# Milling tools arrived



## jcdammeyer (Oct 13, 2022)

I ordered these through Aliexpress.  Arrived today.  Good shape in the plastic tube packages.  Boy are they sharp.  How long they will stay that way...


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## Degen (Oct 13, 2022)

One word......

C A R B I D E

To be fair HSS tooling is how I started, but since I've switch to carbide there is just no going back.

Less deflection
Better wear
Longer life
More aggressive cuts
Better heat tolerance


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## jcdammeyer (Oct 14, 2022)

Degen said:


> One word......
> 
> C A R B I D E
> 
> ...


I tend to break the carbide cutters.  These are cobalt so a bit harder than regular HSS.  I'll report on them after I try them out.   These cost roughly $4.30 each and they are sharper than any of the other HSS I've got.


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## Degen (Oct 14, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> I tend to break the carbide cutters.  These are cobalt so a bit harder than regular HSS.  I'll report on them after I try them out.   These cost roughly $4.30 each and they are sharper than any of the other HSS I've got.


I'll be interesting in hearing how it works out, particularly at a disposable price range.

I found cutter speed on carbide is important (generally higher than on is used to, which why you break them if run to slow as chip load is reduced, remember no flex/give in comparison) but this creates heat acceptable for carbide (to a point) so cooling for material and cutter becomes important.

Example here is one part I machine after 3 parts heat in cutter builds to the point that Aluminium scarf cut starts to re-weld itself to the part (not the objective ), with cooling not issues.

Other not mentioned issues are cutter coatings on carbide, if all purpose go uncoated (this also applies to HSS) as some cause binding with the material scarf being cut. 

Apply some of these newer concepts to HSS helps in cutter life.


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## jcdammeyer (Oct 14, 2022)

Degen said:


> I'll be interesting in hearing how it works out, particularly at a disposable price range.
> 
> I found cutter speed on carbide is important (generally higher than on is used to, which why you break them if run to slow as chip load is reduced, remember no flex/give in comparison) but this creates heat acceptable for carbide (to a point) so cooling for material and cutter becomes important.


It might also be the horrible backlash in my House of Tools mill that contributes.  Although I do have backlash compensation built in with a larger cutter in steel I watched the cutter grab the material and pull the table.  One solution is to really tighten up the ways or... a no brainer... get after project #42 and install ball screws.


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## thestelster (Oct 14, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> It might also be the horrible backlash in my House of Tools mill that contributes.  Although I do have backlash compensation built in with a larger cutter in steel I watched the cutter grab the material and pull the table.  One solution is to really tighten up the ways or... a no brainer... get after project #42 and install ball screws.


Try conventional milling instead of climb milling, then you don't have to worry about backlash (in this regard).


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## Degen (Oct 14, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> It might also be the horrible backlash in my House of Tools mill that contributes.  Although I do have backlash compensation built in with a larger cutter in steel I watched the cutter grab the material and pull the table.  One solution is to really tighten up the ways or... a no brainer... get after project #42 and install ball screws.


I have backlash in mine too, sigh, ball screw project and tuning quill feed system (pain).


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## Tom Kitta (Oct 14, 2022)

Generally I also use carbide for 90% of my work. But 10% is still HSS - mostly when work is iffy with end mills - i.e. I am afraid stuff may move or some other thing may happen which will destroy carbide EM - may kill HSS as well, but HSS is still much cheaper. 

Also form cutters - say making a dove tail - carbide here is very expensive and I do it not too often to justify getting carbide. 

For aluminum work I also generally use HSS. 

Tiny EMs - like less than 1/8 - HSS as well. Carbide will easily break off if you are not super careful. 

For regular steel work killing / chipping carbide is rate on my mill. A month or so ago I killed a carbide EM by taking too big of a cut - I wash actually shocked when it exploded. Except that, its when things move - parts not secured.


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## little ol' e (Oct 15, 2022)

John,

What type of material will you be using the new endmills on ? They should stand up fairly well if your not too aggressive with them. 
Your speed, feed and stepover in which material you want to machine will determine how long they stay sharp. Coolant vs air as well.
Its been many years since I have used those types of endmills but, that was all we had to use before carbide came along.
 Things took longer to complete but we still got things done,,, eventually. 
I hope they work out for your project.


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## jcdammeyer (Oct 16, 2022)

little ol' e said:


> John,
> 
> What type of material will you be using the new endmills on ? They should stand up fairly well if your not too aggressive with them.
> Your speed, feed and stepover in which material you want to machine will determine how long they stay sharp. Coolant vs air as well.
> ...


Mostly scrap aluminum castings, some aluminum extrusion material (also scrap pieces).  Less steel parts but I do steel too.  Often I'll try a 3D print first for trying things out.  If they break I make them from something else.  You can see from the lines on the steel part my depth of cut and the positional issues. 
There was a full depth perimeter cleanup pass done.


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