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Electric panel questions.

Before you guys get the wrong idea - I agree with just about everything above.

However: buying a small car, like a Prius or Leaf, has slightly less impact than buying a F250, etc. All choices can be done on 'doing better' approach - the reason why this discussion gets polarized is that the matter is probably more urgent then that *average* person believes.

My friend bought a 2003 Prius with a 'bad' battery. He removed the battery, disassembled it and replaced 2 dead metal hydride cells, and now drives it very day, getting about 40 miles per gallon in the city. I know - tiny impact, but he's trying...

I try to use my more economical Mazda instead of my gas-guzzling GMC truck for everything I can, including buying lumber, as it costs me less, and i have a little better impact on everything else.

I'd be happy with any EV if I could afford it, AND I could park it where it wouldn't ruin the battery AND, AND, etc. - The recyclability of the batteries concerns me, and a few other details.

I'm trying to be optimistic that they will refine this stuff and get it right.
 
Perry said:
@Susquatch
Oh, I'm not a big fan of the EV's. I don't think it has been thought thru 100% yet. Green my butt. lol. The problem is we will be forced to follow the master plan whether we like it or not.

Reading online I think the number is $200/Kw of battery size is the estimate to replace the battery in one of the machines. A Nissan Leaf should cost around $5000-6000 dollars. A Canadian posted online they wanted $15000 to replace the battery in his 2013 model. This is a disposable car at that price.

A green friend of mine tells me "but there is no maintenance on a EV so the cost averages out". Most of us here are smart enough to realize just because the motor is electric does not mean the maintenance goes away.

Good article here is you are bored.
www.recurrentauto.com

Electric Car Battery Replacement Costs

When it comes to electric vehicles and plug-in hybrids, many shoppers wonder how long it will be until they have to replace their battery. Then what will it cost to replace that battery?
www.recurrentauto.com www.recurrentauto.com

@Hacker, I've been searching. Already posted a want ad on Kijiji.


@Hacker and @RobinHood I'm pretty green in the electrical area. I would need to read up a little more on what I'm allowed. I did figure running a conduit might be an option. I'm guessing I can drop down to the #8 size because the wires are separate in the conduit?
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#8 is good for 55A but there are some factors that have to be considered in regards to the conduit and the distance so it would be best to consult with an electrician or electrical inspector. If you are sitting on the fence on this it may be more cost effective to just install the conduit and ensure there is a space for the breaker and install if and when it is needed. Just make sure the conduit is large enough for the wire.
 
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Perry said:
Definitely not carbon neutral or green. In the old days when people were homesteading this country, what did they do with their trash? They threw it in a coulee or down a river bank. They never left it on the fields or in their yards. Out of sight out of mind. Nothing has changed. Everyone complains about the pollution China (or basically any other slave world country) creates, but this is our pollution. Out of sight out of mind. These EV's sound good but what we don't see is the problem. A lot of this problem is being hidden from us in other countries.

Serious about climate change? Stop population growth. Population neutral. The carbon rebate rewards larger families. Who is going to have a bigger carbon foot print?

Come up with real alternate ideas. Do we need the size of car we presently use? What if cities designated some major roads (North-south, East-west type corridors) to be used only by alternative type vehicles. When I say alternative I mean, electric bikes, maybe electric type/size golf carts, small energy efficient vehicles that wouldn't survive well in a crash with regular vehicles. Most people don't need the speed and size of a conventional vehicle for the small trips around a city. I can see in Canada where a small vehicle with an enclosed heated cab that could do maybe 30 mph would be more then sufficient in a city setting. Ride share vehicles like Car2go or even the E-scooters are a good idea. There has to other ideas that would even be better then my example.


Sorry for the rant.....touchy subject for me.


I though about the portable generator idea also. You know there will be a need for it. My guess is you will be charging people just a couple kms from their home. The car use to make the trip but as the battery slowly deteriorates away you get less and less range. Everything is great when it's new.
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Pretty sure I’ve shared this story- Sunday afternoon hooked the big horse to the trailer to go to work. Moved in front of my shop checked fluids and what not, let it warm up. This guy with a POS EV walked up the drive wondered if I could give him a push. He wanted me to move my pickup behind his POS, sit on my bumper, and use his legs as a shock absorber to push the car up the drive. After 20 minutes of this, his hands were cold, his legs were tired and we’d made it 75 feet. I asked if he seriously didn’t have anything to pull it from the front. He replied he had a tow hook that screws in

:mad:

So back to the shop, grabbed a chain, spun the tow hook in, yanked him up to the closest barn and he discovered his charge cable was too short and could he borrow an extension cord

:mad:

So I did some paperwork while the POS charged. As pointed out above, it’s ironic an EV prevented a diesel rig from going to work and had to be rescued by a smaller diesel powered pickup :D

I’m sorry I’m just not sold on the idea, in Canada
 
I look at EVs today like the way it was when the personal computer came out. I remember my dad saying "what would you ever need one of those". Time, technology improvements and a different way of doing things and they will be part of our everyday lives. It is just a matter of time.
PS I was driving down the Henday Bypass today and a Tesla passed me and his licence plate read OIL LOL. I sure had a good LOL over that, the guy had large ones driving around Edmonton with that plate.
 
I'm a tech at a Kia dealership. We have a bunch of hybrids, EV's and PHEV's out there that we service. Very few issues with them. We've changed one battery on an older car, which i believe was covered by the factory extended warranty. I drove a new Niro EV the other day, and was quite impressed with how hard it pulls. In a small city like Thunder Bay, an EV makes a lot of sense. A PHEV will never leave you stranded though.

The new Kia EV6 GT is going to be fun:

Later in 2022 we'll see the fastest, most powerful Kia in history in the form of the 576-hp, 546-lb-ft dual-motor EV6 GT, said to be good for hitting 60 mph in 3.5 seconds en route to a top speed of 162 mph.
 
Everyone in this thread, myself included, is destined to be mocked by our kids and grandkids for our resistance to change. It’s inevitable.

That being said, the problem isn't carbon emissions; that’s just a symptom. It’s too many darn people on this planet.

I feel lucky to be able to afford metal just to play around with in my shop as a hobby. But recognize at some point a resource like this could be reserved for the rich as well. Point is times change. As dramatic as we think it is, it pales in comparison to what happened during the Victorian era, which (coincidentally) is when the first electric car was invented. Imagine a world that skipped the internal combustion engine and went to electric Hanson Cabs.
 
Maybe a vehicle design with a quick change battery would be a better approach. Standardize the battery sizes.....Like an A cell , C cell, etc. They could be leased out to owners and changed out on the road if required for a fast top up. That way the batteries could be maintained by a central authority and recycled/replaced as required.

Down the line if a better power source is created then it could be build into the standard battery size and used in the existing vehicles.

If I get the wire I need to install this plug in , maybe I should list my garage as an emergency charging station for those caught in a bind. :)
 
Perry said:
Maybe a vehicle design with a quick change battery would be a better approach. Standardize the battery sizes.....Like an A cell , C cell, etc. They could be leased out to owners and changed out on the road if required for a fast top up. That way the batteries could be maintained by a central authority and recycled/replaced as required.

Down the line if a better power source is created then it could be build into the standard battery size and used in the existing vehicles.

If I get the wire I need to install this plug in , maybe I should list my garage as an emergency charging station for those caught in a bind. :)
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They have fast charging station that will fully charge a battery in 20 minutes. If you just need to go 100 km's more before you get home or wherever, it might only take 5 minutes

The batteries are extremely heavy. Like 1000lbs. Not something you want to be changing out.
 
dfloen said:
If you just need to go 100 km's more before you get home or wherever, it might only take 5 minutes
Click to expand...

Do the charge gauges in those things display range? Purchase re-charges by the coulomb?
 
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Ok there is no 6/3 NMD90 to be had. My back up plan is what you gents had suggested, but I'm going to need a little guidance.


From what I understand I can run four 6 gauge conductors inside Sch40 PVC.

Is 3/4" PVC large enough for 4 conductor fill?

Can the ground wire be bare or does it need to be insulated?

1" PVC is not that much more then 3/4". Should I just install the 1" and give myself options for down the line?

I think I'm good on this one, but do rules 12-1108 and 12-942 . 4 - 90 degree bends max. in the PVC run?

The electric panel and the 240 plug are on two adjacent walls. Can I run the conduit at 45 degree angle above the ceiling joists or is it better practice to run it parallel to the plug wall, turn 90 degrees and then run parallel to the panel wall? Going with the joists and 90 degrees to the joists.


Having never done this before this question may seem a little strange to those of you who have. Does it matter which direction to assemble the conduit? There is female shaped end on the conduit so you can join the conduits together. Should I be starting the run with the female fitting facing the meter and working toward my plug box? (I know that I will have to add a stub and a threaded end to attach to the electric panel or the box) I don't think it matters, but you never know.

Thank you in advance.
 
Perry said:
Is 3/4" PVC large enough for 4 conductor fill?
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yes.

Perry said:
Can the ground wire be bare or does it need to be insulated?
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Bare, in my understanding is fine.
Perry said:
1" PVC is not that much more then 3/4". Should I just install the 1" and give myself options for down the line?
Click to expand...
I pulled 2" conduit when I did mine. Future-proofing.:p
Perry said:
direction to assemble the conduit?
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My conduit was all glued, as per my Electrician's requirement. The inspector didn't care what it was, it seemed at the time (27 yrs ago)

--- way back then they insisted I pull #4 NMD90 -INSIDE- the conduit. I don't know why. but that's what I have.
 
Seeing how you already have some answers I will cover some of the other questions.
Perry said:
The electric panel and the 240 plug are on two adjacent walls. Can I run the conduit at 45 degree angle above the ceiling joists or is it better practice to run it parallel to the plug wall, turn 90 degrees and then run parallel to the panel wall? Going with the joists and 90 degrees to the joists.
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I don't believe there is anything in the code about that. From an appearance and professional look running parallel or perpendicular with the walls is preferred and using 90 or 2 - 45 degree sweeps. If you are oversizing the conduit then go with the 90's. It is a relatively short distance and there is lots of room in the conduit for the wires to go around the corners. 1 inch is fine and if the run is short nothing wrong with 2" but it is 3X the price of 1".
Perry said:
Having never done this before this question may seem a little strange to those of you who have. Does it matter which direction to assemble the conduit? There is female shaped end on the conduit so you can join the conduits together. Should I be starting the run with the female fitting facing the meter and working toward my plug box? (I know that I will have to add a stub and a threaded end to attach to the electric panel or the box) I don't think it matters, but you never know.
Click to expand...
No but we always started with the bell mouth (female) end going to the next box or load. It saves buying couplers as when you cut the Carlon you always have a splice for the next run.
 
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