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EBay score !

Gearhead88

Super User
I just received a few measuring tools that I purchased on ebay I’ve already got a fairly extensive collection of precision measuring instruments , a bit of a mix but many of them are Mitutoyo . This time I got a smokin deal on a Teclock 2” - 6” bore gauge . I have a Teclock dial indicator I bought 40 years ago , it’s been a great tool and is still like new so I thought , Teclock (Japan ) is known for making quality instruments , I bought this one to take to work and use there , our measuring gear there is not that great . This is a first for me .00005” resolution !! , all my Mitutoyo stuff is .0001”. 6C271F26-B21F-44FB-89A8-FFD62847E8FE.jpeg BCD16CA6-37F8-4AFC-8B00-EE8DA028C82A.jpeg
 
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Gearhead88

Super User
Nice looking bore gage. I was not familiar with teclock but that's good info.
It was an exceptional deal @ $126 US dollars including shipping . It's used but in nice condition , the kit was missing three small spacer washers , I had no trouble making up the appropriate sized spacers , to complete the kit.

Normally a comparable bore guage from Mitutoyo is $500 ish US $
 

Gearhead88

Super User
Ha, I had to look at that dial 3 times. 0.00005 YIKES! My DTI only does 0.0005.
Half a tenth ! I'm gonna try it out today , I need to measure some cylinders / pistons that a friend brought over and see if they need a re-bore.
 

phaxtris

(Ryan)
Premium Member
Premium Member
Oh Man I would be scared to even touch that thing, fearing some kind of hamfisted mistake sending the calibration to the moon!
 

SomeGuy

Hobbyist
Is that sort of precision even useful? Unless everything is perfectly climate controlled, even touching the stuff is going to throw off the readings.
 

Dabbler

ersatz engineer
Is that sort of precision even useful?
oh yes. very.

I once had a friend that was a toolmaker of sorts, who made everything to the tenth. or so he thought. Items made at different times at different temperatures were all different, so your point is well made.

However checking a bore that has to be a gas fit, this gauge is very useful. You need to identify the 'loose spots' and the 'tight spots' when lapping the bore, and the closer you get to equal, the better.

@Gearhead88 you only have to call when you want to sell (which I'm sure will be never)
 
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Gearhead88

Super User
It's nothing special .

The face on this gauge is broken into smaller graduations .
I have five Mitutoyo bore gauges that read in tenths .0001" , simply , there are fewer markings on the face of the gauge .
The Teclock gauge is cool for sure and a sweet deal , other than that it's not all that different than one that reads .0001" .

When measuring Cylinder bores or fitting pistons I try to use torque plates when I can , it stablizes the part and simulates the stresses that are present when the cylinder is in an assembled state .

IMG_1199.JPG

A lot of the cheaper bore guages read in .0005", Too course of a measurement for what I do so I'd never buy one.

If I happen to be honing valve guides then , yes , absolutely , I want to be measuring in tenth's .

This is what a honing machine is capable of .

Also great to fit bushings and many other cylindrical parts .
 
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Darren

Ultra Member
Premium Member
This vise caught my eye the other day:


I asked about shipping, they agreed to ship it to my address in the US, so we made a deal today and it's on its way to me. Its 120mm wide by 150mm opening. Retail price is around $3000.00 USD so $400 shipped is pretty decent :D

s-l1600.jpg
 

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Mcgyver

Ultra Member
Good stuff Jeff......these are where the micrometer stand becomes a necessity!

Unless everything is perfectly climate controlled, even touching the stuff is going to throw off the readings.

Heat expansion will effect the readings, but this whole climate control thing is over done imo. If things are close to room temperature, the amount of expansion is negligible, so you take that into account. Use flood coolant or wait for a part to cool down when doing really finicky work.

A 5F temp difference in temp on a 1" bore equates to 1/2 a tenth. If the temp variance is between the part and the measuring instrument, you incur the error. However if the variance is ambient to the calibration temp (68F), i.e. micrometer and work are at the same temp, the error is mostly mitigated as both the mic and work are made of steel so subject to the same amount of expansion.

Just keep your wits about you. If you don't have much of a variance between the work and instrument, the error from heat expansion should be less that what we can measure/machine to.

Is that sort of precision even useful? Unless everything is perfectly climate controlled, even touching the stuff is going to throw off the readings.

Not an everyday absolutely required sort of thing, but still a definite resounding yes. Why? Fits of course! Two kinds fits, running and interference.

Running fits. I You want a running fit of .001" (bearing or sliding gear on a shaft) How are going have a chance at this if you can't measure reliably to something less that .001". Measure the bore and carefully turn/grind the OD for a perfect amount of clearance.

Interference fits can be a real challenge. Its usually sub thou accuracy. The most challenging I ever need to do is for high end bearings; e.g. P4 Angular contact bearing fits when making a spindle. The bearings might be $700 and have an acceptable tolerance range of .0001" or less. Challenging stuff. and you don't want to mess it up. A lost cause if you can't measure it.

I've Mit gauges in tenths and microns. Microns are a challenge, even when grinding its seems you can get a bit of flicker with surface finish. Less so if honing (Sunnen). To take full advantage of that level of bore measurement accuracy, imo the work needs grinding or honing so surface finish is not affecting the measurement much. However even if boring on the lathe or mill, if it lets you reliably machine to .0005 or .0003, that's 2-3x better than a thou and the difference between success and failure on many fits.

Point being.....you don't have to be working to a tenth, to benefit from being able to measure to a tenth.
 

SomeGuy

Hobbyist
Good stuff Jeff......these are where the micrometer stand becomes a necessity!



Heat expansion will effect the readings, but this whole climate control thing is over done imo. If things are close to room temperature, the amount of expansion is negligible, so you take that into account. Use flood coolant or wait for a part to cool down when doing really finicky work.

A 5F temp difference in temp on a 1" bore equates to 1/2 a tenth. If the temp variance is between the part and the measuring instrument, you incur the error. However if the variance is ambient to the calibration temp (68F), i.e. micrometer and work are at the same temp, the error is mostly mitigated as both the mic and work are made of steel so subject to the same amount of expansion.

Just keep your wits about you. If you don't have much of a variance between the work and instrument, the error from heat expansion should be less that what we can measure/machine to.



Not an everyday absolutely required sort of thing, but still a definite resounding yes. Why? Fits of course! Two kinds fits, running and interference.

Running fits. I You want a running fit of .001" (bearing or sliding gear on a shaft) How are going have a chance at this if you can't measure reliably to something less that .001". Measure the bore and carefully turn/grind the OD for a perfect amount of clearance.

Interference fits can be a real challenge. Its usually sub thou accuracy. The most challenging I ever need to do is for high end bearings; e.g. P4 Angular contact bearing fits when making a spindle. The bearings might be $700 and have an acceptable tolerance range of .0001" or less. Challenging stuff. and you don't want to mess it up. A lost cause if you can't measure it.

I've Mit gauges in tenths and microns. Microns are a challenge, even when grinding its seems you can get a bit of flicker with surface finish. Less so if honing (Sunnen). To take full advantage of that level of bore measurement accuracy, imo the work needs grinding or honing so surface finish is not affecting the measurement much. However even if boring on the lathe or mill, if it lets you reliably machine to .0005 or .0003, that's 2-3x better than a thou and the difference between success and failure on many fits.

Point being.....you don't have to be working to a tenth, to benefit from being able to measure to a tenth.

My point was more around when you get down below tenth's the temperature of the part AND the measuring instrument really comes into play doesn't it? For hobby machinists at home, isn't it a bit difficult to work at those levels without everything being in a climate controlled lab?
 

Mcgyver

Ultra Member
You're right It does. I took your post as wondering why one would need a tenths bore gauge, apologies if that wasn't the meaning.

As for sub tenths, who's machining to less than a tenth? Not me. Machining to a tenth, or even .0002 is bloody difficult. You have to hold your tongue just so lol. I can machine to a tenth, but am only doing so grinding (surface or cylindrical) and in both cases with flood coolant so work and instrument will be very close to the same temp. If I've turned something and the work is warm, time go into the house and check out the lastest posts here until everything is at ambient.

One other thing I do is to set the mic in a stand, then set and lock the spindle to a gauge block. That way you aren't relying on the mic at all; its just a caliper, and the gauge block is at ambient temp.
 
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Gearhead88

Super User
This time of the year , I don't get in a rush to do much measuring until the building has been warmed up for a few hours .

My Garage is not kept at constant controlled temp , when I'm not in there the thermostat is keeping the building at 40 F .

When I'm in the garage , working , I like to keep it around 60 F or slightly below that , for me it's more comfortable .

If any precise measuring is happening I make sure the parts are close to the current ambient temp .

The oil in the tank of my Sunnen machine is somewhat cool this time of year which tends cools the parts as they are being worked , honing can warm up the part , the oil , cools , allows the correct cutting action , flushes away swarf and extends the life of the tooling .

I'm never in a rush .
 
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