Keyless Chucks

[thestelster]

Have I mentioned how much I love keyless chucks?!

Working on a little project at the moment, and had to drill a 1" hole, in preparation for boring.

3.5" deep into tool steel. Started with 1/4", then 1/2", 3/4", then 1" drill bits. There is quite a bit of rotational force created, as you can see by the bite marks on the shaft. If it was a keyed chuck, it would have spun. Been there done that, (Jacobs 14N, and 18N ball bearing Super Chucks)!

Of course, they can tighten so much, it can require a lot of force to remove the bit. A strap wrench works perfectly.

 

[Stellrammer]

Have I mentioned how much I love keyless chucks?!

Working on a little project at the moment, and had to drill a 1" hole, in preparation for boring.

3.5" deep into tool steel. Started with 1/4", then 1/2", 3/4", then 1" drill bits. There is quite a bit of rotational force created, as you can see by the bite marks on the shaft. If it was a keyed chuck, it would have spun. Been there done that, (Jacobs 14N, and 18N ball bearing Super Chucks)!

Of course, they can tighten so much, it can require a lot of force to remove the bit. A strap wrench works perfectly.

Been there, done that, just by driving a 3/8 tap, toasted a perfectly good Albrecht trying to get it unstuck, also a little impatience and being rammy contributed.

 

[thestelster]

Been there, done that, just by driving a 3/8 tap, toasted a perfectly good Albrecht trying to get it unstuck, also a little impatience and being rammy contributed.

Ouch!! First time my chuck got stuck, I reached for the channel lock pliers, but then decided against that idea.

 

[Stellrammer]

Ouch!! First time my chuck got stuck, I reached for the channel lock pliers, but then decided against that idea.

 

[hhshermit]

I went to the local garage and was given an old multi-groove belt they had taken off and were about to throw away. Measured the right length around my Albrech chuck and cut 2 pieces a bit longer. Bolted them to a couple of short steel bars and made 2 custom strap wrenches. They live at my lathe and are just the right tools to loosen a keyless chuck when it gets stuck.

 

[Susquatch]

I went to the local garage and was given an old multi-groove belt they had taken off and were about to throw away. Measured the right length around my Albrech chuck and cut 2 pieces a bit longer. Bolted them to a couple of short steel bars and made 2 custom strap wrenches. They live at my lathe and are just the right tools to loosen a keyless chuck when it gets stuck.

It's not obvious to me what this looks like. I think my imagination is being blocked by the strap wrenches I already have.

Pictures?

 

[hhshermit]

Here are a couple of pictures. In hindsight I should probably have had the segmented side on the inside.

 

[Downwindtracker2]

I have rubber strap wrenches for in case I have to adjust rifle scopes, but I just use pipe fitting strap wrenches. Strap wrenches are used on CPVC and PVC valves. At work, the pipe wrenches came out. They used Rohms, and replaced them every so often. Too badly jammed, they were toast. I have a couple of Glacern which come with hook spanners.

 

[Susquatch]

Here are a couple of pictures. In hindsight I should probably have had the segmented side on the inside.

I see. Thanks for the photos. It's all clear now.

FWIW, I would have put the segmented side out too.

 

[Tom Kitta]

I hate keyless chucks and got rid of almost all of mine. The main huge weakness of the design is self tightening feature. It can simply go too tight and than you have huge problem unlocking the chuck & even if you do, most likely it will be damaged. There is a reason they do not make these above about 5/8s and if I ever were to use one it would be only with small drill bits or drilling something I am 100% sure will not put heavy load on the chuck.

Usually when stuck the method is to try to disassemble it - that is probably safest route - cut the drill bit off, drill it out and disassemble. But even if you do that usually chuck is toast as it simply broke by being over tightened.

Jacob's superior design does not have the weakness of self tightening - you tighten as much as you want - but no more! In the worst case you get the drill bit to spin in the chuck.

 

[Susquatch]

I hate keyless chucks and got rid of almost all of mine. The main huge weakness of the design is self tightening feature. It can simply go too tight and than you have huge problem unlocking the chuck & even if you do, most likely it will be damaged.

Have you tried a really good one?

My GS and my South Bend have never done this. The South Bend is 11 years old. I use it on my lathe and sometimes on my Mill/drill. My GS came with my Hartford Mill and I only use it with the mill.

If I recall correctly, @thestelster has an Albrecht and it had never given him a problem either.

Mind you, all three of these are very expensive chucks. Prolly more than most hobby machinists are prepared to spend.

 

[Tom Kitta]

Have you tried a really good one?

My GS and my South Bend have never done this. The South Bend is 11 years old. I use it on my lathe and sometimes on my Mill/drill. My GS came with my Hartford Mill and I only use it with the mill.

If I recall correctly, @thestelster has an Albrecht and it had never given him a problem either.

Mind you, all three of these are very expensive chucks. Prolly more than most hobby machinists are prepared to spend.

There is a number of Albrecht chucks on eBay once in a while that have exact same problem. If the inventor brand name has an issue I am quite sure everyone else has the issue.

You may not have experienced the issue as you may not have been pushing your chucks too hard. This is why I said small drills or small takes, never any scary load. Note I frequently drill hard stuff, 4140, 4340 etc. I also may drill deep. Drill can catch after "pecking" and then with Albrecht chuck it will tighten a lot even when lathe is stalled (!!!)

I still have a GS chuck left - I think in 5/8 - but I am not going to exactly do some destructive testing with it.

 

[Susquatch]

I still have a GS chuck left - I think in 5/8 - but I am not going to exactly do some destructive testing with it.

I sure can't blame you for that!

My GS is 5/8 too. So is my South Bend.

You may not have experienced the issue as you may not have been pushing your chucks too hard. This is why I said small drills or small takes, never any scary load. Note I frequently drill hard stuff, 4140, 4340 etc. I also may drill deep.

I often drill deep, hard, and big.

Jezz, that didn't sound so good.....

Anyways, I have no doubt that I have pushed my chucks hard. Most of my work is farm machinery repair - huge stuff.

I also do work like @thestelster so I know his work is probably similar to mine too. But I can't speak for him and his Albrecht.

I just have not had the problem. I don't know what else to say.

 

[thestelster]

I have 2 Albrecht chucks, and a Rohm Supra. The Albrecht is better than the Rohm in fit and finish, and releases a little easier than the Rohm. The only time they get so tight that they need a strap wrench is when I have to use a large 3"+ hole saw, or sometimes with a 1" silver & demming drill bit. But, no big deal, strap wrench loosens it up right away. But up to half inch bit, flick of the wrist.

 

[Former Member]

Keyless chuck from Accusize, love it. Will be getting a few more for the drill presses and lathe.

Way better grip than keyed chucks.

 

[hhshermit]

Just the other day I locked up my 1/2" keyless chuck (brand unknown) when drilling with a S&D 13/16 bit. Strap wrenches won't touch it. Eventually put it in 6" vise with an 18" pipe wrench. No joy. May have to scrap both the chuck and the brand new bit. Bummer.

I confirm that in my experience these keyless chucks should be restricted to 1/2" bits max.

 

[YYCHM]

Just the other day I locked up my 1/2" keyless chuck (brand unknown) when drilling with a S&D 13/16 bit. Strap wrenches won't touch it. Eventually put it in 6" vise with an 18" pipe wrench. No joy. May have to scrap both the chuck and the brand new bit. Bummer.

I confirm that in my experience these keyless chucks should be restricted to 1/2" bits max.

Take a zip disk to it. Maybe you can save the bit and arbor.

 

[Susquatch]

Just the other day I locked up my 1/2" keyless chuck (brand unknown) when drilling with a S&D 13/16 bit. Strap wrenches won't touch it. Eventually put it in 6" vise with an 18" pipe wrench. No joy. May have to scrap both the chuck and the brand new bit. Bummer.

I confirm that in my experience these keyless chucks should be restricted to 1/2" bits max

Man do I ever feel your pain.

I gotta say that you guys have weakened my faith. Neither of my keyless chucks have ever given me a problem (5/8 Southbend & 1/2 Gerardi). But I rarely use a big bit in them. All my big bits are S&D and I don't take cuts bigger than 1/8 on each side. I also have a cheap MT3 1/2 with a key.

But based on all the bad experiences so many of you guys have had, I think the crappy keyed chuck just got an upgraded status for HD usage. It just seems sooooo contradictory! But I'd be some pissed if I had to scrap either of my good chucks!

Also, both of my keyless chucks will accept a pin wrench. I'd prolly try one of those maybe with a small hammer before I resorted to a pipe-wrench.

I'd also try heating the chuck up, using oil, pouring nitrogen on the bit, etc etc

 

[TorontoBuilder]

We have 3 Albretch keyless chucks.

The only issue I ever had with one if it detaching from the arbour. A good whack settles that

 

[Susquatch]

We have 3 Albretch keyless chucks.

The only issue I ever had with one if it detaching from the arbour. A good whack settles that

A good whack settles LOTS of things......

Three Albrechts eh...... I'm jealous.

I assume 3 different sizes? Or are they different arbours?