# Lathe Storage



## jcdammeyer (Jul 25, 2022)

I splurged and bought, on sale, a Mastercraft roll around tool chest.  The gamble was that the overall height was exaggerated and would just slip under the frame of the lathe stand.




No such luck.  Short by about 1.25".  I figured if that was the case I'd use smaller casters since it will rarely move or even just slide it into place without casters onto a wooden base.
What I hadn't realized that if there isn't enough weight in the bottom drawer pulling open the top with all the quick change tool holders results in an instant tip over.





I could mount the lathe up on blocks.  A bit higher wouldn't bother me but doesn't change the tip over problem.  So the casters will have to come off and bolt it to something that will prevent it from falling over.   The up side is it will hold all the lathe bits and pieces.


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## Susquatch (Jul 25, 2022)

Consider putting the tool box on 1/8" steel flat bar slides instead. They could be bolted to the bottom of the tool box in place of the casters. Removing the casters might be enough to clear the lathe stand. If the flat slides stick out the front a bit, it might be enough to stop it from tipping on its own. Especially since the current casters look fairly recessed back from the front. If it isn't enough, there are lots of ways of connecting the back of the tool box to the back of the lathe stand. 

My only other comment is that tool holders are heavy. You could move them to the splash gaurd on the lathe leaving more room in the tool chest.


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## Susquatch (Jul 25, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> top with all the quick change tool holders



This is intriguing. What is this?


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## phaxtris (Jul 25, 2022)

You could make a frame for the base of the cabinet out of angle that allows it to sit low to the ground with the castors outboard

I think you would have to go quite far forward with the frame to stop the tip over issue, a patio block or a chunk of plate in the bottom drawer might be the simplest fix


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## Dabbler (Jul 25, 2022)

I have considered the same tipping problem for one of my chests.  I'll be affixing a 1/4" steel plate to the back of the tool chest as a counterbalance.

One of my friends bought a 16X50 offshore lathe that was a good 6" too low to work with.  He fabricated a box for each adjustable foot, out of a 4 1/2" piece of 6X6 tubing with a 1/2" plate welded on top.  he hoisted the lathe up and put one under each foot.  Very stable,  and his lathe is just the right height.


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 25, 2022)

When I first acquired the SB the seller still had flat head set screws to set the indicator dial.  Royal pain in the neck for setting where to return the cross slide to 0 when it had been pulled out on the return pass for threading with the half nut not engaged.  So the first thing I did when I got this lathe was turn a couple of knurled screws.  
So now first scratch pass the compound and the cross slide is set to zero and the dials locked in.  Then threading is done by advancing the compound slide.  
At the end of each pass cross slide is backed out about a turn and carriage returned to start.  Cross slide returned to the 0 position and compound adjusted for depth of next cut.  
Then dial indicator watched for next line and half nut engaged.





Since the previous owner would have to do that with a small slotted screw driver instead he build this bracket.  The screw goes into the cross slide and bottoms out so it's tight and doesn't turn.  

The bracket is adjust so the head of the bolt is contacting the bracket during the initial scratch pass for threading and then clamped to the cross slide ways.

Now at the end of the pass as the cross slide is moved outwards it goes to the position seen in the photo.
When back at the start the compound is moved in for the next depth of cut distance (along the 29.5 degree slope) and the cross slide is just turned in until it is stopped by the head of the bolt.  

Now the cross slide is at the same point as before and it doesn't matter what number is on the dial.





If I want to make sure it doesn't somehow get pushed out or pulled in due to backlash I can also lock the cross slide in place with this.




As long as the taper dovetail isn't clamped to the bed ways the assembly moves with the carriage and holds the cross slide solid.  If I was doing a tapered pipe thread then of course the taper attachment would be clamped to the ways.  

Now I always use the dial and thumb nut to set the dial into place.


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 25, 2022)

Susquatch said:


> My only other comment is that tool holders are heavy. You could move them to the splash guard on the lathe leaving more room in the tool chest.


Don't have a splash guard and I'm running a dehumidifier full time to prevent rust.  So inside a cabinet appears to help since everything inside my other tool cabinet did not rust.


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## RobinHood (Jul 25, 2022)

That is a very elegant solution.

Monarch, Hardinge (and others) have that “threading feature” built right into the cross slide. Standard Modern had that available as an option on some of their models.


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## David_R8 (Jul 25, 2022)

If memory serves me correctly South Bend sold a threading stop as an accessory.


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 25, 2022)

David_R8 said:


> If memory serves me correctly South Bend sold a threading stop as an accessory.


Quite possible the previous owner just copied that and used the existing hole.  Once I had the thumb nuts it became more of a pain in the neck to set up than to just move cross slide out and back to the same 0.0.  But one does have to carefully track how many turns.  At 0.050" per turn a thread with a 0.075" depth will require more than one turn so one has to remember that.

If I ever get around to mounting a stepper motor to the cross slide screw sticking out the back then the whole thing becomes moot since my ELS handles all that including tapering.   But my ELS was originally designed back in 2006 for lathes missing gears or doing metric on imperial.  The second axis control was added after many of the yahoo group request it be a feature.  I've never really found the need to add it to the South Bend.


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## YotaBota (Jul 25, 2022)

If you use smaller wheels, can you put a cross brace between the back legs and make a lock/latch assembly to hold the toolbox in place? Or even short vertical locking bars (one on each side of the box) from the front just under the tray.


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 25, 2022)

The roll around cabinet is 13" deep so it should be pretty easy to line up the back with the top and an anti-tip bracket.  
The bottom is 19" and there's about 2" below the bottom drawer for a 2x4 cross piece to move the casters outboard.  The flare on the lathe legs and the arc at the top of the side leg casting should allow the RH casters to simply sit under and out of the way.

Now to figure out where to mount the control box.


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## David_R8 (Jul 25, 2022)

I was going to suggest hanging it off the end but then I saw all the control buttons on the face of the box...


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 25, 2022)

David_R8 said:


> I was going to suggest hanging it off the end but then I saw all the control buttons on the face of the box...


I could actually put it almost anywhere and just create an extension for a new panel.




I don't recall if the VFD has only MODBUS or also a POT for remote speed control.  I think it has MODBUS which means I could set the speed and get back motor RPM from my ELS.  Since the ELS has a serial port (RS232) it might need RS485 converter but otherwise it's just software and has been project #42 since about 2008.
Inside the box, which is an old light fixture cabinet, I put a 220VAC to 110VAC transformer for the lamp and coolant pump.  Also the transformer and power supply for the ELS and stepper motors.
Even mounting my ELS on an arm is also project #42...


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## David_R8 (Jul 25, 2022)

I'd hang it off the side then and make a switch panel for the front. I did a similar thing for my CNC router. The electronics enclosure is on the end of the table with all of the controls on the side of the enclosure that faces the operator.


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 30, 2022)

So I did a bit of cad work.  I think the STEP file casters are too big but this is the general idea for squeezing it under the lathe.   And if I replace the castors with much smaller ones I should have the room.


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## SomeGuy (Jul 30, 2022)

None of you will have seen my old house's garage...but I put my big 56" box under my main bench (bench is level, floor is sloped if you're wondering about the gap)...all I did was screw some 2x4's to the bottom of it and slid it into place. Worked perfectly fine since it never moved until I moved houses.








Side note: brings back some memories of what I used to have to work with.


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 30, 2022)

SomeGuy said:


> None of you will have seen my old house's garage...but I put my big 56" box under my main bench (bench is level, floor is sloped if you're wondering about the gap)...all I did was screw some 2x4's to the bottom of it and slid it into place. Worked perfectly fine since it never moved until I moved houses.
> Side note: brings back some memories of what I used to have to work with.


Yes.  Part of me is wondering whether I've been overthinking this.  Just remove the casters.  Set it on a couple of 1x4's that are screwed to the bottom and extend out enough to keep it from tipping.

If I wasn't worried about tipping I'd just set it in place.


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## SomeGuy (Jul 30, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Yes.  Part of me is wondering whether I've been overthinking this.  Just remove the casters.  Set it on a couple of 1x4's that are screwed to the bottom and extend out enough to keep it from tipping.
> 
> If I wasn't worried about tipping I'd just set it in place.



Can you just put some tools/weight in the bottom? I've never had issues with a filled box getting tippy.


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 30, 2022)

SomeGuy said:


> Can you just put some tools/weight in the bottom? I've never had issues with a filled box getting tippy.


Yes but then one day I'll pull that stuff out to do something, then open at top drawer and have it all fall over.  Thinking ahead of the day I'll do something stupid.  Very likely.


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## SomeGuy (Jul 30, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Yes but then one day I'll pull that stuff out to do something, then open at top drawer and have it all fall over.  Thinking ahead of the day I'll do something stupid.  Very likely.


Anything that'll keep it from getting tippy is going to intrude in your foot space though, unless you want to just bolt it to the floor.

Some boxes have interlocks so you can only open one drawer at a time...though I usually defeat those as they're annoying and finicky at times.


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## Doggggboy (Jul 31, 2022)

What about a hook in the wall behind with a short chain or cable attached to the back of the tool box near the top?
Doesn't have to hold the entire weight of the toolbox, just keep it from passing the center of gravity.
I have the same arrangement on the pallet racking in my shop.
If you leave the casters on you may have to block them from sliding back toward the wall.


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 31, 2022)

Doggggboy said:


> What about a hook in the wall behind with a short chain or cable attached to the back of the tool box near the top?
> Doesn't have to hold the entire weight of the toolbox, just keep it from passing the center of gravity.
> I have the same arrangement on the pallet racking in my shop.
> If you leave the casters on you may have to block them from sliding back toward the wall.


That's why I mentioned the IKEA retaining strap they sell with their tall Billy cabinets.  So during an earthquake a tall narrow bookshelf or CD shelf doesn't fall over.  I'll definitely put something like that on for safety.

I was going to cut the pads but then other things got in the way today.   Falling down a new rabbit hole as a friend sent me a video of his latest project.  And he also sent me the complete STEP files and PDF drawings.
Curliss Steam Engine Replica
Spent much of the day sitting in the coolest part of the house just looking at the drawings and figuring out how I'd build it.  Before he sent the step files I'd modeled a bunch from the PDF drawings into Alibre as 3D parametric.  So that I can run CNC to drill all the holes etc...  What a deep rabbit hole this is...


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## jcdammeyer (Jul 31, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> That's why I mentioned the IKEA retaining strap they sell with their tall Billy cabinets.  So during an earthquake a tall narrow bookshelf or CD shelf doesn't fall over.  I'll definitely put something like that on for safety.


As usual, by the fourth one I have the process of lining up the holes etc. down pat.  Except I'm done.

This would work except that the floor is not level and I still want that little bit of extra tip over protection.   The 3/4" ply wood is just barely above the metal ribs.

Next I'll run two 1x4's front to back extending out just enough so the adjustable feet can sit a bit proud and also be easy to get at to level it.  My garage floor is not level.  At all.  Not even close.  Sometimes I think it even moves.  It's not really a garage but a covered in carport.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 1, 2022)

So I picked up a piece of OAK today.  I figured it would be that little bit tougher given the weight that will be in the cabinet.  
The cost of 3/8-16 T-Nuts at Lowes was $2.69 each.  Yikes.  So I left thinking perhaps I'd weld nuts onto washers.  But then I thought, once in place 3/4" worth of thread should be more than enough.  I can always coat the threads with epoxy and chase the threads with the tap again if they aren't very good.
So first trial was with some 3/4" plywood and tapped.  The foot threaded in fine.





Next some MDF.  The one on the right is hand tapped and the 5/16" machinist drill bit did a clean job of making the hole for tapping.  




The one on the left was drilled with a 1/4" shank 5/16" drill bit that is at least 40 years old from my first drill set bought at Sears in Edmonton.  It's a bit bent so it wobbles and since I ran the power cycle for drilling a number of times at different speeds the hole is a tad oversize.




But the power tapping, once I figured out how to do it again went well after I realized that for whatever reason, the G84 would not work while the G33.1 does.  That's what you get for not doing this for more than half a year.

Now all of this research to figure out how to power tap, dig out another collet holder, figure out how to set tool lengths etc. into the tool table with the new spiral tap (was still in plastic wrapping) took about 3 hours.  Could have hand tapped the two pieces, four holes, in 15 minutes.

But I needed the practice at the CNC side of things.  I'll grab a 5/16" collet and use the machinist drill bit for the actual holes.  Line the wood up even with the end of the vise and then each hole will be drilled and tapped at the exact same spot at each end.  That will probably take me another 3 hours.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 2, 2022)

Threw together a quick video drilling and tapping one hole in a piece of Oak.
https://youtu.be/l_GkLj942jw


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## Dusty (Aug 2, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Threw together a quick video drilling and tapping one hole in a piece of Oak.
> https://youtu.be/l_GkLj942jw


 
@jcdammeyer  nice video, one thing upsets me though for safety reasons please remove your wedding ring wife will understand.


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## Dabbler (Aug 3, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Thinking ahead of the day I'll do something stupid. Very likely.


me too.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 3, 2022)

Well crap.  So close and yet so far. 
Not the end of the world as the second photo shows.  I have tons of room on the padded adjusting feet.  More than enough to raise the entire lathe by 0.5" for example.

But I no longer have access to a precision level.  OTOH, if I turn each foot the exact same number of turns it should be close enough...

Addendum:
Turns out the feet only have about a 5/8" adjustment range and because of the existing floor two are already near their max.  Solution is going to be 4 pads made of out metal, about 3/4" thick either between the actual foot and the adjustment weight bearing washer or just a 3/4" pad under the rubber adjustable feet.

Really don't want to spend money at Metal Supermarket for this.  Time to break out the foundry and make 4 pads.


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## Susquatch (Aug 3, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Well crap.  So close and yet so far.
> Not the end of the world as the second photo shows.  I have tons of room on the padded adjusting feet.  More than enough to raise the entire lathe by 0.5" for example.
> 
> But I no longer have access to a precision level.  OTOH, if I turn each foot the exact same number of turns it should be close enough...



Why don't you have access to a level anymore? 

If you borrowed one to get things setup, I'd wait for a deal and buy one. Floors move. I find I have to adjust as the seasons pass. Nice to have a level handy. 

Anyway, I think you are right, turning each screw the exact same amount should get you close. I'd suggest being careful though. It would be easy to get out of whack. A few degrees one way or the other could be a problem.  Eg - a 20 tpi thread is 50 thou per revolution.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 3, 2022)

Susquatch said:


> Why don't you have access to a level anymore?
> 
> If you borrowed one to get things setup, I'd wait for a deal and buy one. Floors move. I find I have to adjust as the seasons pass. Nice to have a level handy.


The lender is no longer available to lend his.  I have found someone else.  But first the pads.  And now I've screwed up existing level after running into this issue. 
I could just put it on the left over pieces of oak but I think I'd rather raise it on metal spacers.
Gives me time to contemplate where to mount the power cabinet.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 3, 2022)

Here's a photo of the foot.  The large washer up against the cast iron leg is 60mm in diameter.  This foot is already pretty well at full extension.  The gap between it and the bases section gets smaller as the screw is turned.





This piece is just under 100mm long and 78mm in diameter so I can slice it into 4 pieces and make some disks about 16 to 20mm or so thick.  Not even sure if it's worth turning down the diameter.


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## combustable herbage (Aug 4, 2022)

I saw these on sale once at princess auto so I bought a set they are for an rv I had some thoughts they might be ok for a lathe or a mill but I never used them.  



			https://www.princessauto.com/en/4-pc-rv-jack-anti-vibration-pads/product/PA0008920845


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## Susquatch (Aug 4, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> This piece is just under 100mm long and 78mm in diameter so I can slice it into 4 pieces and make some disks about 16 to 20mm or so thick. Not even sure if it's worth turning down the diameter.



Man, you got yourself into quite the game of dominos....... But it is what it is.

If I were you, I'd be getting new taller feet for the lathe.

Either that or shave the boards for your tool cabinet down a bit.

But if you are gunna make foot extensions from that bar, I would NOT turn down the diameter. Instead, I would put a small recess in them - say 75 thou - to take the original foot. The last thing you want is your lathe moving around on those skates. Although you prolly don't want to, I'd also consider bolting them to the floor with concrete screws before setting your lathe on them. Basically, recess them for the lathe feet and then drill and recess again for the concrete screws.


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## Dabbler (Aug 4, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> This piece is just under 100mm long and 78mm in diameter so I can slice it into 4 pieces and make some disks about 16 to 20mm or so thick. Not even sure if it's worth turning down the diameter.



Here's a tip that's a little more work, but very well worth it...  Mill out the bottom of the foot to make 3 equally spaced pads. They only need be .100 high or so.  This will give much more stability, and inhibits the foot from 'walking under vibration:


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## Susquatch (Aug 4, 2022)

Dabbler said:


> Here's a tip that's a little more work, but very well worth it...  Mill out the bottom of the foot to make 3 equally spaced pads. They only need be .100 high or so.  This will give much more stability, and inhibits the foot from 'walking under vibration:



I LOVE THIS.

It addresses the problem I was struggling with - walking. Maybe not perfectly, but certainly better than plain flat bottoms. Screwing them down is better still but most of us (me included) don't want to drill holes in our floors.

Also VERY EASY to machine. Three passes through the foot separated by 120 degrees with the right size end mill will make the required pads perfectly.

I still advocate a 75 thou recess on the other side to retain the old feet.

I'm gunna swipe this idea to make better feet for my mill and lathe too.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 4, 2022)

Ha ha.  And I thought I made things complicated.  I know I didn't pay nearly this price back in around 2008 or so.  Even the kbctools catalog I have lists it $15 cheaper.  But these are what I have.








						Royal Machine Mounts – Royal Products
					






					royalproducts.com
				








						Results Page 1 :: KBC Tools & Machinery
					






					www.kbctools.ca
				



This shows how the range of upward adjustment is limited.  But, put a 20mm thick 60mm diameter metal washer on top of the existing 60mm diameter washer and then set the machine on it and the entire machine is raised by 20mm.


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## Susquatch (Aug 4, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Ha ha.  And I thought I made things complicated.  I know I didn't pay nearly this price back in around 2008 or so.  Even the kbctools catalog I have lists it $15 cheaper.  But these are what I have.





jcdammeyer said:


> is shows how the range of upward adjustment is limited.  But, put a 20mm thick 60mm diameter metal washer on top of the existing 60mm diameter washer and then set the machine on it and the entire machine is raised by 20mm.



Wow. That is the weirdest thing I've ever seen. Here is a screen grab to facilitate discussion. 






If I understand what I'm seeing, the jack screws are threaded into the center piston and raise the center piston by pushing against the bottom of the outer cylinder. The piston slides in the cylinder and is probably keyed to stop rotation. It also appears to have a stop snap ring to stop it from coming out completely. 

Fair enough. Adding a thick washer (I'll call it a sleeve) will raise the machine by the sleeve thickness. 

A few things I don't like though. 

1. As the piston nears the top of the cylinder, it probably gets wobbly. 

2. The entire weight of the machine is actually resting on the bolts acting like pillars. While the rubber will definitely help, I think it loses its effective range of authority as the piston is extended. This could get shaky causing loss of lathe rigidity. 

3. The whole affair is raised with a small square end on the bolt. I'd rather have seem a hex head or something similar. 

Anyway, those are just my thoughts. The functionality will be what it is. 

Are you gunna make thicker washers? If so, I'd size them so that the piston is near the bottom of its travel when adjusted to the working height.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 4, 2022)

Susquatch said:


> Fair enough. Adding a thick washer (I'll call it a sleeve) will raise the machine by the sleeve thickness.
> 
> A few things I don't like though.
> 
> ...


Mine has a hex head at the top.  Not square.  And it's not wobbly at all.  And when you look at the other type that just sit on the threaded bolt this one had more support.  It's why I went that way... I think...

And here are the spacers.   I will probably need to bore them out a bit.  These were just drilled with a 1/2" bit and the inside area of the castings was so porous, not to mention soft, that the drill bit really didn't stay on track very well.

They are 3.00" diameter.  15.6mm thick.  Why that thickness?  More on that in the next posting.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 4, 2022)

No extra work was required on the spacers.  I used the old long handle throw out bearing compression handle from my SAAB repair days.  That and a couple of square tubing pieces to lever up each end of the lathe enough to be able to slide the spacers into place, drop the bolts in and screw it down again.

End result is in the photo.

Another example of "If there's a hard way to do it I'll figure it out and do it that way".

Oh and it's impossible to make the cabinet fall over with the top drawer all the way out and nothing in the bottom drawers.

Now if I could only figure out how to easily pull off that stupid label on the bottom drawer.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 4, 2022)

And here's a couple of pictures of the construction process.
First though the tale of woe.  I decided because the cast piece someone gave me was very soft that I'd better use coolant on the band saw.  Haven't used coolant for decades.  Pump wouldn't pump.  Pulled off the pump and emptied major gunk out of the reservoir. 




Once I had the pump out I grabbed the shaft with pliers and twisted it.  A full turn and after that I could spin it by hand.  After that the motor could turn it.
Spent more than an hour cleaning the tank.  Then a just under a litre of Princess Auto Powerfist Water Soluable cutting oil and about 25 litres of water.

Then it took over two hours to cut the 4 disks.  After the first two were cut I could start on turning them. First face one side of all 4 pieces in the 4 jaw chuck and drill a 1/2" hole.  Then flip the thinest one and surface until all the saw marks are gone.  That worked out to 15.6mm.  My saw blade probably needs replacing or there are some alignment issues as it had issues cutting perfectly square blanks.

Next flip each blank and with the carriage locked at that position and just use the compound to feed in until the dial reads the same as the first piece.  Measure.  15.6mm.  Rinse and repeat two more times.





The above photo is a screen grab of a really short video showing my ELS driving the Z axis lead screw but the south bend set for power cross feed. Setting up feed rates let me go quickly towards the middle for a rough cut and as it returned to start I fed the compound in 0.005" and the return pass was slower and did a nice cleaning job. 

Finally, although not really needed, I decided I wanted all 4 pieces the same diameter and concentric to the drilled (not bored) hole.  Once again my ELS to cut each pass to bring it down to the same diameter which saved having to hover over it and I could do other things.  Like spray WD-40 and brush away chips.

Notice that it was easiest, for me anyway, to put the disk on an existing half inch mandrel and turn it between centers.    I could also have chucked the head stock end into a collet instead of a drive dog since I didn't need to end for end the work.


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## Dabbler (Aug 4, 2022)

re: getting labels off...

The more common way is to use a heat gun.  This will leave behind adhesive that you can dissolve in canola oil (or peanut oil if you are well off)  I find oil will soak the label off and leave less residue, but on a vertical surface, it isn't practical.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 4, 2022)

Dabbler said:


> re: getting labels off...
> 
> The more common way is to use a heat gun.  This will leave behind adhesive that you can dissolve in canola oil (or peanut oil if you are well off)  I find oil will soak the label off and leave less residue, but on a vertical surface, it isn't practical.


Thanks.  I'll try that.  I can pull the drawers out again and set the face horizontal.


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## Susquatch (Aug 5, 2022)

Very well done!



jcdammeyer said:


> Now if I could only figure out how to easily pull off that stupid label on the bottom drawer.




The best trick I can offer in addition to what @Dabbler suggested is to go slow. REALLY SLOW! By pulling very very slowly, the adhesive will stretch and then slowly let go. Just apply continuous tension below the point where the paper or plastic label tears and the adhesive will slowly release. Extreme patience is required especially for large labels.

Once in a while some Goo-gon applied at the separation point helps. So does a little heat applied from the backside.


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## PaulL (Aug 5, 2022)

We entirely missed the other way to keep the cabinet from falling over.  Bolt a short beam to the top that comes to rest under the rear rail of the lathe.


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## YotaBota (Aug 5, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Now if I could only figure out how to easily pull off that stupid label on the bottom drawer.


Heat gun to soften the glue.
Edit - didn't see the @Dabbler post until after I did a refresh, oops


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 5, 2022)

PaulL said:


> We entirely missed the other way to keep the cabinet from falling over.  Bolt a short beam to the top that comes to rest under the rear rail of the lathe.


Well now.    We can start discussing my 20-20 hind sight which doesn't need the progressive lenses I wear for looking forward.  

I thought I'd measured correctly and I'd have room to slide the cabinet to the right and the top corner at the front would be captured by the leg without interfering with the drawers.
NOT!  Measured where it was easy to get the tape in.  Didn't see that the legs have a 1/2" flange behind the leg which makes that distance 1/2" less.  Just like my 1mm over height that's enough to prevent it going any further sideways and now I don't have room for my power cabinet in between it and the motor.

Where it's sitting now, and I like that front to back position since it's out of the way of my feet, it turns out the back of the cabinet is flush with the back of the lathe stand.  A simple strap between the two would prevent tipping.  

So now I could remove the $16 worth of Oak painstakingly (but with great CNC fun) drilled and tapped and just put T-Nuts into the softer plywood pieces bolted into the original castor locations and drill a hole through the metal cabinet for the feet to go.  Of course if for some reason I later decide to move the cabinet out and use it elsewhere the tipping problem could return.    But that means $2.69 T-Nuts which is why I tapped the Oak in the first place.

So for now, I'm going to leave it exactly as is while I figure out the mounts for the control and maybe finally put my ELS up there too instead of as a carry around box which is inconvenient at times.  And then revisit this after I insulate and vapour barrier the rest of the concrete in the carport/shop.  Perhaps ultimately build a custom cabinet that fits where I want and fits properly.

After all the protruding feet don't interfere.  Ie.  They aren't in the way.  At least not yet.  I have to wait a day or so before I fill it so I can pull it out to get easier access to the adjustment screws when I borrow the machinists level.

And with that 20-20 hindsight and now extra side space, I could have mounted castors completely on the side raised up so the cabinet clears but can still be rolled out.  But I wanted the space which I don't have now anyway.


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## Johnwa (Aug 5, 2022)

I have a bottom box under my lathe.  It has  3 drawers with a big open space at the bottom where I store a bunch of short metal pieces.  That takes care of the tipping problem.  My biggest issue keeping dwarf out of the drawers.


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## PaulL (Aug 5, 2022)

Johnwa said:


> My biggest issue keeping dwarf out of the drawers.


I don't have dwarf problems particularly.  But my dog keeps nosing in there.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 5, 2022)

PaulL said:


> I don't have dwarf problems particularly.  But my dog keeps nosing in there.


Rats.  Beat me too that comment.


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## Susquatch (Aug 5, 2022)

Johnwa said:


> My biggest issue keeping dwarf out of the drawers.



Who is the dwarf? LMAO! 

I assume you meant swarf!

That's why I don't want a cabinet there. But if I did, I'd just hang a cloth or canvas drop sheet over it.


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## Johnwa (Aug 5, 2022)

Friggin autocorrect!


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 5, 2022)

Raising the lathe to make the tool storage cabinet fit of course means the adjustment was lost.  Had to do it again.  




Here's the two indications:
Head stock end.




Tail stock end.





Close enough?


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## Susquatch (Aug 5, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Raising the lathe to make the tool storage cabinet fit of course means the adjustment was lost.  Had to do it again.
> View attachment 25389
> Here's the two indications:
> Head stock end.
> ...



Oh ya, plenty good enough!

Unless the level isn't proofed and you swapped ends..... LOL! 

But now you have to check the spindle and then the tailstock..... If you want to!


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 5, 2022)

Susquatch said:


> Oh ya, plenty good enough!
> 
> Unless the level isn't proofed and you swapped ends..... LOL!
> 
> But now you have to check the spindle and then the tailstock..... If you want to!


Level is proofed.  Didn't swap ends.

I don't want to...

The South Bend alignment manual tells about turning a 1" piece with two of the same diameters a way apart.  Then measuring to see if there is a taper.  The problem is that's the area where the bed is worn so I'd see what appears like a taper but isn't.

When I turned the Gingery ACME lead screw with the following steady I found I had to tweak the depth of cut in the left to middle section as the carriage moved from left to right.  That's because as the carriage dropped slightly it changed where the tool bit cut and that meant a larger diameter.   A nut threaded at both ends but would jam in the middle so I tweaked until the nut turned with the same friction all along the screw.

The screw is nicer than the all thread ACME stuff I was using before.


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## YYCHM (Aug 5, 2022)

Where did the level come from?


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 5, 2022)

YYCHM said:


> Where did the level come from?


A friend, Joe M. I met through the Metal Working Group <forum@lists.metal-working.ca>  Very small group now as many have left this world.   

Joe tells me he inherited this level and told me to be very careful with it!  Very careful as it also has sentimental value.  He has a shorter one but I'm not sure it would have spanned across the ways.


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## Susquatch (Aug 5, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> Level is proofed.  Didn't swap ends.
> 
> I don't want to...
> 
> ...



Sounds to me like you know exactly what you are doing and why. So ya, it's all good! 

I am interested in your situation. I had wanted to consider issues like that as I worked on an improved alignment test bar. Would you consider doing some measurements for me at some future date - assuming I don't croak before then? 

Do you know how your lathe got saddled like that? Too much of the same work?


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 5, 2022)

Susquatch said:


> Sounds to me like you know exactly what you are doing and why. So ya, it's all good!
> 
> I am interested in your situation. I had wanted to consider issues like that as I worked on an improved alignment test bar. Would you consider doing some measurements for me at some future date - assuming I don't croak before then?
> 
> Do you know how your lathe got saddled like that? Too much of the same work?


Thanks.  

I'm not sure how I can help with measurements.

My lathe was bought by the  Armed Forces in Edmonton in 1942.  From there I believe it entered the Canadian Navy for a while.   It came to me around 2006 or 2007 when I bought it from a guy in Saanichton who had cleaned it up, painted it and made it run.  A few years later I replaced the 1 HP single phase motor with a 3 phase and VFD.  The intention was to use the serial port of the ELS to send MODBUS messages for ON/OFF and speed control.  Hasn't happened yet.

The wear and tear is pretty normal for a lathe of that vintage that may well have been used daily for years.  It's in surprisingly good shape for a machine that is 80 years old.

My Delta 14" band saw that I rescued from the fire pit at the Bragg Creek Scout camp west of Calgary had a 1939 date painted on it which is the year it was donated to the Scouts.  I restored that after it had sat outside behind a building for a few years.  I still use it too.  I like old tools.


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## YotaBota (Aug 5, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> And he also sent me the complete STEP files and PDF drawings


The Curliss is a beautiful engine.
Are you authorized to share the files and drawings?


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 5, 2022)

YotaBota said:


> The Curliss is a beautiful engine.
> Are you authorized to share the files and drawings?


I'll ask.


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## Susquatch (Aug 5, 2022)

jcdammeyer said:


> I'm not sure how I can help with measurements.



Great history. Explains a lot.

I am a firm believer in testing to validate theory and simulation. I'm working on an alignment test bar that will be much longer than the traditional bar described in your Southbend documentation. The idea is to improve testable accuracy as well as to be able to do alignments even when the ways are well worn. I can do the math to simulate the situation but I can't validate the worn ways situation without worn ways.

This work is a project that seems to be unfolding over a very long period of time. Too many competing priorities. So the truth is that said measurements may be a year away or more. But when and if I get there, it would be good to have someone I could call on to do a few measurements for me. Nothing onerous. Might not ever happen. Might not even need it. Just making a note of the fact that you have such a machine and be open to such a request is enough for now.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 5, 2022)

Susquatch said:


> Great history. Explains a lot.
> 
> I am a firm believer in testing to validate theory and simulation. I'm working on an alignment test bar that will be much longer than the traditional bar described in your Southbend documentation. The idea is to improve testable accuracy as well as to be able to do alignments even when the ways are well worn. I can do the math to simulate the situation but I can't validate the worn ways situation without worn ways.
> 
> This work is a project that seems to be unfolding over a very long period of time. Too many competing priorities. So the truth is that said measurements may be a year away or more. But when and if I get there, it would be good to have someone I could call on to do a few measurements for me. Nothing onerous. Might not ever happen. Might not even need it. Just making a note of the fact that you have such a machine and be open to such a request is enough for now.


Love to help any way I can.  Just ask.


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## whydontu (Aug 6, 2022)

Johnwa said:


> I have a bottom box under my lathe.  It has  3 drawers with a big open space at the bottom where I store a bunch of short metal pieces.  That takes care of the tipping problem.  My biggest issue keeping dwarf out of the drawers.


I find the gremlins in my drawings take care of the dwarves


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## Mcgyver (Aug 6, 2022)

Gents, its Corliss with an "O".


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## Mcgyver (Aug 6, 2022)

Posts about your dwarf in a drawer ought to noted as Off Topic!


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## YotaBota (Aug 6, 2022)

@Mcgyver - we stand corrected, anyway you spell it, it's still a beauty.
I don't find anyone selling kits for Corliss and I imagine it would be quite the journey to build one from scratch.


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 6, 2022)

Mcgyver said:


> Gents, its Corliss with an "O".


Sorry about the spelling mistake.  The plans are from here:





						Model Engine Maker - Index
					

Model Engine Maker - Index



					www.modelenginemaker.com
				



I've registered but I'm not sure exactly where the plans are located.  Once I get the confirmation email I'll dig into that.


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## Mcgyver (Aug 6, 2022)

Agreed, they are neat engines.  Its the valve gear that make it a Corliss and there is so much going the make an interesting engine to watch.

You've got a few options to build one, there may be more, but these are the ones I'm aware of.   They're a more involved build, but like everything we do, one way or another is just series of set ups and cuts

Coles used to have a nice kit, but they seem to have imploded.  The drawings are still out there.  Coles fairly drastically shortened the length of the connecting rod to create a smaller footprint which makes it less prototypical looking but still a great looking model.  Casting sets do come up occasionally








Then there is the Arnold Throp Corliss, a handsome model with castings available from Southworth.  http://www.southworthengines.com/engines/mill-engines/corliss-valve-engine/.    To look at the Throp engine in more detail, this chap JD Wall likes to redraw these engines https://modelengineeringwebsite.com/Corliss_drawings.html.    It would be the one I'd go for, very prototypical looking!  (if I didn't already have the giant (13" flywheel) shown above in B&W that needs finishing.)






Lastly, there is the MEM Corliss.  A great look engine and its a bar stock bar stock so the build is a little easier and a lot less expensive!  See the last post here for drawings.  Its an open source thing from the good folks at the forum.






						JC attempts the MEM Corliss
					

JC attempts the MEM Corliss



					www.modelenginemaker.com


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## jcdammeyer (Aug 6, 2022)

Yes.  It was the MEM Corliss that he built.  In the model builders forum he's 'woodguy'.  His suggestion was buy all the screws and nuts first before you start so you know what sizes the holes are.


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