Aluminum Chips press?
- Thread starter Matt-Aburg
- Start date
The 50 ton press looks nice. If Speed of a press is a concern, remember that you may not want much speed when pressing an object. Generly, some fineness is wanted, to allow placement adjustment/alinement.But some speed returning the cylinder to the start position, this is hard to do if it is a "pump" back cylinder. Also more complicated control system. Speed is related to pressure and very important "volume/flow".
A friend had a 100 ton press he had made, and was useing to make a order of brackets. He was running into "problems" with speed and heat, the heat issue was having to stop use to let things cool down. The speed issue was the time to cycle back to the start point for the next bracket. These 2 issues in this case were somewhat related. The heat was caused by the pumping of the pressure to form the bracket and the pumping needed to return to start point.
The oil was being worked too much, the return circuit was too small and was using oil pressure to return ram to start point. Larger hoses were put on pressure side of control valve to cylinder and the hose returning to the oil tank. A set of springs were then used to return ram. A fan was also put blowing on the oil tank and later a larger oil tank replaced original, as was suggested too, with the fan.
So a number of points, if cycle time is important the system has to be sized and able to do it, able to pump enough flow, circuits large enough to handle flows without causing to much resistance, and a oil tank large enough to allow some cooling of oil.
Also metal lines will cool more then rubber/braided steel lines.
Same old, you can have, speed, pressure, cheap. Speed and pressure generly cost.
And please keep in mind, I am not an expert, just seen a few things, worked on some hydraulics, taken a course or two. Biggest press I have seen was in a steel mill, don't know how much tonnage, but had rams maybe six ft. dia. Four in a row. Massive tank above cylinders, a whole mess of electric powered pumps sitting on top of tank. Some smaller pumps to power the pull back cylinders. And a god awful amount of noise when powered up. It would bend a 1/2 inch thick plate 40 ft. long into a 50 in pipe, 40 ft. long. This plate had been "slightly" preshaped in the "V" press before going into the "big O press". A very noisy place! Wonder why I have some hearing problems.
Sorry, another long story.
A friend had a 100 ton press he had made, and was useing to make a order of brackets. He was running into "problems" with speed and heat, the heat issue was having to stop use to let things cool down. The speed issue was the time to cycle back to the start point for the next bracket. These 2 issues in this case were somewhat related. The heat was caused by the pumping of the pressure to form the bracket and the pumping needed to return to start point.
The oil was being worked too much, the return circuit was too small and was using oil pressure to return ram to start point. Larger hoses were put on pressure side of control valve to cylinder and the hose returning to the oil tank. A set of springs were then used to return ram. A fan was also put blowing on the oil tank and later a larger oil tank replaced original, as was suggested too, with the fan.
So a number of points, if cycle time is important the system has to be sized and able to do it, able to pump enough flow, circuits large enough to handle flows without causing to much resistance, and a oil tank large enough to allow some cooling of oil.
Also metal lines will cool more then rubber/braided steel lines.
Same old, you can have, speed, pressure, cheap. Speed and pressure generly cost.
And please keep in mind, I am not an expert, just seen a few things, worked on some hydraulics, taken a course or two. Biggest press I have seen was in a steel mill, don't know how much tonnage, but had rams maybe six ft. dia. Four in a row. Massive tank above cylinders, a whole mess of electric powered pumps sitting on top of tank. Some smaller pumps to power the pull back cylinders. And a god awful amount of noise when powered up. It would bend a 1/2 inch thick plate 40 ft. long into a 50 in pipe, 40 ft. long. This plate had been "slightly" preshaped in the "V" press before going into the "big O press". A very noisy place! Wonder why I have some hearing problems.
Sorry, another long story.
Matt-Aburg
Ultra Member
I will be looking at this closely. I am asking them to make a video B4 I go down and waste my time. I am under the impression speed is variable, controlled by the amount you pressure the control. I need to get up and down fast (over 6-8 inch) close to work for the first job..
Has this contributed to your deafness? or do you have feral cats on the farm?... The sound of ratcheting for hours would make it a very quittable job...I have enough problems with keeping going...
My hearing problems are both hereditary and environmental.
My mother was deaf at 70.
I worked in a factory before noise standards for a few year before going back to school, I loved racing cars that sound and perform better without a muffler, I used to go waterfowl hunting with a buddy in a duck blind, and a few loud noise environments in between. Interestingly, I shot competitively for many years but always used double hearing protection. So I doubt that had any influence - but who knows for sure.
I also have fairly bad tinnitus and a wife whose voice is at the same frequency as my hearing loss. (Insert wry grin here)
The farm is actually a pretty good environment for hearing. The silence can be deafening. The birds and wildlife sounds are mesmerizing. And I wear hearing protection around heavy machinery.
Also very interesting is that my low frequency hearing has actually improved. I have rather good sensitivity to infrasonics below 20Hz and can hear low frequency sounds no-one else can hear.
Be nice @140mower & @DPittman.....
140mower
Don
Poor @140mower nothing. Those two guys spend their whole lives just waiting for me (or anyone else) to say something dumb. I do that a lot so I figure it's better to just paint the bullseye on my back and hand over the darts than try to hide. Hiding doesn't work. They are both like bloodhounds that smell fear.
140mower
Don
I'll have you know, that's not how I spend my whole life.......
A lot of the time I can be found cutting my nose off to spite my face...
Matt-Aburg
Ultra Member
Scary day tomorrow for me. Need to trim the neighbors magnolia tree limbs so I don't scratch the brand new enterprise rental truck. Then I need to use a lift gate and a pallet jack.. All of these things I have not done..(minus trimming tree, and using a pallet jack on ground). And the press weighs more than was estimated, at about 1100 pounds...
Doggggboy
Ultra Member
UP.Scary day tomorrow for me. Need to trim the neighbors magnolia tree limbs so I don't scratch the brand new enterprise rental truck. Then I need to use a lift gate and a pallet jack.. All of these things I have not done..(minus trimming tree, and using a pallet jack on ground). And the press weighs more than was estimated, at about 1100 pounds...
DOWN.
UP.
DOWN.
Sounds easy.
Remember that you're smarter now than when you were 20 and you'll be fine.
Matt-Aburg
Ultra Member
I am just scared of rolling too far and dropping it...
Pallet jacks and lift gates scare the bejeebbers out of me as they seem to always tilt down.
Without any idea of what the thing looks like I would not put it on the lift gate on the pallet jack.
Matt-Aburg
Ultra Member
I am leaning towards putting it on, and then lifting the pallet jack the truck off manually. I have a very strong couple of hands that live here, we should be able to lower the pallet jack off.....
140mower
Don
Once you lower the pallet onto the gate, just give it a little bit of lift, just enough to hold the jack in place and you will be fine. I try and put the pallet jack onto the gate at a 45* angle and turn sharp to get sitting 90* to the end. Be ready with the lowering handle to drop to apply the brakes. Take a few dry runs with an empty pallet to get the feel of things.
I just recently helped a neighbour unload pallets of flooring from a delivery truck. She was standing there looking totally lost and a few tears flowing. The guy in the truck had no way of dealing with it other than a pallet jack. The load was too long (about 12 feet) for that. I went over and offered to help. I got my loader tractor, a farm jack, some light chain, and a short 2x12 for under the farm jack. I used the farm jack to level the lift gate and then pulled the pallet and pallet jack onto the gate lifting with my forks from the far end. We chocked the pallet jack so it couldn't roll off. We also chocked the pallet jack intermittently as we rolled it onto the lift gate.
Once the lift gate and the forks were both on the ground it was a piece of cake to pull the load off and then reposition it on my forks to move it into their garage.
It was another hero day.
Once the lift gate and the forks were both on the ground it was a piece of cake to pull the load off and then reposition it on my forks to move it into their garage.
It was another hero day.
Matt-Aburg
Ultra Member
I ended up hiring the guys that build my shed to take it with a forklift on their bobcat... It is in the garage...
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Matt-Aburg
Ultra Member
I will get it tomorrow. Today I got it to it's place in the shop. I need to determine what wire the 220 is down near it. I need to switch out to a minimum 20 amp 110V plug, and breaker. I hope that I used the orange wire for it.. wont be hard to determine, at the box, and switching things on and off.
On that, the motor is a 3 phase but is converted in a small box. If so, wondering if it can be changed to 220 V single phase by changing jumpers. My electrician is coming to looks on Monday..
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Matt-Aburg
Ultra Member
Here they are finally... @Susquatch ..etc.
