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New vise jaw product

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Vendor
87765BB3-3774-4449-96F8-D5CEC86AF271.jpeg I did another test of the slot. The previous attempt the slot ended up being 0.950". I tracked down that problem to using a 1/2" EM in the program but the machine had a 12mm EM. That accounted for most of the 0.050" too small. However I did the job again using an adaptive tool path and 0.15" step downs. See picture and you can see the milling lines showing the adaptive pattern. Results however were still a bit small. The slot measures 0.995" wide at the top and 0.990 at the bottom. It should be 1.000".

I have a couple ideas - #1 don't use adaptive instead use straight slot milling. #2 just run the program again and see if a spring pass removes that remaining 0.005 to 0.010". Thoughts ?



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CWret

Ultra Member
Premium Member
- I agree with @RobinHood that deflection appears to be the issue and a larger EM would help or eliminate the problem (pardon my total lack of milling experience, but I don't know the meaning of "spring passes"). Keeping the EM as short as possible will also help.
- At the start of cutting down into the notch, the material below the EM is keeping the relatively short columns from defecting and any deflection is coming from the EM. But during the last few passes, the increasing height of the columns could cause the columns to deflect. Then both the EM and the column height are contributing to the total deflection (particularly if the columns were thinner or taller). I think this problem would be worse if you rough-cut the notch ID to say 0.980" and then did a full-height finish cut of 0.010" off of both columns.
- It appears that you are clamping the bottom of the part (pic in post 109) and you are milling in a N-S direction (y-axis). Consider rotating the part 90 degrees, lower it as low as possible in the vise and then mill E-W (x-axis) so that the vise jaws can (help) keep the columns from deflecting. Alternately, If you want to mill N-S (because of program, view, where you put your beer, or whatever) then rotate both the vise and the part 90 degrees so that you can lower the part in the vise.

Craig
 

lmjunk

Brand New Member
Turns out Norgen the manufacturer has detailed CAD models on their web site. Hiding inside are some very sophisticated parts. The mechanism to hold all the vise fingers tight has some sliding angled bits. It has to hold all the fingers tight and also hold them tight against the side of the vise sled. below you can see this mechanism with parts hidden on the right, the same view on the left showing the vise sled and vise fingers, and below some of the insides of the sliding angle part. I don't understand it. inside there is a cone that has threads and somehow is connected to mvoe the sliding angled part?

$6K does not seem so unreasonable to me now - this must have taken a lot of design and testing work to get it working well. I wonder what it cost them to develop?


View attachment 23035

View attachment 23036
I am studying machine design and would really like to take a look at the CAD files for this as it seems to hold some complex design strategies.
I looked at the link but for life of can't find where I can download them from.
Do you think you could send me a link or even the files themselves?
Thanks
 

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Vendor
Studying machine design? formally? Where? How Imjunk? I don't see the links for the CAD files either anymore.
 

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Vendor
@imjunk you seem to be a new member. Welcome aboard. Are you an international member? What machines do you have and what are you working on?
 

kevin.decelles

Jack of all trades -- Master of none
Premium Member
Timely post @Janger . I watched a video the other night on a similar flexible design vise but it used a resovoir filled with small ball bearings. There is an air gap and as you close the vise the balls are shifted/squeezed to make room. Eventually all the space is full and the jaws cannot move.

Problem is I don’t remember where I watched it. Still looking. Cool concept
 

Tom O

Ultra Member
Timely post @Janger . I watched a video the other night on a similar flexible design vise but it used a resovoir filled with small ball bearings. There is an air gap and as you close the vise the balls are shifted/squeezed to make room. Eventually all the space is full and the jaws cannot move.

Problem is I don’t remember where I watched it. Still looking. Cool concept
I saw the same one too found it!
 
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Janger

(John)
Administrator
Vendor
Funny shaker can shaker - some sort of fixture (3d printed?) with a strap holding the can to a sawzall. Neat idea.

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Janger

(John)
Administrator
Vendor
The video is more of a how to restore the vise and a lot less on how it actually works (humph). The ball bearing part makes sense - as you tighten the vise the space behind the jaws shrinks until it is all gone and the jaws tighten against the balls. The bar though passing under the jaw teeth is less clear what it is doing. I grabbed a couple screen captures - it appears to have a rectangular section cut out of the bar and the bar rotates I think to hit a flat on the teeth. I'm not certain though what it is doing. Is that a small lip on the bar? When you tighten the handle what is happening exactly? On the norgren I think the side handle clamps the fingers together. Not sure what is happening here.

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CWret

Ultra Member
Premium Member
The ball bearing flexible jaw vise is both ingenious and relatively simple. Or should I say simply amazing.
Sawzall can shaker - I cut off the bristle portion of a SS brush and attached that to an old sawsall blade. It works great for cleaning aluminum before welding.
 

CWret

Ultra Member
Premium Member
@Janger - In your post 109 above you had an issue with your vise speed wrench - here is my Version 2.0 of a speed wrench. The handle portion is a bit heavy so that when it is closed it is balanced. Version 1.0 didn’t work as well because it could conflict with the Y axis feed wheel. This one is more compact when closed. It spins quick & easily, has no conflicts, and when open it’s longer than a standard vise wrench.
Version 3.0 is coming soon (maybe). It will be made from aluminum and have an improved detent (out of the way the back) to hold it in both the open and closed positions. 38A5E255-BF1A-4972-A087-C5FAC561178E.jpeg 74C4DAF5-01E0-491C-BDE4-CF76A6FAB539.jpeg D4B32903-5BF6-456E-9DDD-103056C6D6E8.jpeg
 

LenVW

Process Machinery Designer
Excellent example of an adaptive ‘grip’ vise.
The metal balls serve as the ‘fluid’ to clamp the uneven surfaces of the parts.

As with hydraulics, the force exerted on a fluid is transmitted equally in all directions.
Law of Newtonian Physics.
 

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Vendor
@Janger - In your post 109 above you had an issue with your vise speed wrench - here is my Version 2.0 of a speed wrench. The handle portion is a bit heavy so that when it is closed it is balanced. Version 1.0 didn’t work as well because it could conflict with the Y axis feed wheel. This one is more compact when closed. It spins quick & easily, has no conflicts, and when open it’s longer than a standard vise wrench.
Version 3.0 is coming soon (maybe). It will be made from aluminum and have an improved detent (out of the way the back) to hold it in both the open and closed positions.
Cool handle. I like the detent.
 

RobinHood

Ultra Member
Premium Member
The bar though passing under the jaw teeth is less clear what it is doing. I grabbed a couple screen captures - it appears to have a rectangular section cut out of the bar and the bar rotates I think to hit a flat on the teeth. I'm not certain though what it is doing. Is that a small lip on the bar? When you tighten the handle what is happening exactly?

In a nutshell, it resets the jaws from their “adapted“ position to the fully extended, ”even” position. The cam underneath the jaws engages in the notch in the bottom of each jaw and the rotation of the cam, with the reset lever on the side, moves the jaws out.

87886A17-10D8-40F5-B0EE-0832312D6714.jpeg

The flat, milled out section on the cam is needed so that the jaws can slide back over the cam when the vice is tightened and the jaws “adapt“.

4605308E-5B09-4024-9ACF-FD5D91F79C61.jpeg

Edit: The sketch shows the max travel of a jaw. The steel balls may stop it before it reaches its rear limit, depending on the shape of the object being clamped.

Sorry for the ‘napkin CAD’… don’t have any computer CAD software.
 

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Vendor
In a nutshell, it resets the jaws from their “adapted“ position to the fully extended, ”even” position. The cam underneath the jaws engages in the notch in the bottom of each jaw and the rotation of the cam, with the reset lever on the side, moves the jaws out.

Sorry for the ‘napkin CAD’… don’t have any computer CAD software
Great post Rudy I think you've explained it well.
 
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