Other Safeties Use them or Not?

[Chicken lights]

I’m surprised nobody has mentioned drugs or alcohol, or co-workers, you can have all the safeties in place but you have to watch who you’re working around. Some people can handle drinking and working, others need more distance

Luckily that isn’t as common as it was years ago

 

[Susquatch]

That could have been FAR easier prevented by a Stop Switch that was not located above the chuck too!

Doesn't matter how many "Safety Features" the machine has, if the are as badly implemented as that seem to have been!

YES!!! And that is just another reason why I want another estop on the right side of my lathe.

Personally, I am sooooo glad my lathe didn't come with one of those covers. This way I don't have to lose any sleep worrying about having taken it off.

 

[trevj]

Not too hard to install!

Ever seen the dropaway shut-offs used on quads and personal watercraft?

Nothing says you cannot install similar on your machine! Dive out of the way, the tether pulls the switch, and it all gets quiet!

Well. Except for the jeering of the witnesses! That's outside your control, though!

 

[Former Member]

Not too hard to install!

Ever seen the dropaway shut-offs used on quads and personal watercraft?

Nothing says you cannot install similar on your machine! Dive out of the way, the tether pulls the switch, and it all gets quiet!

Well. Except for the jeering of the witnesses! That's outside your control, though!

This one of those safety ideas that add a secondary risk that can cause a primary injury.

SNAG. Snag the tether the wrong way and it pulls you into the rotating parts before the intended safety activates.

Great idea, wrong applications. This is the problem with safeties as they add other risks.

 

[Susquatch]

This one of those safety ideas that add a secondary risk that can cause a primary injury.

SNAG. Snag the tether the wrong way and it pulls you into the rotating parts before the intended safety activates.

Great idea, wrong applications. This is the problem with safeties as they add other risks.

It ought to be fairly easy to avoid that risk. If @trevj puts the yank cord where it can't reach any rotating parts its a good idea. I'm thinking maybe a power interrupter someplace low or behind the operator. I like the overall idea, just not clear on the best way to execute it. Also worried that the inconvenience of connecting it might lead to not using it. I've yet to see a boat operator use the wrist strap. It always just hangs there. Even many seadoo operators don't use it and depend on the slow circle instead.

I think it's a great idea that needs some refining.

I also add once again that I hate the idea of having to reach through the action plane to hit the e-stop on the headstock and therefore I hunger for something better.

 

[Former Member]

Its not about snagging the tether on rotating equipment, but snagging it on something else which causes the operator to move into the rotating equipment whether it is tether assisted or tether reaction induced.

Second part about tethers is they limit your movement, which is why they tend to be worked around rendering them useless.

BTW reaching across the working plane is always a risk. Want to add safety to your machine Safety Stop Button just below waist ht roughly inline with the chuck face. If you get caught you want it close and accessible with as many parts of body to shut it off. Down side in advertingly tripping the stop.

 

[Susquatch]

Its not about snagging the tether on rotating equipment, but snagging it on something else which causes the operator to move into the rotating equipment whether it is tether assisted or tether reaction induced.

Second part about tethers is they limit your movement, which is why they tend to be worked around rendering them useless.

BTW reaching across the working plane is always a risk. Want to add safety to your machine Safety Stop Button just below waist ht roughly inline with the chuck face. If you get caught you want it close and accessible with as many parts of body to shut it off. Down side in advertingly tripping the stop.

I'm not ruling out @trevj 's tether. It just needs some of your famous thinking outside the box.......

 

[Doggggboy]

A SawStop type setup that triggers with human touch would be nice.
SawStops are triggered with conductance from touching skin or metal though so that wouldn't work on a metal lathe.
When a SawStop triggers it is also somewhat destructive and destroys the brake cartridge, $129 , and usually fubars the blade as well. Money well spent for keeping the knuckles in the middle of the finger rather than the end.

 

[phaxtris]

An estop tether like on a snowmachine or a PWC pops off quite easily if that's what you guys are referring to, it doesn't impede your motion one bit

However you shure as shit wouldn't want to have it on your wrist or some other body part, maybe a belt loop that would rip off had the tether gotta caught in something spinny

I'm kinda with @Degen, probabaly more of a hazzard that it's worth

 

[6.5 Fan]

As a farmer i work around rotating shafts all the time. Just need to engage the brain before you do stupid stuff and get hurt. A safety is only as good as the loose screw behind it. That being said i'm not real happy with the location of the start/stop switch on the BB706 lathe i bought, way up on top of the head stock enclosure.

 

[140mower]

As a farmer i work around rotating shafts all the time. Just need to engage the brain before you do stupid stuff and get hurt. A safety is only as good as the loose screw behind it. That being said i'm not real happy with the location of the start/stop switch on the BB706 lathe i bought, way up on top of the head stock enclosure.

I'm still surprised to this day that I managed to survive without injury in the years before the warning label that suggests that the cup of Coffee I just purchased might be hot....... We only have two roles in life. One is to reproduce, and the other is to look after our own wellbeing, funny how so many only seem to be good at the one......

 

[phaxtris]

I don't know, I wish these had better guards instead of the 1980's special only half of the shaft bs

Not having guards is ok IF your working on the item, but if your working around them on something else when your attention is not 100% on the spinny shaft of death behind you that randomly turns on by itself it can be quite dangerous

 

[Susquatch]

I found and bought two of these ShopFox EStops a few months ago. They have a huge stop area that can be easily hit with a hand, elbow, or knee. They can be wired for single phase 110 2Hp or 220 3Hp or for 3Phase 220 5Hp or 480 10Hp. There is nothing on the label to suggest that can or cannot be used with 550.

They also have a lockout feature.

As near as I can tell, they seem to have an internal relay that uses the load current to keep the contacts closed - somewhat reminiscent of a contactor.



Before I install one, I will explore how they actually work.

 

[trevj]

This one of those safety ideas that add a secondary risk that can cause a primary injury.

SNAG. Snag the tether the wrong way and it pulls you into the rotating parts before the intended safety activates.

Great idea, wrong applications. This is the problem with safeties as they add other risks.

Yeah. I think you are right, re: a tether. One short enough to be fairly safe, is limiting your movement, one long enough to be able to work around a mill or lathe, for instance, becomes an entanglement issue. Best used on a system like those they are, where the normal operation is using the hand in a fixed location!

Personally I thought the right balance was pretty near got, by the school I was in, who had put the extra slap-down E-Stop switches around the ends of the lathes.

A problem with any form of operator presence system, is that it is often the first piece of Safety equipment to get removed, or bypassed, either so that a long cut can get done unattended, or for any of dozens of other reasons.

 

[historicalarms]

As a farmer

At my old man's retirement farm sale the auctioneer actually commented that it was the first sale he had ever ran that had all the safety guards in place on all the old equipment....he wasn't around when all that stuff was being used by the old man, most every guard that was removed to do a repair was never put back on....just saved in a shop corner so he could put them back on for possibly a higher premium come sale time.
That's all I did for 3 weekends before that sale when I came home from work was try to match up where those damn guards were meant to be

 

[trevj]

A SawStop type setup that triggers with human touch would be nice.
SawStops are triggered with conductance from touching skin or metal though so that wouldn't work on a metal lathe.
When a SawStop triggers it is also somewhat destructive and destroys the brake cartridge, $129 , and usually fubars the blade as well. Money well spent for keeping the knuckles in the middle of the finger rather than the end.

Since almost all we work with IS conductive, it'd be a pretty short-lived install, methinks!

 

[Former Member]

Saw Stop has an over ride to by pass it should you be working with something conductive like moist wood.

 

[historicalarms]

On a personal note, I have the heat shut off in my shop for the winter and wont touch my lathe while it is off....for two reasons, one is I'm not sure the stiff oil in the headstock will "drip lube" the bearings as designed and also for the reason we are discussing here. I would have to wear bulky winter clothing with bulky sleeves that are just itching to be grabbed by a chuck jaw and the belly of a heavy coat just naturally bulges out when you bend over a bit....again just itching to be grabbed by a carriage drive shaft.

I almost ruined a brand new rifle barrel blank I was making hexagonal in my mill with that heavy coat belly that bulged out. I was sitting in a chair watching er cut and when I stood up that coat hooked the table wheel handle and forcefully turned the cutter into the flat I was cutting, gouged into that barrel almost as deep as a dovetail sight cut so it is still "usable" but that gouge is sure an unsightly reminder.

 

[trevj]

Saw Stop has an over rude to by pass it should you be working with something conductive like moist wood.

Ayup. And honestly, IF I were ever given one, I suspect it would be bypassed and forgotten about! I know I will never buy one.

The guy that came up with the idea, was Lobbying the US Gov't to Mandate their use on all saws sold in the Country, which was a kind of scummy, self serving move. Waddya expect from a Lawyer, though?https://toolguyd.com/sawstops-stephen-gass-people-who-are-destroying-america/

 

[Former Member]

I found and bought two of these ShopFox EStops a few months ago. They have a huge stop area that can be easily hit with a hand, elbow, or knee. They can be wired for single phase 110 2Hp or 220 3Hp or for 3Phase 220 5Hp or 480 10Hp. There is nothing on the label to suggest that can or cannot be used with 550.

They also have a lockout feature.

As near as I can tell, they seem to have an internal relay that uses the load current to keep the contacts closed - somewhat reminiscent of a contactor.

View attachment 29615

Before I install one, I will explore how they actually work.

I believe those are mechanical, look almost identical to BB's