# Restoration of a 10” Utilathe - the metric version!



## Brent H (Oct 27, 2021)

As the title indicates, I will document the refurbishment of this Utilathe.   It is a full metric version of the classic 1020 Utilathe.  It came off Kijiji as a project inherited from someone with a project in mind.  

As this is the METRIC version, some of the restoration will be smaller than a standard restoration.  

If you have any questions or concerns or advice etc just put it all here and I will try to answer!!


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## Susquatch (Oct 27, 2021)

Brent H said:


> View attachment 17912As the title indicates, I will document the refurbishment of this Utilathe.   It is a full metric version of the classic 1020 Utilathe.  It came off Kijiji as a project inherited from someone with a project in mind.
> 
> As this is the METRIC version, some of the restoration will be smaller than a standard restoration.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns or advice etc just put it all here and I will try to answer!!



Very cool @Brent H !!  If anyone can pull this off, you can! Happy to follow along and add my 2 cents as appropriate! Should be fun!


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## Brent H (Oct 27, 2021)

Here are some condition survey pictures. 

This is the apron.  You can see the path of a hard object across the big gear teeth - I think this just came from above or was possibly inflicted during disassembly or a fall.  The main 6” hand wheel is broken off.  One “spoke” is missing of the 3 and that sucks as I could have fixed this if the spoke was there.  I will find a hand wheel or contract the super talented hand wheel maker @RobinHood !  Everything else looks and feels great. 









This next one is the cross slide screw bushing.  The Gits Oiler is smashed off but the gear teeth are great and you can also see the graduations on the compound are nice and clean.  Some rust on the cross feed dial and it goes from 0 to 2.5 mm










The bearing end of the lead screw and the feed rod.  Gits is smashed but the fit is fine and no signs of significant wear on the parts.  Missing a 1/4" locating dowel










Top of the Compound and saddle.  You can see some evidence of chuck crashing but it is not that bad.  You can make out machining marks on the cross slide base still.  You can see the broken handwheel off in the lower right corner of the pic.  








The saddle rack is loose, common Utilathe issue, the front of the apron looks good (feed handle removed).  Gits oilers in good shape and the feed gears are good as well.  The half nut engages solid and the change over from longitudinal to cross to threading  works smooth.








Metric gearbox.  Moves well and no gear damage inside (it is all open at the back so I could inspect)  Missing an 1-3/8" ball with 3/8-24 thread 






Main spindle gearbox.  Everything working.  D1-3 spindle nose - works fine.  Oil level glass = pooched.  Speed and feed handles all move well and detent properly






Dead blow hammer on site just in case things get bent out of shape.  Motor is 3 phase 3/4 Hp spins fine but will probably get new bearings and a paint job - VFD and a new belt as the belt is not the correct size.  The plastic knob just below the chuck is for a light I believe and is bent all  to shite - removal will have to occur.  The two gears are in good condition and is the feed fine/coarse selection and idler gear.  Ways look good - some dents and scratches but a stoning will be good for me (LOL) and the ways.







Gears Gears Gears!  Looking good in there! Some typical wear but no missing teeth and things rotate smooth.  Oil is dirty as Frack and there are pieces of crud in there - a good bath and change of the oil will do very well after a paint job!








A rare sighting on Utlathes these days!11 What a piece of tail.......stock!  ol' Rusted up bastage that it is....  Perhaps that is why they are hard to find: they eventually biodegrade?   This one needs a good soak and scrub and a new gits oiler and some other repairs (key is busted off in the handle and quill lock is the original steel one and these tend to gouge the quill - not sure why they are not a softer choice of material - anyway this will be fixed.  Handle is brazed on and then they brazed it on again and then again and I guess could not find a die grinder?  this too will be improved upon.  Note that this is a Metric lathe and the quill is in inches- awesome!








And this years model, sporting remnants from a by gone era....Miss U1438!.....Bravo!







What a tattoo eh fellas - man oh man....Miss Metric  - LOL


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## YYCHM (Oct 27, 2021)

Good news Brent, U1438 was never sunk. It was surrendered and later intentionally scuttled.


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## Canadium (Oct 27, 2021)

Wow! Some significant challenges! If it were mine I would be considering casting my own hand wheel and thread dial base! I know - just too ambitious. But I have been wanting to get into casting for a long time. Just worried my neighbours won't appreciate a blast furnace next door. Maybe up in Barrie that would not be such an issue?

"Miss Metric  - LOL" thats too funny! Should make a decal for the headstock with the name Miss Metric.


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## Brent H (Oct 27, 2021)

Hey @Canadium : Ian, if you have the furnace then maybe we can do it!   I lack all the other essentials but the the neighbours would just bring over hot dogs and marshmallows  and drink beer while we worked on getting Chernobyl under containment..... no issues there!

I have enough pieces of the original wheel to make a casting mold.   I could fill in the missing spoke with some clay putty and sculpt it for all that would be required.    I do, however,  lack the proper sand, the furnace etc to do anything else.   There are two brake rotors that would make a good cast iron soup  ...alas....

(that was my emoticon test paragraph)....

It would be a cool thing to cast from scratch though.


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## Susquatch (Oct 27, 2021)

Way too much fun @Brent H !



Brent H said:


> You can see the path of a hard object across the big gear teeth - I think this just came from above or was possibly inflicted during disassembly or a fall.



I think that was a piece of wire or wires or small rod that got rolled between the gear and the smooth upper section of the adjacent gear. It shows no sign of damaging the faces of the gear from what I can see and the tips don't make contact. If you see some face damage that I can't, a light polishing with a small stone should clean them up. 

I love your suggested name for her...... Miss Metric. But how do you rationalize that with tailstock? I feel a crude joke about transoceanic couplings coming on, but that may need to wait for the big Chernobyl melt down..... 

Or you could just buy and modify the handwheel that busy bee sells.....


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## gmihovics (Oct 27, 2021)

Brent H said:


> Hey @Canadium : Ian, if you have the furnace then maybe we can do it!   I lack all the other essentials but the the neighbours would just bring over hot dogs and marshmallows  and drink beer while we worked on getting Chernobyl under containment..... no issues there!
> 
> I have enough pieces of the original wheel to make a casting mold.   I could fill in the missing spoke with some clay putty and sculpt it for all that would be required.    I do, however,  lack the proper sand, the furnace etc to do anything else.   There are two brake rotors that would make a good cast iron soup  ...alas....
> 
> ...



I hear the perfect demo for an Ontario members meet up.


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## Brent H (Oct 27, 2021)

@Susquatch  well indeed  there could be quite the jokes, but I have no time for humour ...nay I say!  hahaha

The marks on the gear seem to indicate something rolled through from one side to the other and only mark the top half of half the gear.  Nothing on the the other side - sort of threaded its way out..

So the lathe was for sale for a while, probably scared people as it was disassembled and well, a project.  The owner "inherited it" as a project and was hard to get a hold of.  We set a date of Monday to go see it and that got pushed to Tuesday of this week.   I flay out to NS on Wednesday so it is cutting things very close.   My one son brings back the work trailer Sunday night ....no word ... Ok ...I build cabinetry and other stuff so I had a gig going for some custom mirrors...fabbing ...painting....nothing.....sent message to seller if he would take E-transfer but setting up to see him Tuesday at 10 am.    @Canadium said he could lend a hand (thank you Ian)  so I had back up...got reply that he was worried about moving it as it was heavy. - Indeed it is... I sent back no worries I am brining my son and we can get it gone if it is all good.  Late Monday - got address and we are a go.......totally blew my Tuesday plans but ...what do ya do....As the Bare Naked Ladies sing..."Drove down town in the Rain...."   On site, made wicked turns to get trailer into drive....Did the checks...decided on the price - transferred cash and my #1 son had the back of the truck loaded in about 10 minutes.  Pulled the head off the lathe and my son lugged that 150 pounds to the truck.  The ways went next - 250 lbs to the truck with the owners son and my boy and then I hauled the base out on a fridge dolly.  Total time -departed at 0815 (North of Barrie to Stoney Creek), back home at 1340 with a lathe and custom cut mirrors.....(Brief stop to pick those up in Barrie and feed the boy.

Put the lathe in the picture poses you see, stripped off some pieces to clean up at work (more pics on that as time progresses) Painted mirror frames....Out this am at 0430 to take pics and then off to NS

Miss Metric is now captivating from afar, however, I do have several of her "delicates" to work on after hours ....wink wink...


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## PeterT (Oct 27, 2021)

I cant quite tell, does the apron have a sealed bottom? or am I looking through the bottom into the chip pan? If its sealed up, I wonder how something got in there & ran across the gears unless something internal let go.

What is the increment of the dials, I've always wondered that on this size of lathe?


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## Susquatch (Oct 27, 2021)

gmihovics said:


> I hear the perfect demo for an Ontario members meet up.


I was thinking the same thing, but from what I have learned about Brent, he will be done that task long before the new year!


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## Brent H (Oct 27, 2021)

@PeterT : Apron bottom is sealed (drain plug fitted) there is an opening at the back above the oil level where it would be possible to for something to enter.  I am thinking, however,  that since this is limited to about half the gear teeth on just that gear, someone had the assembly flipped over and perhaps rolled it across a table top?


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## Susquatch (Oct 27, 2021)

Brent H said:


> @PeterT : Apron bottom is sealed (drain plug fitted) there is an opening at the back above the oil level where it would be possible to for something to enter.  I am thinking, however,  that since this is limited to about half the gear teeth on just that gear, someone had the assembly flipped over and perhaps rolled it across a table top?



The most important thing is that any serious damage by whatever caused that ought to be easy to deal with. From what I can see it only marked the tips of the teeth which don't make contact with any other gears.


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## RobinHood (Oct 27, 2021)

If someone were to open the oil fill port and stick a screwdriver in there (or other such object), it just might make contact with the gear and score it.


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## Brent H (Oct 27, 2021)

@RobinHood : tis true good sir...I will make double sure the oil "plug" does not extend into the apron too far


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## Brent H (Oct 27, 2021)

@RobinHood : did you find a mash of imperial/metrification with your old lathe?  Seems like the lead screw is 7/8" x 4 mm pitch and the cross feed and compound are 1/2" x 2.5 mm pitch  LH and RH  respectively.  argh!


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## RobinHood (Oct 27, 2021)

Yes. Fasteners were imperial. Gears were DP. Only ratios/lead screws and dials were metric.


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## Susquatch (Oct 28, 2021)

Sounds a lot like my mill/drill. It has a managerie of fasteners in it too. Didn't end up metric or SAE where it matters though. Base 11?  Who does that? 

If the gears are normally covered then I think @RobinHood nailed it. Might have been some gunk in the port that they tried to clean out by poking something in there.


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## darrin1200 (Oct 28, 2021)

I am really looking forward to following this build. I think it is a good chance for me to learn a ton.
Thanks for this Brent


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## Brent H (Oct 28, 2021)

@darrin1200: here is a link to the Imperial Utilathe Restoration project  as I see you are also blessed with one of these machines









						Restoration/Repairs on a 10" LD Utilathe - Standard Modern
					

So a few weeks ago I purchased a 10' LD Standard Modern Utilathe  serial number U530.  The serial number is a bit like a submarine so I hope this project stays afloat and the lathe doesn't become a dive site somewhere.  I have not had much time to do anything with it, basically get it home to...




					canadianhobbymetalworkers.com
				




I am hoping this lathe is not quite as intense


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## Mcgyver (Oct 28, 2021)

RobinHood said:


> If someone were to open the oil fill port and stick a screwdriver in there (or other such object), it just might make contact with the gear and score it.



ah, so Brents lathe did originally come out of a school  Probably explains the metric as well for a older lathe....I can remember in high school machine shop when they came around and changed all the leadscrews, feedscrews and gearboxes to metric


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## PeterT (Oct 28, 2021)

I was going to guess the same thing. During The Great Transition (that kind of occurred in fits & spurts depending on what industry you were in) some metric machines started to show up in schools & institutions. According to my buddy who was in trade school then, it was a bit of gong show, at least where he was at. The lathes were replaced, but not the mills or other machines for whatever reason. Maybe they were more expensive or alternatives were inferior. And for a while with they operated swapped metric machines but still had IMP mic's & indicators & measurement tools. The lucky folks were the ones that got the 'redundant' IMP spoils of war as they were auctioned off.


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## Brent H (Oct 30, 2021)

I don't have a lot of parts with me on the ship - carrying things from a lathe on a plane....well that is hard to do.  I did bring a few small pieces - like the feed handles for the cross slide and the compound.  You can see them in the following picture and in what condition they were in.  Only a few parts of the lathe were exposed to the elements for some reason.  The cross slide feed handle was mangled to crap and you can see that it is bent and in the totally wrong orientation.








Some soaking in Evaporust (not sponsored) for a day and then getting the torches out and gradually heating the handle and bending it back into shape, I now have a reasonable cross feed handle with some unique patina:








The compound feed came apart and was soaked and then some light oil and re-assembled:








This next picture is literally looks like a kick in the nut.  The bronze cross slide nut is pretty beat up and I have to replace it.  This nut appears to be a rather rare 1/2" x 2.5 mm pitch trapezoidal SOB that needs to be re-made.  As I was on the Plane I could not take the shaft with me to make a nut and check the fit....ugh!   anyway, the plan is to make 3 taps out of 4140 and harden them to cut new Imperial Metric threads and make the gears for the  threading dial.  I need TR 1/2"x 2.5 mm RH, TR1/2" x 2.5 mm LH and a 7/8" x 4 mm LH tap or hobb for the gears. - this will be fun!










While I am on the ship I am ordering in a bunch of stuff for the lathe: new  (17) truarc ring 5100-156 for the  feed train gear, a new Bijur B5944 oil Sight for the gear box, a new 1-3/8 knob for the feed selector, and a  new 6" cast iron hand wheel for the apron.  That was off my quick inspection list before I left. - Oh and another VFD...

When I get back I will strip things down, remove the paint, weld up and grind any imperfections and see how things are - like bearings and seals.  Then paint and re-assemble.  easy peasy lemon squeezy!

I am working on the metric gear drive fab plans for the threading dial.


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## Brent H (Nov 1, 2021)

Ok, so here we go figuring out the "metrics" of this project.  The threading dial being the elephant in the room....well, the build should be easy ....ah hem...easier....as I only need 2 gears for the threading dial and not 5.  The way my lathe is set up (as is most "school issue" or "converted" ) lathes they only really provide for 13 of the "most used" metric threads.  This means you could cut threads down to M4 with some exceptions and M6 up pretty much good to go.  EXCELLENT!  this also means I only need to make a threading dial that has 2 indications - for reference I included the chart as a PDF and the QCGBX threading chart.  I only require a 30 tooth and a 26 tooth follower gear to mesh with my lead screw.....beauty!






All threads other than: 0.25, 0.50, 0.75, 1.0, 1.25, 1.5, 2.0, 2.5, 3.0, 4.0, 5.0, 6.0, and 8.0 can be disregarded as they are not "metric"  the chart above was done up by some dude on Practical Machinist that has some issues...I mean, you can cut a 1.429 thread pitch but it won't fit anything.

Anyway, according to the chart (see the PDF if you wish)  I only need the 2 gears to make my threading dial.

This would probably greatly simplify any confusion for @Johnwa on his lathe as it will eliminate quite a few divisions on the dial and you only need 2 gear changes verses 5


Now to design an new threading dial that will look sexy and make Miss Metric  more appealing to the folks that may enter the shop and also to Mr. Standard that will be sporting the tooling she can insert....hahaha


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## Johnwa (Nov 2, 2021)

@Brent H here is a couple of pictures of the disassembled thread dial.


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## Johnwa (Nov 2, 2021)

The OD of the gears is as follows
36T 48.33mm
33T 44.52mm
30T 40.65mm
28T 38.1mm
26T 35.6 mm


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## Brent H (Nov 2, 2021)

@Johnwa :  Could you please measure the length and diameter of the rod and what is the thickness of the gears - like the total and then just the gear teeth?

I am doing up a drawing to figure out the positions I need to put those gears in - You are awesome by the way !  thank you very much for the intel


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## Johnwa (Nov 2, 2021)

Gear including hub is 1/2”, gear itself is about 0.2” thick.
the teeth are cut at an angle and the bottom end of the tooth is beveled
the dial is 5/8” thick, large OD is just under 1.375”. The smaller OD is 1”
the length of the shaft is 6”and is 1/2“ OD.


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## Brent H (Nov 3, 2021)

@Johnwa : this is perfect!  I can correct my drawing and will be good for fabrication when I get home


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## Johnwa (Nov 3, 2021)

on the bottom gear there is a punch mark that lines up with the space between two teeth of each gear and the ABC mark on the dial.


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## Johnwa (Nov 3, 2021)

@Brent H based on the gear measurements a Mod 1.25 or a 20 DP gear should mesh with the leadscrew.  I tested a 20 DP gear and it seems to work.  I don’t know what the PA of the gear is.


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## Brent H (Nov 3, 2021)

@Johnwa - awesome intel!  You must be drawing with me as I was wondering about the punch.

Are the gears pressed on?  Looks that way - I would probably key/set screw them. Found a similar lathe for sale on Kijiji and blew up a pic of the threading dial.  Note that there are only 2 gears in use as I was planning to do. 
Looks like the same housing though. Does your lathe GBX list more threads than the regular ones?  Like threads for small screws below 5 mm?
From the math and your calculations it does appear it would be a 20DP cutter (I have a 14.5° PA set) and can do some tests when I get home. 

Excellent info.  I will post my ACAD in a few days


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## Johnwa (Nov 4, 2021)

Yes the gears are pressed on.  My GBX shows 42 threads although at least 2 are duplicates.


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## Brent H (Nov 4, 2021)

@Johnwa : that is crazy!  completely different gear box arrangement from the pitches possible to the feeds possible.  Mine has a max out of 8 mm pitch - the feed rate is 2.842 mm.

The feed rates on Miss Metric match identical to the standard lathe (0.112" = 2.845 mm) .  Probably safe to assume that in my case I have the standard gear box fitted and they swapped out the lead screw to a 4 mm pitch to achieve the desired threading pitch.  I will do some gear box inspection when I get home.

@Johnwa: you must have a more fully converted lathe with a full metric gear box.  

By the way, I am in the process of obtaining a 1/2" x 2.5mm LH tap if you're in need of a new cross feed nut and you have the whack version of a thread like I do.


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## Johnwa (Nov 4, 2021)

I’m pretty sure my lathe came out of the factory as metric.  Even the tailstock has mm graduations.  Most if not all the fasteners are imperial though.  Fortunately it does have the metric/imperial dials on both the compound and cross slide as I usually work in imperial.


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## Brent H (Nov 4, 2021)

@Johnwa : Can you post a pic of your combination dials?  I wonder how those are put together....?


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## Johnwa (Nov 5, 2021)

The mm dial is set screwed to the lead screw.   It has a very fine 100 tooth gear.  The inch dial has a 127 tooth internal gear.  Its center of rotation is offset so only a few of the gears teeth mesh.  One rotation of the handle moves the slide 2.5mm, 5mm on diameter.  Rotating the handle a bit further and the slide moves 0.1” or 0.2” on the diameter.


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## YYCHM (Nov 5, 2021)

Johnwa said:


> The mm dial is set screwed to the lead screw.   It has a very fine 100 tooth gear.  The inch dial has a 127 tooth internal gear.  Its center of rotation is offset so only a few of the gears teeth mesh.  One rotation of the handle moves the slide 2.5mm, 5mm on diameter.  Rotating the handle a bit further and the slide moves 0.1” or 0.2” on the diameter.
> View attachment 18079


If the mm dial is set screwed to the lead screw where does the 100 tooth gear come into play?


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## Johnwa (Nov 5, 2021)

The 100 tooth gear is part of the mm dial and is set screwed to the lead screw.


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## Johnwa (Nov 5, 2021)

I decided to deal with some backlash in the compound so here are some pics of the internals.  Anyone have a ½” hardened washer 0.04” thick?


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## RobinHood (Nov 5, 2021)

Johnwa said:


> Anyone have a ½” hardened washer 0.04” thick?



Let me see what I have when I get back into the shop. Does the OD matter?


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## Johnwa (Nov 5, 2021)

OD is not critical.  ⅞  to 1 ⅛ would work.


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## RobinHood (Nov 5, 2021)

This is an M12 hardened washer. Dimensions on the side.

I would have to surface grind the washer to 0.040”.


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## Johnwa (Nov 5, 2021)

@RobinHood Thanks for the offer but I think solved my problem.  I made a 0.034 brass washer, which fits between two existing hardened washers. There is still a slight bit of backlash but it’s pretty good.


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## RobinHood (Nov 5, 2021)

Ok. Sounds like a good solution.


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