Single lip cutter /U3 tool cutter grinder / Deckel SO clone

[PeterT]

The real question is wear vs price. Hard to judge from where we are standing. The grime & handles that's easy peasy. Renzetti says the slide bar & feed mechanism is the heart of the machine which I believe, kind of like the lathe bed & dial feeds. If the price was real good & it didn't have a lifetime of hours on might be worth it.

I actually don't know yet what constitutes a proper collet set, it surely must vary by person. Some shops I imagine spend say 80% of time on a few common shaft sizes resharpening. Or maybe even grinding tools in production mode so they do 100 cutters all with 3/8 shank, that type of thing. There are also other fixtures to mount irregular shanks that so that's another option. I'm looking forward to getting service out of mine, especially custom cutters.

 

[PeterT]

That would end it there. Totally out of my hobby budget. Even if that is Canadian dollars, which I'm guessing it is.

As it did for me & yes $CDN. The interesting thing to know is a real Deckel is 3X this price which is why old whipped ones on Ebay go for big bucks. the best garage sale score you could ever find is a Deckel.

As far as I'm concerned we live in glorious times that a ~75% equivalent clone can be had for substantially lower prices. Yes there are people who have home built somewhat equivalent machines. But they are pretty involved projects, the better ones involving castings. So choose yer poison.

 

[Janger]

@Alexander in your experience do any shops send end mills of any kind out for sharpening?

Peter/Perry how long would it take to sharpen a 1/2” 4 flute carbide end mill?

 

[Perry]

I'm not too sure. From what I read there is a bit of a set up time for drill bits or endmills. Once you get it set up it appears fairly fast on youtube.

My main plan for mine if I manage to get one is to cut special cutters and maybe single point cutters for small gears. (really small gears-watch size)
I gave up on the idea of sharpening end mills a long time ago. Drill bits on the other hand......I think I'll be building one of these.

https://www.gadgetbuilder.com/DrillSharp.html#Facet4

 

[PeterT]

Not necessarily about the grinder but recent Stefan video on the 2 collet systems in question (starts around 4:50). Note the comments about the offshore clones of Deckel collets. Not the end of the world especially in a grinder but something to be aware of. This also got me thinking maybe my idea of an R8-ER## collet adapter is maybe not such a crazy notion. I'll have to see if it fits the head though.

 

[Dabbler]

I have an R8-ER40 collet adapter and a set of ER collets if you want to try them out.

 

[PeterT]

Thanks John. I have an R8 ER 16 or 20 I can’t recall. I suspect the nut length may factor in what can be accommodated in the grinder head so likely smaller is better. I’m going to scope lumber for bench materials now that we have a break from minus 40 billion Celsius.

 

[Tom Kitta]

Still that is over 1000 USD to get it here plus don't forget tax on it 5% as well as brokerage fee (if you use Border Bee that would be like 30 CAD).

For about same price you can get Universal tool cutter grinder with accessories. I lost an auction like over a year ago for one with motorized work head and some other stuff that went in for over 1300 (which I thought was excessive). Few months ago I picked up British made from 1960s J&S Universal Tool Cutter Grinder for over 700 with fees - I think with drive to Edmonton to pick it up it worked out like 850. However, it has no motorized work head I just replaced belt on it. So far it is setup to only do HSS lathe tool bits - which was its previous job. Chinese new motorized work head is around 600-700 so as you can see a bit tooled up cutter grinder is around 1500.

Of course TC&G is way better tool then Deckel clone - if you actually have accessories for it.

My plan is lathe HSS, eventually HSS for horizontal mill, drill bits (through its not that easy), HSS end mills.

I just sharpened 2 sets of knives for wood planner but I used surface grinder.

I know some people don't have space. Yes its an issue. Yes T&CG come very rarely on sale these days - I have been looking for one for few years. And yes, some accessories may cost few arms and few legs.

 

[PeterT]

I've been on the lookout for a used clone of Deckel for years. Strangely they just don't seem to come up often. I'm not sure why.
Real Deckel's, forget it, very expensive if the seller has teh faintest idea what they are worth. Or they are 'well used' with issues.
I have seen older T&CG's but most seemed very heavy, at least for my purposes.
Do you have a pic of your J&S model?

 

[PeterT]

I rest my case LOL
https://www.kijiji.ca/v-power-tool/...-grinder-sharpener-made-in-germany/1481580979

 

[Perry]

I was told (lol) that I actually wanted a Cutter Master. Not the U3 clone.

Well those are not cheap either. I did find a Chinese clone of it. (Not cheap)

https://www.made-in-china.com/showr...iluerJNzkVhSTc/China-Cutter-Master-M6020.html

The cutter master actually looks simple enough to build a smaller scaled down version.

 

[Dabbler]

I rest my case LOL
https://www.kijiji.ca/v-power-tool/...-grinder-sharpener-made-in-germany/1481580979

That looks like a very good one. Probably worth it if you are scrooge mcduck.

 

[John Conroy]

A used Deckel on Amazon.

https://www.amazon.ca/Deckel-SO-66-8918-Cutter-Grinder-Accessories/dp/B076L2JJGJ

 

[Tom Kitta]

This is the best I have - it is as it was at pickup location - I take pictures with me so when something is missing I can dispute it.
Its about 700kg. So not light at all. Table swivels. Its from 1960s. Uses strange groved belt drive - but was not an issue to replace as it is used in ... cars. It does not have a big footprint - like a larger pedestal grinder.
Main issue for me is accessories - fully accessorized TC&G can be very expensive. Some attachments - like radious attachment are so expensive most people figured out they never go through enough ball end mills to pay for it.

Used Deckel does cost arm and a leg.

That other Kijiji Deckel is way, way too many arms and legs.

Remember people that it is just this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tool_and_cutter_grinder#D-bit_grinder
It can sharpen end mills (tips only) and do lathe bits. I.e. it is less capable then a surface grinder by a wide margin. Maybe you can get more mileage out of it but not too much more - with some thought and some more attachments.