Other Basic Electronics, Multimeters, & Oscilloscopes

This thread is about basic electrical, electronics, Multimeters, and Oscilloscopes. It is an outcome of interest that various members have expressed about these subjects.

@Janger , @Johnwa , and @kevin.decelles have all recently obtained a starter Oscilloscope so I think the timing is good for a thread like this.

The primary resource will be a book (available on Amazon in paper or kindle) called Electronics for Dummies by Kathleen Shamieh. The book isn't a requirement, but it always helps to have a reference of some kind to facilitate discussion. Other references might get added as the thread progresses.

I'm not picturing this thread as a course, just a good place to ask questions, find answers, and share knowledge and experience about basic electrical knowledge and testing.

As always, a good time and lots of great jokes are expected!

 

[SomeGuy]

Here's what I'm rocking:



There were a couple of my very first YouTube videos lol times have changed...

 

[Susquatch]

This is because the manufacturers only do a single hardware revision, and nerf features through firmware.

Of course, the only legal way to do this is by paying the manufacturer for the appropriate licenses and inputting their unlock codes.

I dunno, seems like a bit of a stretch for a product like this. There can't be much brand loyalty in the bottom end stuff. I would think competition would flat out tromp any company that tried that at the bottom end with much fancier models for the same price as their competition's nerfed out model. But I don't know that. Just guessing.

I'm also thinking we won't see much added to a 1014 at this point. The huge pricing cuts we have seen recently suggest a brand new greatly upgraded model coming right around the corner.

But who knows, maybe the code Crackers will find a goldmine under the covers.

 

[Upnorth]

For those of you looking for an oscilloscope they turn up often on the federal government website. GC Surplus.

Mine came from a local vocational school. They were shutting down the electronics training so they sold everything cheap. I got a dual trace oscilloscope, frequency counter, function generator, small power supply, and a logic probe for $70 total.

 

[whydontu]

For those of you looking for an oscilloscope they turn up often on the federal government website. GC Surplus.

Mine came from a local vocational school. They were shutting down the electronics training so they sold everything cheap. I got a dual trace oscilloscope, frequency counter, function generator, small power supply, and a logic probe for $70 total.

Cuz who needs techs to be able to fix all that computer stuff? Just junk it, throw it in recycling and buy new. We are so short sighted sometimes. Old guy rant. Back in my day schools had shops. Fellow I used to hang around with rebuilt a 9-cylinder Wright radial in their Grade 12 auto mech class. Now the cost of running a shop and insurance in case Little Johnny does something stupid is perceived as a wasted expense. Not everyone has the ability to write code.

 

[Johnwa]

The Rigol 50MHz oscilloscopes could be hacked to 100MHz. I’m a bit sceptical though.
It may well of been packaged as 50MHz as a way of utilizing boards that didn’t meet 100MHz specs.

Update: 50MHz To 100Mhz Scope Conversion

Changing this 50MHz Rigol oscilloscope into its larger, more expensive brother just became quite a bit easier. When we originally looked at this hack it required pulling some capacitors off of the …

hackaday.com

 

[Canadium]

My 80's vintage Iwatsu SS-5706 looks like a fossil next to some of the new entry level scopes.

At least it looks to be in good shape! My old Hitachi was badly abused before I got my hands on it.

 

[Susquatch]

Ok you guys, this isn't supposed to be an electronics bragging corner. It's a New Oscilloscope USER thread. I don't think it helps new users enjoy their stuff much if all they see here is fancy things to drool over.

I guess I'm as guilty as the next guy so if someone wants to start a "My Electronics Workshop and Equipment" bragging thread, I'll happily add my own stuff and move everything like that from here to there.

Everyone will get lots of time to pitch in and help the new users get the most out of their new Scopes and multimeters, or maybe get a few guys that have not taken the plunge yet but are on the edge to dive in and get one too.

 

[Susquatch]

I checked the update version on my buddy's 1014 after getting his permission to do so. It's fully up to date. It doesn't look like there has been an update in years.

I have also played with it a bit today. I like it more and more each time I use it.

That center column of buttons and display are basically a multimeter type function. Each box displays what it was preset to display (eg peak voltage, RMS voltage, frequency, duty cycle, etc). You can preset them by pushing the button next to the box you want to change, and then press up/dwn/right/left to choose what you want, then press the button again or press ok.



As you can see, I have chosen frequency for the third box from the top and the frequency of channel A is displayed in that box. There are 6 buttons that can be preset like this for 12 functions on either channel. It's very nice and very intuitive.

 

[Chicken lights]

Ok you guys, this isn't supposed to be an electronics bragging corner. It's a New Oscilloscope USER thread. I don't think it helps new users

-----> multimeters

Can we ask electronic questions in here?

 

[Susquatch]

I did some simple testing using the same setup that previously showed for my Fluke Scope Meter - a display of the voltage on my spindle motor running at low speed.



This was very interesting. It clearly shows some voltage spikes on the start of each on cycle. This also showed up as VPP 194V in box 1
vs VP 145V in box 2.
Freq was 17khz
Duty cycle 9%

Nice!

Then I turned up the speed.



Lots of cool stuff going on here.....

VPP 194V
VP 145V
Freq 16.9KHz
Duty Cycle 21%

But look at the noise at the beginning and end of the on switch.....

I assume this is the brushes and the on transistors. I'd have to take the box apart to know for sure and it works so I don't plan to do that. Other ideas?

And look at the ringing at the beginning of each flat section.
This is probably inductive resonance, but who knows till you check it out. Again, other ideas?

I couldn't go faster as the motor was just sitting on VBlocks and I didnt want to risk reaching launch speed.....

So far I love it. It's a very nice scope and I even prefer it over my Fluke (for now.....) LOL.....

 

[Susquatch]

Can we ask electronic questions in here?

Absolutely. That goes hand in hand with using Multimeters and Oscilloscopes. The book we all got is called Electronics for Dummies.

 

[Chicken lights]

Pretty standard wiring (except the green and yellow colours). Green is power, yellow to white is ground

Why does the ground need to be daisy chained?

Why not ground yellow to the panel then ground each light by itself?

 

[Susquatch]

Pretty standard wiring (except the green and yellow colours). Green is power, yellow to white is ground

Why does the ground need to be daisy chained?

Why not ground yellow to the panel then ground each light by itself?

You can do that and it will work. But generally speaking, it isn't a good plan to use the body of anything as the path to ground. The body can be grounded, but shouldn't be the ground path. Otherwise, if the ground became disconnected and there was a short, then the panel would look for another way home and that might be through you.

Ideally everything, including the panel itself, has a wired path to ground.

If that dogs breakfast is building lighting (as opposed to truck or trailer), then it's also code to have fully wired grounds.

 

[Chicken lights]

You can do that and it will work. But generally speaking, it isn't a good plan to use the body of anything as the path to ground. The body can be grounded, but shouldn't be the ground path. Otherwise, if the ground became disconnected and there was a short, then the panel would look for another way home and that might be through you.

Ideally everything, including the panel itself, has a wired path to ground.

If that dogs breakfast is building lighting (as opposed to truck or trailer), then it's also code to have fully wired grounds.

But yellow is still the wired path to ground? So what's the problem? If there's a short the fuse pops on the green circuit

 

[Susquatch]

But yellow is still the wired path to ground? So what's the problem? If there's a short the fuse pops on the green circuit

I'm not sure what you are asking. You never mentioned a problem in your first post.

 

[Chicken lights]

I'm not sure what you are asking. You never mentioned a problem in your first post.

Does ground need to be daisy chained?

 

[Susquatch]

Does ground need to be daisy chained?

Yes, it should be. But it will work even if not.

The reason you need a wired ground is to prevent a human or a kitty cat from becoming the ground. You are not going to provide enough current even if you are soaking wet to blow a breaker. But you could have a heart attack and die. So you always want a wired ground to do the grounding instead of the panel.

 

[Susquatch]

Does ground need to be daisy chained?

I should add that if that is a 12V automotive system, you should still have a wired ground. Shocks are generally not an issue below 30V, but corrosion is. You don't want electrical current flowing through parts. You want all the current flowing through wires.

 

[Chicken lights]

Yes, it should be. But it will work even if not.

The reason you need a wired ground is to prevent a human or a kitty cat from becoming the ground. You are not going to provide enough current even if you are soaking wet to blow a breaker. But you could have a heart attack and die. So you always want a wired ground to do the grounding instead of the panel.

Ok- but if I feed the circuit 50 amps, if each light draws 3 amps, then there's only 3 amps in a 12v system....?

You DO realize now I'm going to go stand in a puddle the next time I'm fixing chicken lights, right?

 

[Susquatch]

Ok- but if I feed the circuit 50 amps, if each light draws 3 amps, then there's only 3 amps in a 12v system....?

You DO realize now I'm going to go stand in a puddle the next time I'm fixing chicken lights, right?

I'll apologize in advance, but I gotta ask..... How many beers have you had...... LOL!