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How bad of an idea is it to cut structure out of my lathe base?
- Thread starter Redneck_Sophistication
- Start date
Dabbler
ersatz engineer
If he sends me the dimensions I'll see what I have on hand. It might be a nice hour or so once I turn the heat on in my shop.
Redneck_Sophistication
Super User
Dabbler that’s a fantastic offer thank you
I’m going to try to build it back with tig first.
I gave the bearings a more thorough cleaning and could notice some light damage from that missing chip on the rear race.
The front one really wasn’t that bad. No scoring or lines on the race. Some really light lines on some of the rollers. Not raised or cut couldn’t feel with fingernail.
But if I’m doing one might as well do both.
I’ll admit I got a little scared last night when I couldn’t find them
Bearings in an online listing I looked on Amazon for shits and giggles and they actually had the main bearing race listed for 200$!!
Waiting for business hours today bearings Canada looked them up and can get them all for around 400. Not too bad. Week or two lead-time.
Any thoughts on reassembly of the main bearing?
Should I install the bearing and the HS plate, then install the spindle through it, or put the plate on the spindle and the bearing then install the whole works ?
I’m going to try to build it back with tig first.
I gave the bearings a more thorough cleaning and could notice some light damage from that missing chip on the rear race.
The front one really wasn’t that bad. No scoring or lines on the race. Some really light lines on some of the rollers. Not raised or cut couldn’t feel with fingernail.
But if I’m doing one might as well do both.
I’ll admit I got a little scared last night when I couldn’t find them
Bearings in an online listing I looked on Amazon for shits and giggles and they actually had the main bearing race listed for 200$!!
Waiting for business hours today bearings Canada looked them up and can get them all for around 400. Not too bad. Week or two lead-time.
Any thoughts on reassembly of the main bearing?
Should I install the bearing and the HS plate, then install the spindle through it, or put the plate on the spindle and the bearing then install the whole works ?
Even if you build it back up with TIG don't you still need to turn it on a lathe to finish it?
Redneck_Sophistication
Super User
It’s the one seemingly none critical part. Wasn’t a toleranced fit was just in an aluminum end plate.
I may need it replaced if the cast alloy isn’t a happy one or is laden with any hydro carbons.
I may need it replaced if the cast alloy isn’t a happy one or is laden with any hydro carbons.
If they are ABEC 7s for +/-$400 do it right away! That would be a very good price for the pair.
Here is some info on bearing tolerances / classes. There is a vast amount of info on the manufacturer‘s websites as well…
Levels of Precision - Choose Wisely: How Fast Your Bearings Need To Go
For a long time, only bearings with wide tolerances could be mass produced, nowadays, however, technology has advanced dramatically and parts can be manufactured with very tight tolerances, to produce extremely high performing bearings routinely.
Redneck_Sophistication
Super User
Well.
If you asked me if there were 9 levels of bearing tolerances this morning I’d have guessed 3
Chinese “shit”
Princess auto “that’ll do”
And
NA made quality made ones.
I’ve got no idea which I just paid for.
It IS and industrial bearing supplier and I told him they were replacing Timken for a lathe.
If you asked me if there were 9 levels of bearing tolerances this morning I’d have guessed 3
Chinese “shit”
Princess auto “that’ll do”
And
NA made quality made ones.
I’ve got no idea which I just paid for.
It IS and industrial bearing supplier and I told him they were replacing Timken for a lathe.
Redneck_Sophistication
Super User
Still waiting on bearings
Which isn’t too bad since I’ve haven’t had much time lately.
I replaced the pick on the oil pump with a piece of 1/4”
Airline I happened to have on hand.
Ran the motor and it took a min or two to prime.
Can tell for sure now the copper lines are not original. They run around with holes pierced in them.
The most it does is a light drip. Seems lighter then I’d expect.
Should this thing not be flooding it with oil?? What style of pump do these use? I’d guess it either works or it don’t not half ass weak.
Could the gear oil be too thick? It looks new, not from me so I don’t know the weight. It’s pretty thick though.
Which isn’t too bad since I’ve haven’t had much time lately.
I replaced the pick on the oil pump with a piece of 1/4”
Airline I happened to have on hand.
Ran the motor and it took a min or two to prime.
Can tell for sure now the copper lines are not original. They run around with holes pierced in them.
The most it does is a light drip. Seems lighter then I’d expect.
Should this thing not be flooding it with oil?? What style of pump do these use? I’d guess it either works or it don’t not half ass weak.
Could the gear oil be too thick? It looks new, not from me so I don’t know the weight. It’s pretty thick though.
Attachments
Dabbler
ersatz engineer
I use aw32 hydraulic oil in my gearboxes. It has excellent lubricity, and is very cheap, I change it more often than most, but cheap, hey. From the "lubrication analysts" I have spoken to, ISO32 hydraulic oil has amost identical protection omf ISO 68 or most of the 50 weight (ISO120, it think) gear oils. That is what Shell, Esso, and Husky technical staff have lead me to...
whenever I buy a new machine I instantly change the oil in it. Cheap protection. I may also be cheap.
whenever I buy a new machine I instantly change the oil in it. Cheap protection. I may also be cheap.
Excellent point. It's not what I have used, but it might be what I WILL use going forward.
When you stop to think that the entire gear train of most tractors is lubricated with hydraulic oil, it's a good reason to have some confidence in it. That's the transmission, the rear axle, the two pumps themselves, accessories, and any attached impliments. Lots of brass and bronze parts in there too.....
Most of the big guys (Deere CaseIH, etc) have annual maintenance sales as well.
Redneck_Sophistication
Super User
I should expect a lot more oil though eh?
I’ll drain it and replace. The hydraulic oil makes sense
I’ll drain it and replace. The hydraulic oil makes sense
Might be the cats meow for all those members who have Busybee Lathes with bad motors too.....
Redneck_Sophistication
Super User
Hey thanks for the continued interest!
Running no, just picked up the bearings Friday, they had trouble getting the one race.
I cleaned up the Exxon valdis and replaced the oil with AW32 as recommended but am not happy with how little oil is being pumped. Need to see if the oil pump can be rebuilt, but I couldn’t figure how to remove the pump before.
Thought maybe electric?? Put a pump on the drain and turn it on with the power switch?
Running no, just picked up the bearings Friday, they had trouble getting the one race.
I cleaned up the Exxon valdis and replaced the oil with AW32 as recommended but am not happy with how little oil is being pumped. Need to see if the oil pump can be rebuilt, but I couldn’t figure how to remove the pump before.
Thought maybe electric?? Put a pump on the drain and turn it on with the power switch?
Is there an air leak on the suction side of the pump? Or a pinched pick-up tube, or some other obstruction?
Looks like a gear pump from one of your pictures. They are usually robust, have good flow, and last a long time. There is very little back-pressure in the system and the pump should flow a relatively large volume at low pressure.
Take it apart, clean it well, check for wear/damage and reassemble if in decent shape. If it always had oil going through it, it should be fine after the service.
You could go external electric as a back-up if the OE internal pump is toast.
Looks like a gear pump from one of your pictures. They are usually robust, have good flow, and last a long time. There is very little back-pressure in the system and the pump should flow a relatively large volume at low pressure.
Take it apart, clean it well, check for wear/damage and reassemble if in decent shape. If it always had oil going through it, it should be fine after the service.
You could go external electric as a back-up if the OE internal pump is toast.
Redneck_Sophistication
Super User
@YYCHM honestly thank you for asking, gave me the motivation to spent the hour I had after getting home before running out again for an appointment.
Fiddled around with the pump and found it is not original, what’s left of the pump was cut in half through a threaded hole, a spacer scabbed on and a replacement through bolted on, with a shop made coupler.
.
I’m getting the feeling more and more my lathe was the redhead Ed adopted stepchild rented mule lol
Took the pump apart and @RobinHood you are correct a simple gear pump, that has no bad seals, missing parts, or gunk.
Disappointing I wanted a ripped O ring in a size I have lol
But then I noticed the gear spins on the main shaft!! No key, no flat spot, no spline, no press fit, no weld nothing!
I’m turning the TIG on and I notice a red line
Looks like it had a small recess turned at the shoulder and red loctite
Brake clean and some fresh loctite.
Hooked it up to the cordless and it’s working ten times better.
.
Didn’t quite have time to finish reinstalling do to the goofy redneck creation. (I feel a little shame here)
Fiddled around with the pump and found it is not original, what’s left of the pump was cut in half through a threaded hole, a spacer scabbed on and a replacement through bolted on, with a shop made coupler.
.
I’m getting the feeling more and more my lathe was the redhead Ed adopted stepchild rented mule lol
Took the pump apart and @RobinHood you are correct a simple gear pump, that has no bad seals, missing parts, or gunk.
Disappointing I wanted a ripped O ring in a size I have lol
But then I noticed the gear spins on the main shaft!! No key, no flat spot, no spline, no press fit, no weld nothing!
I’m turning the TIG on and I notice a red line
Looks like it had a small recess turned at the shoulder and red loctite
Brake clean and some fresh loctite.
Hooked it up to the cordless and it’s working ten times better.
.
Didn’t quite have time to finish reinstalling do to the goofy redneck creation. (I feel a little shame here)
Good find regarding the slipping drive.
Some of these pumps are directional and only work in one direction because of the internal porting.
I would not trust anything at this time and check that as well. Seems there is a data plate on the pump - maybe there is a manual available for it online?
Some of these pumps are directional and only work in one direction because of the internal porting.
I would not trust anything at this time and check that as well. Seems there is a data plate on the pump - maybe there is a manual available for it online?
Redneck_Sophistication
Super User
It definitely is only one way. I’ll have to watch to not do much in reverse(which really isn’t on my radar yet) I think I’ll probably put an electric pump at some point hooked to the drain to increase flow.
I ran the pump at high speed with the drill and it was very aerosolized, bolstered the seal from the fitting to pickup tube, and added an old 11mm socket to the bottom of the tube to keep it from curling up. Still doing it.
Took it back apart and noticed the seal around the shaft was pretty relaxed, I found a nice thick O ring in my plumbing box that I could wedge behind the seal that squeezed it in enough to eliminate the air intake! (Another reason to add electric in the future)
Now I’m finally ready to reassemble. First step in the new races. Really helpful that my lathe is sitting around -15 at the moment. And thanks to Putin will cost 40$ in diesel (and half a cord of wood) to bring up to temp! Lol
I ran the pump at high speed with the drill and it was very aerosolized, bolstered the seal from the fitting to pickup tube, and added an old 11mm socket to the bottom of the tube to keep it from curling up. Still doing it.
Took it back apart and noticed the seal around the shaft was pretty relaxed, I found a nice thick O ring in my plumbing box that I could wedge behind the seal that squeezed it in enough to eliminate the air intake! (Another reason to add electric in the future)
Now I’m finally ready to reassemble. First step in the new races. Really helpful that my lathe is sitting around -15 at the moment. And thanks to Putin will cost 40$ in diesel (and half a cord of wood) to bring up to temp! Lol
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