carry a passport like normal folks and have customs on the ship if we go into the states.  I needed one for a dry dock a long time ago.  It was good for just 3 years or something.  Other than that it is just customs and passports.


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## Chicken lights (Oct 4, 2021)

Gotcha. I’ve been to a couple ports in the USA lately, but I’d like to get my TWIC card so I don’t need an escort in the future


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## YYCHM (Oct 4, 2021)

Chicken lights said:


> Gotcha. I’ve been to a couple ports in the USA lately, but I’d like to get my TWIC card so I don’t need an escort in the future



What's a TWIC card?  What do you mean by having to be escorted?


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## Chicken lights (Oct 4, 2021)

YYCHM said:


> What's a TWIC card?  What do you mean by having to be escorted?


Like a passport for ports and I think military bases, in the USA
An escort is just that, someone with a TWIC card, who you follow around the port. It’s not a big deal until you’re sitting there waiting and you’re still paying them by the hour. First time was by appointment and worked slick, they picked me up at the gates on the fly. Second time it was first come first serve and wasted hours.


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## Susquatch (Oct 4, 2021)

Chicken lights said:


> Like a passport for ports and I think military bases, in the USA
> An escort is just that, someone with a TWIC card, who you follow around the port. It’s not a big deal until you’re sitting there waiting and you’re still paying them by the hour. First time was by appointment and worked slick, they picked me up at the gates on the fly. Second time it was first come first serve and wasted hours.



I'm glad you clarified what an escort is. I'll save your post to show my wife if I ever need to.......


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## YYCHM (Oct 27, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Here is a cool pic of the other shaft going in.  The ship is named after a guy so the soap in the hoop is a good thing - LOL
> 
> View attachment 17345
> And me and the lads are away tomorrow - lobster here we come!!



Is your ship still in dry doc?


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## Brent H (Oct 27, 2021)

Hey Craig, 

We are alongside - gotta go back up as there was a bit of an issue.  Was hoping to be closer to home and bring a few more pieces of Miss Metric to fart around with.  Will find out tomorrow on the extended details.

alas.....


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## YYCHM (Oct 27, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Hey Craig,
> 
> We are alongside - gotta go back up as there was a bit of an issue.  Was hoping to be closer to home and bring a few more pieces of Miss Metric to fart around with.  Will find out tomorrow on the extended details.
> 
> alas.....



As in a few too many leaks?  I was wondering how this all gets wrung out once she is floating again.


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## Janger (Oct 27, 2021)

Those are some big bolts holding the prop blades on. What are they? Size? like M200?


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## YYCHM (Oct 28, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Hey Craig,
> 
> We are alongside - gotta go back up as there was a bit of an issue.  Was hoping to be closer to home and bring a few more pieces of Miss Metric to fart around with.  Will find out tomorrow on the extended details.
> 
> alas.....



What's the prognosis Dr. Diesel?


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## Brent H (Oct 28, 2021)

@Janger they are an M75 fitted bolt so roughly 3 inch diameter and made of some funky proprietary stainless material.  

@YYCHM : things are a bit leaky so we have to go up and replace a couple seals.   One thing about these big seals (450 mm diameter) is a wee issue with one thing can lead to some bigger issues quickly.  We are not, however, looking at a submarine conversion- LOL!  Should be good in a week.


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