New lathe choices in Canada

[ShawnR]

That sounds exactly like my SB did when I engage the back gears. Turned out the gear mesh was waaaay loose. Fortunately I could adjust that which solved the problem.
I did notice that it only occurs when feeding away from the chuck. Or am I mistaken?

that is interesting too. Thanks!

 

[PeterT]

If its like my machine, it could be the spring that acts against the ball & thus ball into detente socket is set with a bit too light of compression. Some have a set screw that you can adjust. Some are just spring plopped in a hole. Before stretching or whatever, maybe drop a small removable spacer plug in there to artificially increase compression force & see if that helps. Some levers can swing past the engage position, but what you want is a positive feel that its properly engaged. I had to monkey with my banjo gear change levers in this regard. And over time, the springs can loose force, so all part of the game.

But particularly when you engage/disengage the main levers, power feed mode, threading mode, Fwd/rev... make sure the gears are meshed. Like I was saying, its common to rotate the chuck just a fraction & have it drop into position with a satisfying thunk. Mine is a bit vague right around neutral. If the gears are only partially engaged & you hit power, no good becomes of this.

 

[ShawnR]

If its like my machine, it could be the spring that acts against the ball & thus ball into detente socket is set with a bit too light of compression. Some have a set screw that you can adjust. Some are just spring plopped in a hole. Before stretching or whatever, maybe drop a small removable spacer plug in there to artificially increase compression force & see if that helps. Some levers can swing past the engage position, but what you want is a positive feel that its properly engaged. I had to monkey with my banjo gear change levers in this regard. And over time, the springs can loose force, so all part of the game.

But particularly when you engage/disengage the main levers, power feed mode, threading mode, If the gears are only partially engaged & you hit power, no good becomes of this.

Thanks Peter. I will look at that. From the parts diagram, it looks like the spring indents are set from the top, once the cover is removed.

 

[Darren]

Did you check the change gear backlash? My emco sounded the same when the gears were too tight. Reversing the feed loads the gears the other way and they were a bit more quiet. Readjusted them and now they are silent. Something to check

 

[ShawnR]

Did you check the change gear backlash? My emco sounded the same when the gears were too tight. Reversing the feed loads the gears the other way and they were a bit more quiet. Readjusted them and now they are silent. Something to check

Thanks @dfloen I will play around with that and see if it is adjustable but I had other success today.

The indent ball bearings are accessible directly from the lever. I looked at the parts diagram a little more closely today and they were right in front of me all this time.....
I found them to be very lightly adjusted, as several of you suggested. I pulled the set screws out to ensure that the ball bearings were in there and both springs were good and they are so I oiled and reassembled, then adjusted them quite a bit tighter than they were. It seems much easier to detect the correct position now. It is still possible to overshoot but I have to do it on purpose now to do it.

Thanks everyone for all of the input.

 

[Proxule]

Honestly, I am not overly worried about it. Now that I know what is going on, it is easy to deal with....but, due to the response here, maybe I should be more concerned.

I will take another look at it. I don't want to void my warranty messing with something that is like a manual transmission,,,you can find the wrong gear if looking for it. Having said that, it would be nice to just throw the lever into position. I am giving my self time to get used to it...maybe it is my small but generally ham fisted actions causing the issue...

Here is the photo. As shown, the arrow points to the feed gear. In the photo, it is in the correct position for a right direction feed, and this position does have a corresponding "endent?" where it should be. However, when moving it, cause things are still tight, I suspect, it is easy to overshoot this position and move the gear more to the right, causing the noise in the video. The same distance is not attainable when going in the other direction cause the gear is limited by the wall of the gearbox.

I will compare what is there to what the parts diagram shows.

Yikes look at that bearing support, upper shaft left side, Shame they couldnt widen that casting half an inch, Good ol china. Willing to bet every copy of that lathe is the same.

 

[Proxule]

Thanks @dfloen I will play around with that and see if it is adjustable but I had other success today.

The indent ball bearings are accessible directly from the lever. I looked at the parts diagram a little more closely today and they were right in front of me all this time.....
I found them to be very lightly adjusted, as several of you suggested. I pulled the set screws out to ensure that the ball bearings were in there and both springs were good and they are so I oiled and reassembled, then adjusted them quite a bit tighter than they were. It seems much easier to detect the correct position now. It is still possible to overshoot but I have to do it on purpose now to do it.

Thanks everyone for all of the input.

youre most welcome! glad its solved

 

[PeterT]

I've always wondered about the sequence of how they set these gearboxes up at the factory. My shifting forks are kind of crude looking parts. I guess they just have a simple function - slide the gear over. But if there is excess fork gap or non-adjust ability then that slop just cascades up to the selector knob & ball detente. So do they assemble the gear train & locate the detente hole last to suit eyeballing the gears are aligned? Is there anything that looks like an adjustment screw inside? It seems to me my gears had stops or rings to limit movement on the shaft. Maybe have a look at your manual & that the parts they show on exploded view match what is there in real life. Ya never know, anything is possible,

 

[historicalarms]

I've always wondered about the sequence of how they set these gearboxes up at the factory. My shifting forks are kind of crude looking parts. I guess they just have a simple function - slide the gear over. But if there is excess fork gap or non-adjust ability then that slop just cascades up to the selector knob & ball detente. So do they assemble the gear train & locate the detente hole last to suit eyeballing the gears are aligned? Is there anything that looks like an adjustment screw inside? It seems to me my gears had stops or rings to limit movement on the shaft. Maybe have a look at your manual & that the parts they show on exploded view match what is there in real life. Ya never know, anything is possible,

View attachment 14650

There was infinite fork adjustment available on my machine as it came from the factory, just that set screw on a round shaft until I "fixed it" (post# 171). before the fix, I could have set the lever at any position in 360 deg circle if i wanted, bypassing the detents at any time if I so choose too.

 

[John Conroy]

On my lathe it appears that they install the shift fork onto the shaft and tighten the set screw to hold it in place after alignment is established then drill a hole through the shaft and fork and install a roll pin to make the alignment permanent.

 

[PeterT]

That's actually a pretty robust looking system on your lathe, John. Interesting
Mine has a few extra parts but suspect similar principal

 

[historicalarms]

On my lathe it appears that they install the shift fork onto the shaft and tighten the set screw to hold it in place after alignment is established then drill a hole through the shaft and fork and install a roll pin to make the alignment permanent.

View attachment 14653

Its been a while since I've had the cover off my lathe but other than the roll pins, appears to be the a facsimile of yours.

 

[LaurieF]

Woods Creek Workshop did some Youtube videos on repairs he had to do on a Jet version of the 13x40

Wow, that guy is remarkably sanguine given what he was faced with. I'd be pretty bummed if I bought a lathe and found the gearbox in such a state. I have also noted remarks on this forum about folks buying the more inexpensive new lathes and spending many hours getting them into decent shape b/f even powering them up. Makes a newbie like me apprehensive about buying anything like that.

 

[Dabbler]

buying the more inexpensive new lathes and spending many hours

I bought my first lathe new, but all my others have been used, bacause of that effect. I prefer to buy bigger than I need, used, and known higher quality. You end up paying about 75% of newer smaller machine, but you get a lot for your money, and rigidity to boot...

 

[Darren]

I bought my first lathe new, but all my others have been used, bacause of that effect. I prefer to buy bigger than I need, used, and known higher quality. You end up paying about 75% of newer smaller machine, but you get a lot for your money, and rigidity to boot...

agree 100%

 

[Crankit]

Wow, that guy is remarkably sanguine given what he was faced with. I'd be pretty bummed if I bought a lathe and found the gearbox in such a state. I have also noted remarks on this forum about folks buying the more inexpensive new lathes and spending many hours getting them into decent shape b/f even powering them up. Makes a newbie like me apprehensive about buying anything like that.

He also had to do spindle bearings on a new PM mill that had more run out than spec'd for

 

[John Conroy]

Congrats on the new lathe Shawn. It doesn't matter where a machine was made, USA, England, Germany, Taiwan or mainland China, it will have it's own set of shortcomings and positives. Put some hours on it and then change all the fluids. I recommend that you remove the headstock cover when you change the oil. I guarantee you will find wear metals, both ferrous and non-ferrous, in the bottom of the sump. Don't let rumors of junk Chinese machines worry you, that is perfectly normal, regardless of where the machine was made. Try to wipe out as much of the wear material as you can. You really don't need to worry about that material being circulated with the oil if you use the correct non-detergent circulating oil recommended in the manual. I placed a round magnet in the bottom of the sump when I did the first oil change on my lathe so I could monitor the accumulation of ferrous wear metal. I have changed the oil 3 times since and there is always a little bit of fuzzy wear metal stuck to the magnet but again, that is perfectly normal. I think you picked the right vendor. If you bought a Busy Bee or King Canada machine you could expect very little in the way of after sales support. Based on my previous experience with Precision Matthews, they will look after you if you have any problems and you will always be able to get replacement parts.

Here you can see that round speaker magnet stuck to the bottom of my headstock sump.

 

[LaurieF]

Seems a bit much alright but, I wonder if maybe such stuff might also be considered as sort of sweat equity, similar to assisting in the building of one's house to save money? I would hope that PM paid for the bearings in any case.

I'm getting the idea that one could buy a new inexpensive lathe (or milling machine), completely dissemble it, clean and lube thoroughly, replace all fasteners and maybe bearings with better quality and even do a little scraping, clean up the burrs, get a good result for a bargain price(?) and have a bit/maybe a lot of fun doing it.

 

[John Conroy]

Wow, that guy is remarkably sanguine given what he was faced with. I'd be pretty bummed if I bought a lathe and found the gearbox in such a state. I have also noted remarks on this forum about folks buying the more inexpensive new lathes and spending many hours getting them into decent shape b/f even powering them up. Makes a newbie like me apprehensive about buying anything like that.

If you look back at his previous videos you'll see that he bought that lathe as a damaged machine for 50% off the regular price so I think he was expecting to have some work to do on it.