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WTB: Bench Mill

SomeGuy

SomeGuy

Hobbyist
Alright, time to start more seriously looking for a bench mill. Here's the rundown of what I'd like:

- Bench mill - I don't have room for a knee mill
- Roughly 1.5hp, variable speed ideally, can be 120v or 240v (I have 100a of 240v available within a few feet of where the mill will go), would prefer not to deal with a VFD though
- 25-30" wide table, 7-9" deep table, 16-20" spindle to table (I have space constraints) roughly
- 400-600lb range, don't want a mini mill but don't want a bridgeport size
- Dovetail column, don't want a round column
- Within an hour of the Kitchener-Waterloo area
- Reasonable budget, no $5k+ clapped out projects
- Some tooling would be nice, at least maybe a vise but isn't super important
- A 3-axis DRO would also be nice

A Precision Matthews PM-727V would check every single box, but with all the options I'd want and getting it here, it's roughly $7000 so finding something used locally would be better.

If anyone comes across a nice used bench mill somewhere out there, let me know!
 
SomeGuy said:
Alright, time to start more seriously looking for a bench mill. Here's the rundown of what I'd like:

- Bench mill - I don't have room for a knee mill
- Roughly 1.5hp, variable speed ideally, can be 120v or 240v (I have 100a of 240v available within a few feet of where the mill will go), would prefer not to deal with a VFD though
- 25-30" wide table, 7-9" deep table, 16-20" spindle to table (I have space constraints) roughly
- 400-600lb range, don't want a mini mill but don't want a bridgeport size
- Dovetail column, don't want a round column
- Within an hour of the Kitchener-Waterloo area
- Reasonable budget, no $5k+ clapped out projects
- Some tooling would be nice, at least maybe a vise but isn't super important
- A 3-axis DRO would also be nice

A Precision Matthews PM-727V would check every single box, but with all the options I'd want and getting it here, it's roughly $7000 so finding something used locally would be better.

If anyone comes across a nice used bench mill somewhere out there, let me know!
Click to expand...
Are you firm on all your requirements? I've been watching the used market for ~3 years and I don't think I've seen a single example of that configuration come up in that time. The dovetail column mills that seem to come to market are all in the 'mini-mill' category. My impression is that dovetail mills only started to push out round-column mills maybe 10-12 years ago? So there are just not that many out there in the wild whereas round-column mills had a 30+ year run.

Does somebody know the history of dovetail mills? When did they first start hitting the market? I think of Sieg as one of the big names in this space. Did they develop the concept? Were the first dovetail mills in the mini-mill sizes? And then beefier versions came later?

BTW, I wouldn't rule out a round-column mill. If you think through your operations ahead of time, it is pretty seldom that you absolutely have to reposition the head when swapping tools. A set of stubby drills helps a lot. Just food for thought.

Craig
 
trlvn said:
Are you firm on all your requirements? I've been watching the used market for ~3 years and I don't think I've seen a single example of that configuration come up in that time. The dovetail column mills that seem to come to market are all in the 'mini-mill' category. My impression is that dovetail mills only started to push out round-column mills maybe 10-12 years ago? So there are just not that many out there in the wild whereas round-column mills had a 30+ year run.

Does somebody know the history of dovetail mills? When did they first start hitting the market? I think of Sieg as one of the big names in this space. Did they develop the concept? Were the first dovetail mills in the mini-mill sizes? And then beefier versions came later?

BTW, I wouldn't rule out a round-column mill. If you think through your operations ahead of time, it is pretty seldom that you absolutely have to reposition the head when swapping tools. A set of stubby drills helps a lot. Just food for thought.

Craig
Click to expand...
If the price was right, any of those can slip. I missed out on a local $1000 PDM-30 a couple months ago by a half hour (listing was up for under an hour and they already had a buyer). Saw a Craftex CX-600 for $2000 but it was a couple hours away and not the greatest deal (they're $2400+tax new) and a bit smaller than I'd like. But both were close that I might have bit.
 
trlvn said:
Are you firm on all your requirements? I've been watching the used market for ~3 years and I don't think I've seen a single example of that configuration come up in that time. The dovetail column mills that seem to come to market are all in the 'mini-mill' category. My impression is that dovetail mills only started to push out round-column mills maybe 10-12 years ago? So there are just not that many out there in the wild whereas round-column mills had a 30+ year run.

Does somebody know the history of dovetail mills? When did they first start hitting the market? I think of Sieg as one of the big names in this space. Did they develop the concept? Were the first dovetail mills in the mini-mill sizes? And then beefier versions came later?

BTW, I wouldn't rule out a round-column mill. If you think through your operations ahead of time, it is pretty seldom that you absolutely have to reposition the head when swapping tools. A set of stubby drills helps a lot. Just food for thought.

Craig
Click to expand...

@GerryinBelleRiver has a Clausing 8520 bench top that looks exceptionally close to a smaller brother of the Bridgeport. It's a gorgeous mill. I've seen it in person. If I had that I'd be a pretty happy camper.

I'd add that to your searches if I were you.

Thread 'Clausing 8520 mill refresh' https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.com/threads/clausing-8520-mill-refresh.4833/
 
Susquatch said:
@GerryinBelleRiver has a Clausing 8520 bench top that looks exceptionally close to a smaller brother of the Bridgeport. It's a gorgeous mill. I've seen it in person. If I had that I'd be a pretty happy camper.

I'd add that to your searches if I were you.

Thread 'Clausing 8520 mill refresh' https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.com/threads/clausing-8520-mill-refresh.4833/
Click to expand...

I'd rather not have a project per say, cleaning sure, but a full refresh/rebuild isn't in my cards. Otherwise, that does look like a nice little mill.
 
SomeGuy said:
I'd rather not have a project per say, cleaning sure, but a full refresh/rebuild isn't in my cards. Otherwise, that does look like a nice little mill.
Click to expand...

My impression is that Gerry is very talented and loves to make his machines perfect. I'd prolly be happy with it as is plus a few improvements.

But it sounds like you should be saving up to buy a new one. I don't know how you could buy a used one without taking a few big risks unless it belonged to a very good friend.
 
Susquatch said:
My impression is that Gerry is very talented and loves to make his machines perfect. I'd prolly be happy with it as is plus a few improvements.

But it sounds like you should be saving up to buy a new one. I don't know how you could buy a used one without taking a few big risks unless it belonged to a very good friend.
Click to expand...

Oh, Gerry's in particular might be good, wasn't any offense to him...but it's kinda a crap shoot on older equipment unless it's very clean.

I bought my lathe used from some random guy on facebook marketplace, it was dirty but not a very old machine so wasn't like it could be entirely clapped out, and the guy was a machinist by day and showed me it running before I bought it (was a nice guy).

Also, no need to save, I have the money to buy a new one right now, but a used machine might be a better deal and come with a bunch of extras. I'd rather hunt around for a bit before I pull the trigger.
 
Susquatch said:
This is insane....... That's not an auction. That's a con job!
Click to expand...
Haven’t seen the workers comp thing before but I also haven’t seen that auctioneer before and they all have their own T&Cs

The right to bid on their own lots is pretty standard though.

As for other auctioneers on Bidspotter I’ve had nothing but good experiences with Infinity Asset Solutions.
 
Ryan,
If you do not want a fixer-upper look at Busy Bee or KBC.
They have a variety of NEW mid-sized mills.
Price ranges from $3000 to 5000.
I know the PM mills were expensive, that’s why I went with the KING Canada.
My little mill was around $1200.
 

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LenVW said:
Ryan,
If you do not want a fixer-upper look at Busy Bee or KBC.
They have a variety of NEW mid-sized mills.
Price ranges from $3000 to 5000.
I know the PM mills were expensive, that’s why I went with the KING Canada.
My little mill was around $1200.
Click to expand...

Yeah, the KC-20 or CX-600 could potentially do the job at a fair bit lower price. I just worry about going too small, both are 250-300lb machines and I want something that can comfortably do steel without an absurdly slow removal rate. How well does yours work on steel?
 
My KC-15VS has a 3/4hp motor and speed range up to 2600 rpm while most mini-mills were 1/2hp.
I like to limit the HSS end mills to 1/2” in mild steel and I do not take a cut deeper then 1/4”, but, I have yet to stall my mill due to lack of power.

I have used a 1” dual-carbide insert flycutter to hog-out mild steel 1/4” deep, without any problems.

I spent 4 years on an Ex-Cell-O #602 knee mill in the 1980s and the only thing I miss with my KING mill is the ease of vertical control for the table height (Z axis).
I did not want to pay another $5k just for that.

It all depends on what you need to do.
 
LenVW said:
My KC-15VS has a 3/4hp motor and speed range up to 2600 rpm while most mini-mills were 1/2hp.
I like to limit the HSS end mills to 1/2” in mild steel and I do not take a cut deeper then 1/4”, but, I have yet to stall my mill due to lack of power.

I have used a 1” dual-carbide insert flycutter to hog-out mild steel 1/4” deep, without any problems.

I spent 4 years on an Ex-Cell-O #602 knee mill in the 1980s and the only thing I miss with my KING mill is the ease of vertical control for the table height (Z axis).
I did not want to pay another $5k just for that.

It all depends on what you need to do.
Click to expand...

Well that's interesting...so a size up from that might do the job.

I've been measuring a different spot in my garage this evening, basically moving my drill press and putting a mill there...might work for space which would open up a few more options. The drill press isn't as wide, but seems most mills the base of them anyway isn't as wide as my welding cart which is about 14 inches. It would only work though if I can crank the table to it's far right of travel when not in use and there wasn't much overhang.

Anyone want to grab me a picture of their mill with roughly a 25-30 inch table at full right with some measurements of the remaining overhang on the left?
 
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