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Dividing head restoration

Canadium

Canadium

Ian
Does any one else here have a Walter dividing head similar to mine? Got this Walter HU125N that I would like to restore. Apart from a cleanup and lube it is missing some dividing plates and a tailstock. Maybe more problems here than I will be able to manage. I see Stefan Gotteswinter has a video on his restoration of a similar but smaller one.

Stephan however is far more capable in these things than I! Is it possible to make you own dividing plates? Or for that matter to substitute another tailstock?
 
I think making your own plates would be difficult... I would guess you could find plates that fit meant for an import dividing head or could be adapted.

You could probably substitute another tailstock, it's just the centre height that matters and some are adjustable.
 
You can make your own. You can use a rotating table as he is doing or some guys have had great success printing off to scale and punching the drawing to locate the holes. It is a long process. You could also CNC one if you have that operation accessible.
 
trlvn said:
No hands-on experience here...but if you have a DRO with the bolt-hole-circle function, wouldn't such plates just be a really thorough exercise of the function?

The plates wouldn't even have to start as circles, no?

Craig
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I gotta try that someday soon.... I'm missing one plate for my universal dividing head. It hasn't ever been an issue but it's a really nice exercise for my new DRO.

If not, a rotary table is a slam dunk.

@Canadium - as @Rauce says, I think it's a bit of a challenge for someone new to such things, but on the other hand, if all you ever make is easy stuff you never get to really practice that puffed out chest posture when you show the CFO what you can do. I say go for it! It's only a few pieces of 1/4 plate (or whatever you need). If you fail, just start over and don't show anybody...... Except us! We all enjoy other members screw-ups. It's a requisite part of membership. A sort of brotherhood if you will. I'll show you mine if you show me yours!

One other tip - use a low res setting on the camera you use to take photos. Some of the members use 80" computer screens with a zoom mouse.....
 
Susquatch said:
One other tip - use a low res setting on the camera you use to take photos. Some of the members use 80" computer screens with a zoom mouse.....
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Is this image better?

resize DH.JPG
 
Dabbler said:
@Canadium that loos like a nice, wellmade unit. Impressed.
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I'm getting a lot of serious reservations about this piece right now. I'm finding too many things seized up. There is no rotational motion. I see no locking mechanism still engaged. When I tried taking it apart I found too many seized up screws and bolts. Its not rusty but everything seems to be super tight.
 
Canadium said:
I'm getting a lot of serious reservations about this piece right now. I'm finding too many things seized up. There is no rotational motion. I see no locking mechanism still engaged. When I tried taking it apart I found too many seized up screws and bolts. Its not rusty but everything seems to be super tight.
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Handheld impact driver + heat?
 
Canadium said:
Is this image better?

View attachment 23730
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My comment was a rotten attempt at humour not meant to be serious.

I was referring to posting your work not the fixture. And my comment was really about avoiding criticism by making the photo too grainy to see anything. The humour is prolly lost by now.

On a serious note, I'd start by giving it a real good soaking in a good penetrant for several days. Then try to figure out where you have the most mechanical advantage and start trying to move it there. I doubt that is at the chuck.
 
Just zoomed in.... LOL......

Looks like there is at least one ball oiler on it - prolly a few more. Good place to get penetrating oil into it.

Seems to me the best place to try to turn it is where the divider plates are. If it will not turn after soaking and you have exhaustively looked for locks, I'd prolly do what @Chicken lights suggests but I would make a very tight fitting adapter to attach the impact gun to in order to minimize any damage to the input shaft and key way. My universal dividing head is very delicate in that area so I'd be really really careful.

I'd also avoid the temptation to bake it. It's probable that it's gummed up and baking it will only make it worse.

Some of those heads had a cam to lock the chuck and many of them also had a sliding pin to lock the chuck. Yours appears to have the sliding pin at the top but it also "looks like" it is disengaged.

Another totally different idea is to soak it till the end of May and then bring it to the meet N greet at Brent's...... You will get a hands on evaluation and lots of advice there! Just stand back and let the ideas fly! I'd wager a good bet it will follow you home in pieces......... One way or the other....... LOL!
 
Susquatch said:
Just zoomed in.... LOL......

Looks like there is at least one ball oiler on it - prolly a few more. Good place to get penetrating oil into it.

Seems to me the best place to try to turn it is where the divider plates are. If it will not turn after soaking and you have exhaustively looked for locks, I'd prolly do what @Chicken lights suggests but I would make a very tight fitting adapter to attach the impact gun to in order to minimize any damage to the input shaft and key way. My universal dividing head is very delicate in that area so I'd be really really careful.

I'd also avoid the temptation to bake it. It's probable that it's gummed up and baking it will only make it worse.

Some of those heads had a cam to lock the chuck and many of them also had a sliding pin to lock the chuck. Yours appears to have the sliding pin at the top but it also "looks like" it is disengaged.

Another totally different idea is to soak it till the end of May and then bring it to the meet N greet at Brent's...... You will get a hands on evaluation and lots of advice there! Just stand back and let the ideas fly! I'd wager a good bet it will follow you home in pieces......... One way or the other....... LOL!
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Yes several ball oilers. Do you have a favourite penetrating oil?

Yes there is a sliding pin, one of the few things on it that still seems to work, and yes it is disengaged.

The problem with bringing it to the meet and greet is that its so dam heavy! I was contemplating soaking it but have to find a suitable container, figure out what to soak it with, and eat a lot of wheaties so that I can lift it and put it into its bath!
 
Canadium said:
Yes several ball oilers. Do you have a favourite penetrating oil?

Yes there is a sliding pin, one of the few things on it that still seems to work, and yes it is disengaged.

The problem with bringing it to the meet and greet is that its so dam heavy! I was contemplating soaking it but have to find a suitable container, figure out what to soak it with, and eat a lot of wheaties so that I can lift it and put it into its bath!
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You only have to put it into the car alone. Lots of hands there to help you get it out. Maybe @Brent H 's wench will be there too.

I have lots of favorite penetrating oils..... LOL.

For that job I'd prolly use good old diesel oil (or kerosene) because you can get enough of it to soak the whole assembly in a big Tupperware tub.
 
@Canadium, if you plan a complete overhaul, you can soak it first in rust remover - like a bucket of Evap-O-Rust and then a good soak in the WD40 penetrating oil. Usually I will take a wire brush to everything, do the soak, rinse and wire brush again.

If you bring it up we can always let it run in the parts washer for a few hours - and we have a few strong lads hanging around that can help with anything seized up. :p

At least send you back with the project apart and good for a scrub/reassembly ;)
 
Canadium said:
I have resorted to my handheld impact driver and it has worked wonders but I don't have a bit with a large size allen wrench head.
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Any idea on the size? I’ve got from 1/8” up to 7/8” , plus metric. Although with gas prices it’s probably cheaper to buy what you need locally
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Chicken lights said:
Any idea on the size? I’ve got from 1/8” up to 7/8” , plus metric. Although with gas prices it’s probably cheaper to buy what you need locally
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The socket in my hand held is 5/16 and the bolt I'm trying to loosen is 3/8. Not sure that the hand held will do any better than hammering on the allen wrench because the bolt is fairly long and probably just twisting without coming loose. In fact I was worried that the bolt would just break off.

I did a cursory search around to see if anyone locally had any such bit but couldn't find exactly what I needed.
 
I would keep impact tools away from precision instruments; you’ll never know what damage you do with them until it is too late.

A lot of worm drives have a bronze gear and a steel (CI) one meshing. Or there are bronze plain bearings. The impact could forever destroy either of them.

100% agree with advise of soaking the whole unit. You can go the rust removal/degrease route first or (what I like to do) soak in your favourite penetrating fluid - I use kerosene (only because the old manuals make reference to it). More “modern” fluids will work (maybe even better?).

Then you need a lot of TIME! Like weeks/months for stubborn items. Every day give it a little tap with a soft blow hammer (as you are walking by for example). It will eventually break loose.

The surface contact areas on the rotating members on a DH are very large (for strength and rigidity purposes). Also tolerances are extremely tight. Even the slightest corrosion (or dried up lubricant) will render the surface immobile.

So a thin, non corrosive penetrating liquid becomes your friend. The light tapping with a hammer produces just enough of a shockwave in the material that each time the liquid finds its way a little deeper in between the surfaces and eventually they separate.

As soon as you have movement, try to separate the parts. It is preferred not to slide potentially corroded surfaces across each other as the oxide (being harder than the native material in most cases) will score the precision surfaces.

Once apart, clean everything and reassemble. Test functionality and repair any problems.

Enjoy your new tool…
 
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