# BB vs KBC drill bits



## GlenG (Feb 2, 2019)

So I took the risk and brought some, direct from China drill bits.....terrible.  So how do the KBC branded drill bits sets (115pc) compare to the BB set, I mean they look like they came from the same Chinese factory. Is there any appreciable difference?  I’ve had hit and miss luck with other BB drill bits in the past.

Trying not to break the bank here as well.


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## Bofobo (Feb 2, 2019)

I only ever bought 2 drill sets, one from PA the other was a bulk mastercraft box thing, the mastercraft are far superior to the PA. But in the industry every drill bit except the tang ones for a tailstock are pretty well disposable. I learned how to sharpen them and once you have a good feel for it its a handy skill. 
My question is, are you breaking drills?, finding them crooked? Or finding they get dull ridiculously fast?
Did you buy coated ones? Or plain hss? I found if it says coated or looks painted, i wont buy it and i will be happier. I really got the PA one for the index, even after every bit is broke i cannot build the index for less ( i got mine at the old barlow location liquidation)


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## GlenG (Feb 2, 2019)

The terrible ones were twisting straight and then snapping, quite interesting actually,


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## GlenG (Feb 2, 2019)

I’m actually currently walking around PA with their 115pc Ti coated set on sale for $60. 

Should I drop them and run down the road to BB and get their set for $125, LOL


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## PeterT (Feb 2, 2019)

GlenG said:


> So how do the KBC branded drill bits sets (115pc) compare....


KBC is like Travers & other re-sellers when it comes to their house brand names. It 'depends'. Set A could be China bad, set B could be Asia decent, set C could be Europe good. Another distributor may not carry the lowest line so their A could be equivalent to someone else's B.  And next year could all be different again. If you call KBC or Travers usually they can look up country of origin. That in itself may not be enough information to go on, but somewhat helpful. Be careful with permutations of 'USA Made', it can actually be an offshore brand which is not 'made in the United States'. When it comes to the stores, all bets off. Anything goes. You will see TiN coated garbage on the same shelf as decent quality.


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## Janger (Feb 2, 2019)

Norseman bits. USA made. KMS has them - often on sale - about $110 I think for the 29 piece index. I've found them to be very good and for cutting steel well worth the money. I also bought them at the bolt supply house. Sharpening them is not hard with a regular bench grinder - watch some you tubes on that. I learned how in the SAIT class (& Kevin Decelles) it's not too bad and helps loads.

I also bought a big set at BB. Utter crap. I'm really sorry I didn't take them back. $80 i might as well have thrown the money away. I cut about 1/2" in some steel and it was painful and then dull and then just rubbed. I suppose I could sharpen them twice for each hole.

1/2 to 1" set below. it was $200 ish.. Norseman again. I had to order and wait a few weeks at bolt supply house.


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## Dabbler (Feb 2, 2019)

I've had the sam dismal experience from the Mastercraft Canadian Tire 'Cobalt' drill set.  They are made of Swiss cheese!

Nice Drill set, Janger


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## Bofobo (Feb 2, 2019)

Dont! Buy the PA $60 triple index! Its junk junk! Try for lower bit count and a little more money if anything because the cheapest is hammer and chisel mechanic grade


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## RobinHood (Feb 2, 2019)

Most of my drills are Union Butterfield (nos) scored from tool sales. If I need new, I usually go with Norseman/Viking  or Cleveland brands. All these brands have good point geometry and come with a good, lasting factory edge.

Don’t waste $s on cheap drills. Same goes for taps and dies. All they do is get you frustrated because they dull fast, break at the worst possible time and cost you more in the long run because you’ll be buying new ones forever.


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## Janger (Feb 2, 2019)

RobinHood is right expensive drills are actually cheaper. Just thinking about it I bought this 29 piece norseman
https://www.kmstools.com/norseman-29pc-super-premium-drill-bit-set-3805
about 4 years ago. I've ruined a few of them and had to replace but generally I'm using the same set and I have not had to sharpen more than a few of them. 

I have a few of the cle-line drills too - they are also great.
https://www.kmstools.com/cle-line-29pc-treated-drill-bit-set-90868


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## YYCHM (Feb 3, 2019)

What brand did Sears Canada flog?

Seems like it was pretty good stuff.  My Sears socket set has stood the test of time and abuse.  The drill bit set I inherited when we cleaned out my parents house seems to be good.  I'm thinking it is a Sears product.  Dad pretty much bought all of his tools from Sears.

I recollect taking a Sears screw driver back that I toasted in a fuse box ooooops.  Was replaced no questions asked.


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## Dabbler (Feb 4, 2019)

Big difference between what Sears sold 20 years ago (Dorian) and what they sold 5 years ago (offshore junk)..  Possibly this direction is why Sears is no longer with us.


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## PeterT (Feb 4, 2019)

Agree. A lot of Sears Craftsman brand were their own spec tool line or big name tools in disguise as evidenced by interchangeable parts. Then they started to dilute the line with lower quality and/or phase out the name altogether & just sell yellow Dewalt's or red Milwaukee's by name. Your dads banged up Craftsman wrenches of the 60-70's are likely better quality than what they were selling new in the 2000's. I think the only reason they are afloat (if they are) is the real estate sans debt. Fortunately there will be a new Bed Bath & Beyond on those big parking lots offering all kinds of useful things for us tool junkies - LOL.


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## YYCHM (Feb 5, 2019)

What about Gray products?  Seems to me some the Gray spanners etc I have came from Sears?


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## PeterT (Feb 5, 2019)

I received a flyer from DMH with these drills intro offer. Sometimes they have discount with new product lines they carry, sometimes just regular promo. I'm not sure, you would have to check, but I thought BRT were German.


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## John Conroy (Feb 6, 2019)

Sorry Peter, I'm not familiar with DMH


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## PeterT (Feb 6, 2019)

They are tool distributor in Calgary, bricks & mortar.


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## PeterT (Feb 6, 2019)

https://dmhmachinetools.com/

Sowa distributer & other lines. I think predominantly caters to the machine shops like Thomas Skinner, but they gladly accept hobbyists & the like. As always, check prices.


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## Brian H (Feb 7, 2019)

I recently purchased a set of titanium twist drills at princess auto (numbered, lettered and fractional) and have been impressed with the quality. I know its hit or miss there sometimes, but, this time I lucked out and got a good set.
I have also purchase a couple select sizes of their cobalt bits and they work exceptionally


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## Tom Kitta (Feb 8, 2019)

I have given the PA 115 set to dad. They are... not good. Got it for just over $40 so not too bad. Went to dad same as Canadian Tire bulk stuff.

I also long ago got PA1/2 shank up to 1" set. Seems to work fine. Just go slow with it. 

My main set is Dewalt cobalt.

My set A is carbide - but I miss some sizes maxing out at just 1/2"

I also have a lot of used drill bits that I got bulk.

I also got most size drill bits by 1/64 to 2". I actually used the 2" yesterday - I am making a back plate.


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## kevin.decelles (Feb 9, 2019)

I found myself buying set after set after set for years, until I stumbled across a booth at the Red Deer Agri-trade show (the vendor booth section is the reason I go -- I'm not looking at farm machinery).  The vendor was Red Deer Bolt www.reddeerbolt.com, and the branch of drill bit is 'Champion', and comes in a  round container (picture of a  set here on Amazon amazon link )

I bought a jobber set 4 years ago, and a second 'mechanics' set 2 years ago.  I had a couple of bits break in the second set, but overall they stay sharp, cut well and I haven't bought a drill bit since.  I've only resharpened maybe 3 or 4 bits in that time.

I can't remember what I paid, but 100 - 120 seems about right.  

For drilling larger than 1/2" I use a product called super-drill, which I also bought at the Agri-Trade show.  Basically it is an arbor that you mount a piece of HSS and it cuts holes up to 3 1/2" inches (depending on which arbors you bought).  Works very very well.  Simply drill a pilot hole (1/2"), put the arbor in it, and then with very little pressure drill holes to whatever dimension you want   link:   superdrill link   I believe the couple I bought from have the distribution rights to 'super drill' in alberta (they live on an acreage just outside of red deer).  The tool is very simple and if you have a lathe, you can make one.  Watch some of the videos, it's that easy.  And what I like about it is that it cuts without binding so you don't have to worry about breaking your wrists etc.


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## Tom Kitta (Feb 9, 2019)

There must be a reason super drill didn't catch on other than rather over the top price. Even the Chinese didn't seem to want to copy it. Patent expired so making it & selling it is legal. I can see it as being too slow for the industry & way to imprecise but for making a quick hole it seems legit.

I am also a bit surprised they even got a patent - it seems to work on the same principle as a boring head. It actually looks like a two step boring bar. 

Wait come to think of it I seen a video on youtube of a super old two step boring bar home made... I guess there is a reason they would not patent in the US. They don't have representation in the US nor EU, In Canada they have someone in SK only. 

I guess now I know that I can simply put some of these boring bars in a drill press or a milling machine - also would be of great use in a MAG drill.


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## kevin.decelles (Feb 9, 2019)

For 1/2 plate the holes are pretty accurate. What I like is that the consumable (HSS) is cheap. 




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## Dabbler (Feb 9, 2019)

I like the Superdrill!  another great reason to learn to sharpen HSS blanks!


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## Tom Kitta (Feb 11, 2019)

Well if you have boring bar you already have one. For 1" holes the stick out from 1/2" boring bar is 1/4" max.

Same from 1" boring bar - stick out is 1/4" max for 1.5" hole.

Obviously you can use carbide as well. Something to experiment on the drill press with.


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## Chicken lights (Feb 11, 2019)

Anyone hear of these guys? Or used any of their stuff?


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## Tom Kitta (Feb 11, 2019)

They seem to be US based and have about 120 year history - http://www.championcuttingtool.com/about-champion

Reviews are good - as expected for a 120 year company in the US (they would not last if they were "bad" in the US): https://www.amazon.com/Champion-Cut...000OBF528/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

I don't think I ever used them - they seem to be one of the smaller companies from the US. Maybe I did use them but not often enough to remember.


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## Chicken lights (Feb 11, 2019)

Bolts plus told me they’d give me 50% off any broach I wanted if I bought a mag drill 

Tempting....


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## kevin.decelles (Feb 11, 2019)

Yes, champion is the drill bit vendor I mentioned , I get their product out of red deer bolt




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## Tom Kitta (Feb 11, 2019)

Out of sheer curiosity how much for a standard 29 drill bit set?


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## Tom O (Feb 12, 2019)

Chicken lights said:


> Bolts plus told me they’d give me 50% off any broach I wanted if I bought a mag drill
> 
> Tempting....


I bought a 1/4” square broach and it cost me around $170.00 I believe from ACT.
I belive I have a 3/8” and 1/2” regular broach also.


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