1951 Monarch 10EE at Auction

M

MachiningNerd

New Member
Dabbler said:
Monarchs have a big cult following in the U.S. and some of that fever has spread north (like a virus?).

They are no better, and far more primitive the the current Taiwanese offerings. Many of the Chinese lathes surpass Monarchs also. It's all a matter of what makes you feel good.
Click to expand...

You don't think they are better than a modern Taiwanese manual lathe? Do you have a few links of these machines your saying are better? The Calgary auction 10ee for sale was mine, and I have to say I'm going to need some examples to back that up - it is by far the nicest, quietest, most precise manual lathe I have ever ran.

Stop by to the viewing today or tomorrow and I'll crank it up to 4000RPM for you.
 
H

Hacker

Super User
RobinHood said:
Yes, I met Horst when he had a Clarkson T&C grinder for sale. He gave us an extensive shop tour. Coincidentally to him selling his T&C G, I had a bid in for one at another location - ended up getting it, otherwise would have bought Horst’s.

You lucky guy. I did not even know that he was selling it. I wanted that lathe really bad - been looking out for it ever since I saw it in his shop.... Oh well too late.

That Menziken lathe was made 20 min from where I grew up. I presume you like it a lot?
Click to expand...

I stay in contact with Horst and give him a hand connecting up the machines that he is working on. I got the lathe by accident, they were selling off a Deckel Mill but I got there too late and it was sold. I asked if they were selling anything else and he said that they would be selling the Menziken next year. So I made arrangements to buy it and picked it up six months latter. I too think I am very lucky. It is a nice machine to use and is a good size for the work I do with it. I have used the tracer but have not figured out how to use the relieving attachment.

That is very interesting about growing up near where it was built. There is so little information on these machines. What happened to the company that made them?
 
H

Hacker

Super User
Tom Kitta said:
its 15% or 18% plus GST and the seller on larger items pays like 10% as well. On small item auction seller fees are usually at least 20% and more common is 25% or even 30%. There is sometimes lot fee as well usually 25. On items > 10000 you can usually either negotiate seller fees or for say cars there is a flat fee of few hundred $.

From seller perspective it is a world of cloak and dagger - no fees are posted ... ever.
Click to expand...
The fees are riduculous, before I bid I always add 25% to the price and ask myself is this worth it?
 
M

MachiningNerd

New Member
John Conroy said:
There is a very nice looking Kent 3VS mill on the same bidspotter auction also. It looks like new.

https://www.bidspotter.com/en-us/au...0024/lot-c8a57b7e-807c-4bbe-aae6-acaf01136285
Click to expand...

She is 23 years old and I can count the dents in the bed on one hand! Always oiled daily when used, always wiped ways with oil and gave lube system a few pumps before moving her. I bought the business from an older man who was my journeyman and when this machine was new in 1993, he took it apart and hand lapped and polished the ways - No DRO but you can trust the dials to less than .001, with a backlash of around .005.

Another interesting thing is the gibbs are all steel, my understanding is the newer Bridegports and Kents manuals have turcite gibbs that wear much faster.

The casting is Meehanite, and coolant was never used, only cutting oil. She did some production in 1993-2000 and was mostly retired when the owner purchased a CNC mill in 2000, used since then only for tinkering and supporting the CNC's, some small run light production jobs etc.
 
Dabbler

Dabbler

ersatz engineer
@MachiningNerd you get me wrong. I am a fan, but everything has its place. I'm trying to buy one that has a very good provenance. 'Good' and "better" have different meanings to different people.

I never machine at 4000 RPM, for instance, and don't envision any need to for my kind of machining.

To answer your question directly: There's an outfit in London, Ontario that sells a heavy lathe with a built in ELS that goes to 3000 RPM. For a while I was looking for a larger more accurate machine and I notice a lot of manual lathes that are starting to import horizontal CNC Machining Center technology to manual lathes. (These are Taiwanese, and not distributed here, but you can still buy and ship)

I'm not going to get into a p****ing match about this. I'd love to own a Monarch 10ee, but I went with a LeBlond 15X60 instead. It meets my needs better as a lot of my machining is bigger pieces, and having a 12" pratt Bernerd chuck is perfect for what I do.

The price is higher because of the cult following. Out of the 150 members here (perhaps more), only a few, perhaps one or 2, can really require the precision that a perfect condition 10EE can provide.

I do wish you great luck on your sale, and I hope you get the price you were hoping for.
 
M

MachiningNerd

New Member
Dabbler said:
@MachiningNerd you get me wrong. I am a fan, but everything has its place. I'm trying to buy one that has a very good provenance. 'Good' and "better" have different meanings to different people.

I never machine at 4000 RPM, for instance, and don't envision any need to for my kind of machining.

To answer your question directly: There's an outfit in London, Ontario that sells a heavy lathe with a built in ELS that goes to 3000 RPM. For a while I was looking for a larger more accurate machine and I notice a lot of manual lathes that are starting to import horizontal CNC Machining Center technology to manual lathes. (These are Taiwanese, and not distributed here, but you can still buy and ship)

I'm not going to get into a p****ing match about this. I'd love to own a Monarch 10ee, but I went with a LeBlond 15X60 instead. It meets my needs better as a lot of my machining is bigger pieces, and having a 12" pratt Bernerd chuck is perfect for what I do.

The price is higher because of the cult following. Out of the 150 members here (perhaps more), only a few, perhaps one or 2, can really require the precision that a perfect condition 10EE can provide.

I do wish you great luck on your sale, and I hope you get the price you were hoping for.
Click to expand...

No ill intentions, I actually just want to know what brands your thinking of - I'm going to need a replacement for the Monarch!
 
Brent H

Brent H

Ultra Member
@MachiningNerd, what is your reason to part with the machine? It looks very well maintained and, as @Tom Kitta suggests, is the Ferrari of lathes - especially more so for the home hobby guy! I drive a Lada by comparison but it gets me where I need to go.. LOL.... Are you in need of a larger lathe - more bed/swing?

I was surprised that the 10EE was a 1020 sized lathe (true swing 12.5 I guess).

Maybe a Colchester Master or something that can do both Metric and Imperial without significant changes to back gearing?
 
Dabbler

Dabbler

ersatz engineer
Thanks for your clarification. I've had this discussion already on the HM forum, and those guys get very punchy about this exact topic. I'v had to defend myuself one too many times. My apologies.

Ah.... This research was 5 years ago, and in the mean time a bunch of my equipment has changed. I believed I'd never get Bert's LeBlond 15X60, but then he relented and gave it to me at a steal price, if only I moved it out of his basement to my garage. Long story documented elsewhere on the site.

I don't remember the brands, as it was long ago and 2 or 3 browser changes - If I think of any locations, I'll PM you. The most interesting was a 13" one from London, but that was $40K CDN, which is too rich for my blood, but still cheaper than $103K$ US for a new 10EE without ELS.

I'll have a look at my which list directory and see what I have there.
 
Tom Kitta

Tom Kitta

Ultra Member
Colchester I am afraid is no match for Monarch 10EE. It is much better then a lot of lathes and is a 10 x 20 and great to work with (true swing 11.5) but is 1/3 of the weight - still heavy but not a tank. Spindle tops out at 3000 rpm.

On the other hand I am about 1000 CAD into the lathe including tooling... so bang for the buck is great.
 
M

MachiningNerd

New Member
Brent H said:
@MachiningNerd, what is your reason to part with the machine? It looks very well maintained and, as @Tom Kitta suggests, is the Ferrari of lathes - especially more so for the home hobby guy! I drive a Lada by comparison but it gets me where I need to go.. LOL.... Are you in need of a larger lathe - more bed/swing?

I was surprised that the 10EE was a 1020 sized lathe (true swing 12.5 I guess).

Maybe a Colchester Master or something that can do both Metric and Imperial without significant changes to back gearing?
Click to expand...

Unfortunately our business has not been doing well with Covid, most of our work is aircraft repair work that rely's on flight volumes to provide the regular work volume we are use to - we are diversifying more and still going to remain open with two CNC mills, we are also going to be moving in the fall as our lease on this bay is up and we need something better suited and at a lower cost. Our current bay is 2900 Square feet main floor but only 1500 functional shop space.

Wish I could keep the Monarch, however some of it is out of my hands.

I met Tom today when he came in, and I'm glad that I found this group! I think I will fit in!
 
Brent H

Brent H

Ultra Member
@MachiningNerd : very sorry to hear it is a business (you) that has been impacted by this crap covid stuff....argh! Hopefully you are able to recover sooner than later. The Lathe you are selling looks to be in immaculate shape and that speaks very well to its past owner. You should have lots of fun on the group here - lots of questions go "flying" around! good luck with the auction - good times are coming soon!
 
TOBARApprentice

TOBARApprentice

Super User
Machiningnerd. Sorry to hear about the shop. I fly for Westjet and know how badly Calgary, and Alberta has been hit. And now with Keystone getting chopped I think it will be a challenging next few years. I have a lead on another Monarch a bit closer to Ontario so the “Alberta Monarchs” are now either a bit too much, or a bit “not working enough” (Edmonton), lol. Keep in touch though...... great group here. Cheers.

Derek.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
M

MachiningNerd

New Member
TOBARApprentice said:
Machiningnerd. Sorry to hear about the shop. I fly for Westjet and know how badly Calgary, and Alberta has been hit. And now with Keystone getting chopped I think it will be a challenging next few years. I have a lead on another Monarch a bit closer to Ontario so the “Alberta Monarchs” are now either a bit too much, or a bit “not working enough” (Edmonton), lol. Keep in touch though...... great group here. Cheers.

Derek.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Thank you Derek!

Many of the wheels we use to repair are Westjet wheels, Bearing bore repairs, inflation valve bore repairs, key screw hole repairs etc... we use to get 5 wheels a week as well as brake components - now its 2-3 per month.

I hope for both our sakes that travel opens up again soon!

Aaron
 
YYCHM

YYCHM

(Craig)
Premium Member
Tom Kitta

Tom Kitta

Ultra Member
Prices were out of this world - I got my attachment but I paid arm and a leg for it ... but some people paid over 500 with fees for ... like 10 horizontal cutters (!!!)

Similar to mine mill went with fees for 10k. That is about double what I paid just 4 years ago.
 
Blue Wall

Blue Wall

Active Member
Tom Kitta said:
Prices were out of this world - I got my attachment but I paid arm and a leg for it ... but some people paid over 500 with fees for ... like 10 horizontal cutters (!!!)

Similar to mine mill went with fees for 10k. That is about double what I paid just 4 years ago.
Click to expand...
Yeah I was watching and thought the stuff went high!
 
H

Hacker

Super User
Tom Kitta said:
Prices were out of this world - I got my attachment but I paid arm and a leg for it ... but some people paid over 500 with fees for ... like 10 horizontal cutters (!!!)

Similar to mine mill went with fees for 10k. That is about double what I paid just 4 years ago.
Click to expand...
Same here I got what I wanted but I thought the prices on the tooling was high. Sure no deals to brag about.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top