Tool Tooling up a milling machine

[Downwindtracker2]

Just a glance at R8 collets suggests they might be pretty mickey mouse. I say this from unhappy experiences with router bits in various routers. Thank you Sears for teaching me about junk. Heavy sarcasm. My Elu router, which happens to be DeWalt yellow, uses multiple cuts to clamp. I came into a EG-100 collet set , so that's what I use on my mill/drill.

 

[Susquatch]

Just a glance at R8 collets suggests they might be pretty mickey mouse.

That about sums it up. I have a few R8 collets, but rarely use them anymore. I vastly prefer ER.

I'm not planning to pitch my R8 collets anytime soon though.......

 

[trevj]

Well, I was having such a nice day...and then you had to bring up that reminder of the nightmare that you mention.

The house I am living in started life on an acreage in west Calgary in 1976. The developer I was working for (2003) was going to demolish the house but the wife & I decided to load it onto a truck and move it 200 km . The loading & moving and unloading was a snap. We had the new foundation & basement walls commercially built and that was a measurement to measurement situation that went perfect (That house came down perfect on 5 of the six corners and the one that was out was out 1/4")
Now is where the nightmares started, my first idea was to just hook the old house fittings up to the new but in short order that idea went out the door...we ended up stripping every old tank, sink, sitter, and pipe & connector and from the old frame & replacing with new. Cast & copper went out the door and Pex & braided was installed.
Moving & rebuilding that old house was marginally cheaper ( the move alone eat up $35,000) than building new but dont ever let anyone tell you that it is "less work" because their wrong.

Sorry to hear that turned in to a schmozzle.

The main point being, in their effort to go metric, in the 1970's, the Canadian Schools stopped teaching the Imperial measures, which bit them in the arse, when it came time to teach everyone from trades to engineers, those very legacy systems, in order that they be able to deal with systems already in place.

To make the tool work for you, you must be at least ten percent smarter than the tool! That leaves LOTS of room, for enough brains to be fluent in the use of both inch and metric measurements, even if it is only that you have a poster on the wall with the number 25.4 on it, and a pocket calculator.

 

[Dabbler]

I've never had any problem with the R8 system. I also have the ER40 system with a whole set of collets, but I use them a lot less. I never aggressively mill, which might help, But in 40 odd years I haven't had any pullout.

... that being said, the R8 system is far poorer desigh that the ER system. In every way the ER system is better. I just got used to my R8 collets, and so I use them more often...

 

[trevj]

I've never had any problem with the R8 system. I also have the ER40 system with a whole set of collets, but I use them a lot less. I never aggressively mill, which might help, But in 40 odd years I haven't had any pullout.

... that being said, the R8 system is far poorer desigh that the ER system. In every way the ER system is better. I just got used to my R8 collets, and so I use them more often...

The taper on an R-8 is the same taper used on the INT-30, aka 30 size, tool taper.
I am surprised that a collet with a drilled and tapped Weldon shank screw is not commonly available. The main advantage to having R-8 collets, rather than an End Mill Holder, is the reduction in lost headspace, between the spindle and table, and I could see a use for such as I described. Maybe I just have not looked in the right places...

 

[PaulL]

I did "tools for my tools" as starter projects. The Harold Hall grinding rest has plenty of complexity, but is very forgiving. Same with his simple indexing jig.
They taught me more about what tooling I need than anything I read.

 

[justin1]

Ye I had my eye on few project builds on YouTube that I want to try one of the first being either belt grinder or 50t hydraulic press plus set of fingers for it to make a nice 4 foot brake press

I've kinda has my eye on those hss grinders with all the compound angles after I watched a fellow on YouTube make some tools for the lathe but he used it in conjunction with a small surface grinder made a pretty nice looking stuff and the tool it's self doesn't seem super expensive for what it is for making one off tools

Amazon link for thingy

INTSUPERMAI U2 Universal Cutter Grinder Sharpener for End Mill Lathe Cutter 220V : Amazon.ca: Tools & Home Improvement

INTSUPERMAI U2 Universal Cutter Grinder Sharpener for End Mill Lathe Cutter 220V : Amazon.ca: Tools & Home Improvement

a.co

 

[Susquatch]

Amazon link for thingy

What looks like the identical model is a few hundred on Ali.

But shipping is 600.

If you could find a way around the shipping it might be worth considering.

 

[little ol' e]

What looks like the identical model is a few hundred on Ali.

But shipping is 600.

If you could find a way around the shipping it might be worth considering.

Good ol' Ali.

I think its more like $540 carbon tax with $60 shipping.

Ali tug boat with oars.
May want to add the optional Ali container hook & rope package deal if travelling alone thou...

 

[Mcgyver]

What looks like the identical model is a few hundred on Ali.

But shipping is 600.

Might really help from the tax perspective. HST and doorstep extortion fee based on 200 not 800?

 

[Former Member]

I h

Ye I had my eye on few project builds on YouTube that I want to try one of the first being either belt grinder or 50t hydraulic press plus set of fingers for it to make a nice 4 foot brake press

I've kinda has my eye on those hss grinders with all the compound angles after I watched a fellow on YouTube make some tools for the lathe but he used it in conjunction with a small surface grinder made a pretty nice looking stuff and the tool it's self doesn't seem super expensive for what it is for making one off tools

Amazon link for thingy

INTSUPERMAI U2 Universal Cutter Grinder Sharpener for End Mill Lathe Cutter 220V : Amazon.ca: Tools & Home Improvement

INTSUPERMAI U2 Universal Cutter Grinder Sharpener for End Mill Lathe Cutter 220V : Amazon.ca: Tools & Home Improvement

a.co

I have the Shars version, why? 5C collets as you a good range of precise sizes, 8R and the original versions have a more limited range and costly range. The second advantage 5c lets you use collet chucks on the lathe and collet blocks so common holders.

As you get into this, you will find the more commonality you have the less costly all this becomes (aside from storage space which we all don't have enough off).

Finally the good thing is from Shars you can also get the wheel holders, belts and it is a nice machine. Expect to invest in some angled cutters otherwise center cutting ends mills is a no go.

Final comment, there is little documentation on how to sharpen these particularly, however when I do it, I will post a proceedure.

Given enough money I would have gone with a Journeyman Grinder with airbearings and better precision.

 

[StevSmar]

They don't generally pull out catastrophically…. So what I've collected is 1/2-1"…

Thankyou! I’ll use that as a rule of thumb while I’m learning. 1/2” or above I’ll start thinking about a end-mill holder.

 

[justin1]

New revised list of stuff I'm looking at getting for my new to me mill, I've removed the cheap rotary and tilting table I don't think I'll need them right away so I'm gonna see what comes up used and also see if I can learn some work arounds for now if I do find the need for one.

Found a different supplier of carbide endmills who sell 5 packs so I've went with them there also not the hrc 65 stuff so bit cheaper so I could get more of them as thinking about probly easier to break the harder stuff and the hardest thing I'll be working with knowingly is 4130 and some of it's variants kinda top out at hrc 48ish.

Im gonna skip adding some 2 flute end mills on this order as I got some cheap hss ones for KMS tools for odd aluminum stuff.

As far as vises go haven't pulled the trigger on anything yet I'm bouncing between professional grade vs hobby grade still I'm kinda tempted to get med range vise and buy a granite surface plate and fool around with tuning a hobby grade vise(gives me reasons to buy more shit lol)

Also added some lathe stuff on this order as one of my holders is getting kinda worn out and probly gonna die soon

 

[little ol' e]

New revised list of stuff I'm looking at getting for my new to me mill, I've removed the cheap rotary and tilting table I don't think I'll need them right away so I'm gonna see what comes up used and also see if I can learn some work arounds for now if I do find the need for one.

You made a good decision removing them!

 

[thestelster]

I use my milling machine to drill holes multiple times during the day, and if I had to undo the drawbar everytime, I swapped the drill chuck to a collet, I'd go nuts!! I have an ER40 collet chuck on the mill 95% of the time. My drill chuck is a keyless chuck with 5/8" straight shank. So when I need to swap an endmill for the drill, it happens immediately. I don't have to stand on my tip toes, loosen the draw bar with a wrench, get the lead hammer, hit the draw bar, unscrew it completely, remove the tool, clean the spindle pocket, install the drill, tighten the drawbar.

Consider getting a straight shank arbor for your drill chuck.

 

[justin1]

I use my milling machine to drill holes multiple times during the day, and if I had to undo the drawbar everytime, I swapped the drill chuck to a collet, I'd go nuts!! I have an ER40 collet chuck on the mill 95% of the time. My drill chuck is a keyless chuck with 5/8" straight shank. So when I need to swap an endmill for the drill, it happens immediately. I don't have to stand on my tip toes, loosen the draw bar with a wrench, get the lead hammer, hit the draw bar, unscrew it completely, remove the tool, clean the spindle pocket, install the drill, tighten the drawbar.

Consider getting a straight shank arbor for your drill chuck.

Is there much worry about spinning out in the collet when using larger drill bits eg. Anything over 1" as I currently only got the er32 and a 3/4 eoc 25 collet which is most likely the one I would use if I was gonna do straight shank on chuck

 

[thestelster]

Is there much worry about spinning out in the collet when using larger drill bits eg. Anything over 1" as I currently only got the er32 and a 3/4 eoc 25 collet which is most likely the one I would use if I was gonna do straight shank on chuck

Well, yes. But how often do you drill holes larger than 1/2", and if you do, don't chuck them in the drill chuck, put them in a collet, (up to 1").

Though, I do have a #40 arbor attached to a keyed Jacobs, specifically so that I can utilze large hole saws.

 

[justin1]

Well, yes. But how often do you drill holes larger than 1/2", and if you do, don't chuck them in the drill chuck, put them in a collet, (up to 1").

Though, I do have a #40 arbor attached to a keyed Jacobs, specifically so that I can utilze large hole saws.

I use then often enough but hoping to start using boring bar for the larger holes anyway as after you get past 1" drill bits start getting more money lol. And most of my drill bits are of the 1/2 shaft flavor. I got some bigger guys running around not sure what drawer or tool box there in atm still in the organization phase.

So it would be worth while maybe having a larger keyed chuck mounted to #40 then a keyless on a straight shaft?

 

[Mcgyver]

jeez....can't believe I forget a boring head on my original list. You' likely never drill ove 1", and even greater than 1/2", the boring head will do the job until you collect a bunch of taper shank drills.

It would be soon after a vise in my prioritization.

 

[thestelster]

I use then often enough but hoping to start using boring bar for the larger holes anyway as after you get past 1" drill bits start getting more money lol. And most of my drill bits are of the 1/2 shaft flavor. I got some bigger guys running around not sure what drawer or tool box there in atm still in the organization phase.

So it would be worth while maybe having a larger keyed chuck mounted to #40 then a keyless on a straight shaft?

My apologies. For me, 99% of the time I use drill bits under 1/2", and of that time, 70% is under 1/4". So it all depends on what you plan on doing.