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NUMOBAMS 8x16 (NU-210G) Lathe Review

This is actually a subject I enjoy talking about on all levels.

I've personally visited most Asian countries. They have their challenges, their advantages, and a very different outlook on life - politically and socially. I do not know why discussing it needs to be sensitive. Even among our membership we have different opinions and preferences. Some place more value on pure cost, some on quality, some on availability, some on performance, most of us place value on all these things to different degrees. China is a long ways away. Given all other things equal, I'd rather buy local. In fact, I'd rather pay more to buy local even if it originally comes from China. But I don't like to get ripped off. A fair markup to cover faster availability and a hassle free experience is perfectly ok with me.

Back to your questions.

First Car Quality - it used to matter - It doesn't much matter anymore. Japanese and South Korean car quality is second to none. Chinese vehicle quality - well, not so much. I think the best comparison I can make is to compare Chinese auto manufacturing to R/V manufacturing in North America. It can be really nice stuff with lots of features but man are they ever rough around the edges.

An interesting story worth telling is "perception". A study was done on a product made in a North American Assembly plant but sold in both Asian and Domestic dealerships both overseas and in N. America. The warranty costs were 10 times higher for the N. American branded product even though they were totally identical in every respect except the name badge. How could that be? According to JD Powers the difference was mostly customer expectations - the buyers accepted the Asian quality but demanded better from N America. There was also a little dealership revenue generation going on too......

Then there is progress. Each generation of product gets better and better no matter who makes it. But when someone has a bad experience with Honda, and then buys a much newer car from Toyota, they get a better car. So they automatically assume that Toyota is better and swear they will never buy another Honda. But the equivalent new Honda is much better than the old one was and probably just as good as the new Toyota.

Safety is a whole nuther subject. I've discussed that here before. There are government safety standards which are mostly tests to meet minimum standards. Vehicles either meet them or don't. If they meet them, they are certified for sale to consumers. But then there are also internal goals. To take a simple example, consider a head injury criteria in a barrier Impact test. Government requires a maximum injury rating for a frontal impact. Industry tests and certifies this performance level. But industry goes WAAAAYYY beyond that. Computer simulations allow the industry to test and calibrate those tests in the real world to a million (actually a continuum) of other scenarios at every conceivable angle and speed to maximize "real world" safety. Ironically, sometimes the mandated tests limit what could have been achieved without them. There are no standards for this. Companies just do it because they can. Real world accidents don't follow the rules. Yet government, the media, and consumers only look at the regulated numbers and the ratings.

At the same time, there are some very important differences in how these "real world" factors are developed. Highway infrastructure, driving regulations, and driving habits in North America, China, Japan, Europe, India, Africa, etc etc are all very different. It's not possible to optimize performance for all these differences simultaneously in the same vehicle. Knowing this, I prefer to buy vehicles that were predominantly designed for the North American market because that's where I drive. Note that I said "designed for", not "built in".

One last comment on safety. SIZE MATTERS. It's pure physics.

I could go on and on for days on this subject. But I think that's enough for one post. Happy to answer more questions.
We’re getting off topic again- while I haven’t driven in Mexico, or the Territories, there is not much in the way of uniformity on North American infrastructure or driving habits

I do agree on size matters (for vehicles) and am constantly baffled at people that play (bad word) games in front of large trucks. In general the USA drives larger vehicles than Canada, you actually don’t see mini vans very much in the south it’s mostly pickup trucks. There has to be a demographic for auto manufacturers by state/country for vehicle popularity?

I would guess, most asian and European countries prefer smaller vehicles so the North American market is unique
 
I'm going to say you saved a ton of money and complain about a chuck?

Sounds like Rolls Royce expectations on a LADA budget.

Don't get mad yet on my comments, I here to give you an inexpensive solution to put a smile on your face.

Scrolling 3 jaw chucks are good for roughing and even with good ones run out is going to be an issue, nature of the beast. Instead of wasting energy complaining (and getting your BP up) by getting stressed about it, do the machinist thing and come up with a solution. Heres a simple one that only costs you 4 set screws and some time and gives you precision chuck.


You saved a ton, learned something new and can afford more equipment with the money you saved.....Life is only as good as you see it.
I don't think a set-thru chuck will fix his problem. His chuck run-out is only .0015". The set-thru chuck only addresses run out. It's basically a 3jaw chuck, with 4 jaw capabilities. The two parts of the set-thru move in the same plane/parallel to each other. If the head is angled relative to the bed ways, it will still cut a taper. The only way to fix the taper cutting issue is to either, 1. align the head to the ways, or 2. use an 8-jaw spider set up, but that is very inconvenient except for special applications.
 
OP -
That really sucks that you are so unhappy with your lathe. I would definitely file a claim with AliExpress. I had to do this once with a rifle scope that had flaws on the inside of the lens. It is useable but distracting until you can get used to it. The seller offered me something ridiculous like $5 off, because it technically functioned properly. I wrote Ali, and I was given a full refund and told to keep the scope within 1 day.
AliExpress is so big, they won't risk getting any bad feedback on the interweb over what is a minuscule amount of money to them.
I'd start there. But be prepared to deal with translating the discussion. I've bought a lot of stuff from China, and I can tell just by how ads are written if it's a Chinese seller (on Amazon and such)
I assume it's due to using a translation program, and some words that just don't totally translate between the 2 languages.
Good luck and don't give up.
Ken
 
I actually have virtually the same lathe. I picked one with DRO's and a 850w motor.
I had issues getting it here, this was about 1 year ago when covid was changing the shipping industry constantly. Sam actually gave me an extra 4 jaw chuck to compensate for the added cost and wait times. It was very frustrating, but I looked into the things he was telling me about shipping, and he was being 100% forthright. As the pics show, I also bought a milling machine with DRO's. It is blue, which annoys me since I actually like the bright colour. But some paint will fix that.
To be fully honest, I haven't done any machining with either yet. Life this past year has been very difficult for me and the people I love, so machining parts hasn't been high on my list. The desire to has, but life keeps getting in the way. It's looking like that will be changing soon, as setting them up is very close to the top of my to do list.
I have however, partially disassembled them for moving between buildings. While doing so I turned and worked every piece I could. I've worked on all manner of mechanical things in my life, and I am actually very happy with the build quality.
No flaws that I've seen, and everything turns, moves extremely smoothly.
It was actually better than my expectations.
The milling machine follows suit.
As far as accuracy, I can't say yet, but the build quality leads me to believe it will be decent.
So my experience was almost totally opposite yours.
Please don't get offended, but were your expectations a bit high possibly? The fellows on here told me to set my expectations properly before I purchased. Ordering unseen (in person) equipment from China is a bit of a gamble, but the prices justify that gamble.
If I may ask, why go to all the trouble of getting them to convert it to SAE. Virtually Everything from overseas is metric, so they were probably working with parameters and calculations totally foreign to them in the factory (word play there on purpose).
Either way, it's your business, and I hope your experience ends up satisfactory.
With the market still short on stock, I wouldn't be surprised if you could sell it even with the issues for a really decent price. As you stated, out west here, these type of machines just aren't commonly available. If AliExpress gives you a partial refund, you may end up recovering your investment.
Good luck,
Ken
 

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OSF, I'm also in the Lower Mainland (White Rock). I have an Edge Technologies Tailstock Alignment Bar you can borrow if you like. Used it on my Vevor 7 x 12 as the tailstock was out by 3.5mm ...

tailstock_alignment_bar_lathe_cutting_tools_on_spindle_axis_southbend_angle__42705.1635473068.webp
 
Does the spindle have an internal Morse taper? A Morse taper test bar will tell you for sure if it’s headstock alignment. They’re fairly inexpensive and useful for tailstock alignment as well.
 
OP -
That really sucks that you are so unhappy with your lathe. I would definitely file a claim with AliExpress. I had to do this once with a rifle scope that had flaws on the inside of the lens. It is useable but distracting until you can get used to it. The seller offered me something ridiculous like $5 off, because it technically functioned properly. I wrote Ali, and I was given a full refund and told to keep the scope within 1 day.
AliExpress is so big, they won't risk getting any bad feedback on the interweb over what is a minuscule amount of money to them.
I'd start there. But be prepared to deal with translating the discussion. I've bought a lot of stuff from China, and I can tell just by how ads are written if it's a Chinese seller (on Amazon and such)
I assume it's due to using a translation program, and some words that just don't totally translate between the 2 languages.
Good luck and don't give up.
Ken

Sam directed me to his website and everything was purchased from there, I'm not sure Ali can help in this situation?

I actually have virtually the same lathe. I picked one with DRO's and a 850w motor.
I had issues getting it here, this was about 1 year ago when covid was changing the shipping industry constantly. Sam actually gave me an extra 4 jaw chuck to compensate for the added cost and wait times. It was very frustrating, but I looked into the things he was telling me about shipping, and he was being 100% forthright. As the pics show, I also bought a milling machine with DRO's. It is blue, which annoys me since I actually like the bright colour. But some paint will fix that.
To be fully honest, I haven't done any machining with either yet. Life this past year has been very difficult for me and the people I love, so machining parts hasn't been high on my list. The desire to has, but life keeps getting in the way. It's looking like that will be changing soon, as setting them up is very close to the top of my to do list.
I have however, partially disassembled them for moving between buildings. While doing so I turned and worked every piece I could. I've worked on all manner of mechanical things in my life, and I am actually very happy with the build quality.
No flaws that I've seen, and everything turns, moves extremely smoothly.
It was actually better than my expectations.
The milling machine follows suit.
As far as accuracy, I can't say yet, but the build quality leads me to believe it will be decent.
So my experience was almost totally opposite yours.
Please don't get offended, but were your expectations a bit high possibly? The fellows on here told me to set my expectations properly before I purchased. Ordering unseen (in person) equipment from China is a bit of a gamble, but the prices justify that gamble.
If I may ask, why go to all the trouble of getting them to convert it to SAE. Virtually Everything from overseas is metric, so they were probably working with parameters and calculations totally foreign to them in the factory (word play there on purpose).
Either way, it's your business, and I hope your experience ends up satisfactory.
With the market still short on stock, I wouldn't be surprised if you could sell it even with the issues for a really decent price. As you stated, out west here, these type of machines just aren't commonly available. If AliExpress gives you a partial refund, you may end up recovering your investment.
Good luck,
Ken

It is good to know that you had a better experience.
I don't blame them at all for the time it took, I caused the delays at the factory and boats will be boats.
The only expectations that I had was to get an undamaged machine that was accurate enough to use. .005" within 3" is not that. I got a machine with damage, missing parts and that was inaccurate, is this too high of expectations...?
re SAE... I'm not young, I've spent my life working with SAE on aircraft and turbine engines. It wasn't a full conversion, they have an SAE line. I just had them ensure everything was actually SAE and that I was able to build the gearing to cut the SAE threads. Basically I wanted them to meet the specs of the Grizzly lathe.

I don't think my expectations were high in regards to the machine. I will admit my expectations have always been high on people and their integrity and accountability.

OSF, I'm also in the Lower Mainland (White Rock). I have an Edge Technologies Tailstock Alignment Bar you can borrow if you like. Used it on my Vevor 7 x 12 as the tailstock was out by 3.5mm ...

View attachment 23535

Thank you so much for the offer, I may take you up on it if I can't find a spindle bar.

Does the spindle have an internal Morse taper? A Morse taper test bar will tell you for sure if it’s headstock alignment. They’re fairly inexpensive and useful for tailstock alignment as well.

Yes, it's an MT5. Obviously being an MT5 it's more expensive.
 
Sam directed me to his website and everything was purchased from there, I'm not sure Ali can help in this situation?



It is good to know that you had a better experience.
I don't blame them at all for the time it took, I caused the delays at the factory and boats will be boats.
The only expectations that I had was to get an undamaged machine that was accurate enough to use. .005" within 3" is not that. I got a machine with damage, missing parts and that was inaccurate, is this too high of expectations...?
re SAE... I'm not young, I've spent my life working with SAE on aircraft and turbine engines. It wasn't a full conversion, they have an SAE line. I just had them ensure everything was actually SAE and that I was able to build the gearing to cut the SAE threads. Basically I wanted them to meet the specs of the Grizzly lathe.

I don't think my expectations were high in regards to the machine. I will admit my expectations have always been high on people and their integrity and accountability.



Thank you so much for the offer, I may take you up on it if I can't find a spindle bar.



Yes, it's an MT5. Obviously being an MT5 it's more expensive.
Wow mt5 is HUGE for that size of lathe.

Don't all lathes have a morse taper spindle (obviously not or else you wouldn't have asked) I'm just curious what else is out there?
 
Wow mt5 is HUGE for that size of lathe.

Don't all lathes have a morse taper spindle (obviously not or else you wouldn't have asked) I'm just curious what else is out there?
Yes, it's considered a "large bore" 8x16. Super handy feature. Very first project made use of it. Grizzly is MT3

It comes at the cost of more expensive tooling though.
 
Yes, it's considered a "large bore" 8x16. Super handy feature. Very first project made use of it. Grizzly is MT3

It comes at the cost of more expensive tooling though.
Yes I guess headstock accessories would be more expensive but man that IS a nice feature that I would think would be worth it.
 
Wow mt5 is HUGE for that size of lathe.

Don't all lathes have a morse taper spindle (obviously not or else you wouldn't have asked) I'm just curious what else is out there?

Most do, but I don’t think it’s universal. I know of at least one lathe we have at work that has a proprietary internal spindle taper that you need a special reducer to put a center in.
 
The BusyBee 10x22 is where I may go if this falls through.

Busy bee machines are not great not terrible. Certainly they will have less issues then what you got, but they are still cheap China, not some premium - they compete on price and price alone. Decent older machine would be a far better choice.
 
This is actually a subject I enjoy talking about on all levels.

I've personally visited most Asian countries. They have their challenges, their advantages, and a very different outlook on life - politically and socially. I do not know why discussing it needs to be sensitive. Even among our membership we have different opinions and preferences. Some place more value on pure cost, some on quality, some on availability, some on performance, most of us place value on all these things to different degrees. China is a long ways away. Given all other things equal, I'd rather buy local. In fact, I'd rather pay more to buy local even if it originally comes from China. But I don't like to get ripped off. A fair markup to cover faster availability and a hassle free experience is perfectly ok with me.

Back to your questions.

First Car Quality - it used to matter - It doesn't much matter anymore. Japanese and South Korean car quality is second to none. Chinese vehicle quality - well, not so much. I think the best comparison I can make is to compare Chinese auto manufacturing to R/V manufacturing in North America. It can be really nice stuff with lots of features but man are they ever rough around the edges.

An interesting story worth telling is "perception". A study was done on a product made in a North American Assembly plant but sold in both Asian and Domestic dealerships both overseas and in N. America. The warranty costs were 10 times higher for the N. American branded product even though they were totally identical in every respect except the name badge. How could that be? According to JD Powers the difference was mostly customer expectations - the buyers accepted the Asian quality but demanded better from N America. There was also a little dealership revenue generation going on too......

Then there is progress. Each generation of product gets better and better no matter who makes it. But when someone has a bad experience with Honda, and then buys a much newer car from Toyota, they get a better car. So they automatically assume that Toyota is better and swear they will never buy another Honda. But the equivalent new Honda is much better than the old one was and probably just as good as the new Toyota.

Safety is a whole nuther subject. I've discussed that here before. There are government safety standards which are mostly tests to meet minimum standards. Vehicles either meet them or don't. If they meet them, they are certified for sale to consumers. But then there are also internal goals. To take a simple example, consider a head injury criteria in a barrier Impact test. Government requires a maximum injury rating for a frontal impact. Industry tests and certifies this performance level. But industry goes WAAAAYYY beyond that. Computer simulations allow the industry to test and calibrate those tests in the real world to a million (actually a continuum) of other scenarios at every conceivable angle and speed to maximize "real world" safety. Ironically, sometimes the mandated tests limit what could have been achieved without them. There are no standards for this. Companies just do it because they can. Real world accidents don't follow the rules. Yet government, the media, and consumers only look at the regulated numbers and the ratings.

At the same time, there are some very important differences in how these "real world" factors are developed. Highway infrastructure, driving regulations, and driving habits in North America, China, Japan, Europe, India, Africa, etc etc are all very different. It's not possible to optimize performance for all these differences simultaneously in the same vehicle. Knowing this, I prefer to buy vehicles that were predominantly designed for the North American market because that's where I drive. Note that I said "designed for", not "built in".

One last comment on safety. SIZE MATTERS. It's pure physics.

I could go on and on for days on this subject. But I think that's enough for one post. Happy to answer more questions.

I also been to most Asian countries, if counting my parents we only miss few, like Afghanistan.

I do not see South Korean as good quality at all - they are lesser then US made cars. You can have 2015 Kia SUV for like 6000 CAD with leather interior. They disintegrate after just 100k miles.

Chinese cars are not bad! Most US makes exist in China - even some rather obscure in US - like Buick. China is by far the world's largest manufacturer of cars and largest car market. They have lots of companies fighting for it - more fractured then US. Competition is very fierce. I would not be shocked to have Chinese car outlast anything made in US or Canada.

Driving habits in say China are totally different then Chinese driving habits in say Canada. Your average middle aged office worker woman from tire 1 city in China could do better parking job then 99% of people in Canada / US. Also vehicles are frequently pushed way, way, way harder.

One has to note that a lot of Chinese, going back to machinery, do not buy based on price point but quality. So no, frequently Chinese would not use same tools, machines, etc. they sell for export at home. I.e. Chinese lathe in China can do circles around Chinese lathe in US. They are not the same model.
This is not true for all stuff - I saw in China identical thermos sold in Walmart in Canada - so both Chinese and US markets got same stuff. But with some tools I saw it was certainly true.
 
Most do, but I don’t think it’s universal. I know of at least one lathe we have at work that has a proprietary internal spindle taper that you need a special reducer to put a center in.
It may be MT 4.5 - smaller older machines have these.

MT5 is huge. This may explain some issues with bearings heating up. Note older 14x40 machines have MT5 - newer machines have MT6.
 
I also been to most Asian countries, if counting my parents we only miss few, like Afghanistan.

I do not see South Korean as good quality at all - they are lesser then US made cars. You can have 2015 Kia SUV for like 6000 CAD with leather interior. They disintegrate after just 100k miles.

Chinese cars are not bad! Most US makes exist in China - even some rather obscure in US - like Buick. China is by far the world's largest manufacturer of cars and largest car market. They have lots of companies fighting for it - more fractured then US. Competition is very fierce. I would not be shocked to have Chinese car outlast anything made in US or Canada.

Driving habits in say China are totally different then Chinese driving habits in say Canada. Your average middle aged office worker woman from tire 1 city in China could do better parking job then 99% of people in Canada / US. Also vehicles are frequently pushed way, way, way harder.

One has to note that a lot of Chinese, going back to machinery, do not buy based on price point but quality. So no, frequently Chinese would not use same tools, machines, etc. they sell for export at home. I.e. Chinese lathe in China can do circles around Chinese lathe in US. They are not the same model.
This is not true for all stuff - I saw in China identical thermos sold in Walmart in Canada - so both Chinese and US markets got same stuff. But with some tools I saw it was certainly true.

I can imagine that what you say about machinery could be true. I do not know.

But I think we must have visited two different China's for cars and trucks. On my last trip to China (after I retired) I was specifically hired as a consultant to inspect and approve the quality, durability, and safety of Chinese made trucks and buses for sale in Canada. They did not measure up. That was just 6 years ago. Prior to retiring 15 years ago, I was also personally involved in the inspection and tear down a variety of Chinese cars. They were also substandard. Now if you are talking about North American and European cars built in China by an American or European car company, that is a whole different subject.

You also say that Korean vehicles are lesser than US made cars as though US made cars are practically the bottom of the heap. Lots and lots and lots of customers say otherwise.

I think it's best to just agree to disagree on this one Tom.
 
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It may be MT 4.5 - smaller older machines have these.

MT5 is huge. This may explain some issues with bearings heating up. Note older 14x40 machines have MT5 - newer machines have MT6.

It’s a Colchester, I can’t remember the model but it’s around 14x40 in size which makes it practically miniature in our shop at work haha.

Some googling suggests it could be a Jarno taper or maybe proprietary… it’s close to MT5 in size but not the same taper angle.
 
It’s a Colchester, I can’t remember the model but it’s around 14x40 in size which makes it practically miniature in our shop at work haha.

Some googling suggests it could be a Jarno taper or maybe proprietary… it’s close to MT5 in size but not the same taper angle.

Yep mine is Colchester as well.
 
I hope I didn't offend you regarding the high expectations comment.
I just meant that the little things like the marks on the ways and loose/ missing screws aren't something I'd consider a big problem considering the cost savings from buying direct. I'm sure if their QC was a lot better, then the price would be a lot higher.
As far as the bigger issues like the thread damage and such, I absolutely agree with you that those things aren't acceptable.

If you first found it on AliExpress, it would be worth contacting them. Sam kind of cut them out when he directed you away from the main site to his. Worse that could happen is that they can't help.
I hope you get the problems sorted out, because I think you'll have a heck of a good machine if you do.
Ken
 
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