Sanders?

[Janger]

I have a little 4x36" belt bench sander with the circular disc. It has a little motor - it works fine for what it is. It's slow and I can stall it pretty easily. It would be nice if it was more powerful. It was $40 used I think... Similar to: https://www.kmstools.com/king-canada-4-x-36-belt-6-disc-sander-117779
I want to take mill scale off in a hurry, handle burrs, and shape parts. The usual. I also find trying to sand the inside of corners there is not enough clearance to get in there.

You can get this new combination at Busy bee for $399, 1HP motor (Chinese), 6" x 49" belt and the disc. Similar to what I have but bigger.
https://www.busybeetools.com/products/belt-and-disc-sander-6-x-9-craftex-cx.html

Similar is this from King Canada 1HP for $469
https://www.kmstools.com/king-canada-6-x-48-belt-disc-sander-5767

There is this King Industrial at KMS 3" x 79" belt 2HP 220V 10Amp. $950 A metal working product not wood repurposed. Looks good. not a very wide belt.
https://www.kmstools.com/king-industrial-3-x-79-metal-belt-sander-141967

@CalgaryPT Peter I believe has a kalamazoo maybe similar to this one 20" disc sander. Very fancy. $3K USD
https://www.trick-tools.com/Kalamazoo-20-inch-Disc-Grinder-DS20-10370

Anybody have any thoughts? is variable speed useful? what about the clearance problem into corners? are zirconium belts a problem to source? I've never found the round disc useful and it tends to rattle so I took it off. Why do you want a belt vs a disc?

 

[CalgaryPT]

I do have the Kalamazoo you mention, but also have an Ellis ( http://www.ellissaw.com/ellis-6000-belt-grinder/ ). Both are very useful and have their specific purposes. I use both about the same amount, but I think the disc is better suited for squaring off and for square tubing, which meets my needs for fabrication. For smaller stuff and machining guys, I think the belt is the way to go; more flexible to your needs.

The reason why the rattle occurs on the disc machines I think John is that these machines are designed for wood. The platten has little mass and the pressure from feeding metal deforms it causing the rattle (my 2 cents of engineering theory). The Kalamazoo platten must weigh 40 lbs and takes 30 mins to stop after power is cut. It doesn't rattle. But it is way overkill for small stuff.

Having said this I had a Crappy Tire wood disc sander for years and years and used it only for metal. Still worked like a dream when I sold it. It was cast and the platten was bulky for a wood machine.

I see little value in variable speed. Maybe the knife makers do, but I never have.

Zirconia belts/discs are the way to go if you can afford them. Not hard to source anymore.

You're free to try my machines if you want John.

 

[Dabbler]

I buy my zirc belts off amazon.ca from Red Label Abrasives.

Your little sander will be better at material removal (in metal) if you go to a much coarser belt.

I have a 35 yr old busy bee 6 X 48. It works well. A disc or belt sander is so simple that a BB is a viable option. Go for 2X72 if you intend on buying one and want the best for metal working - more versatile and easy belt availability.

I also have a 1 X 30 with fine grit for polish and sharpening tungsten.

 

[historicalarms]

Like you I have the 4 x 36 belt with a round plate as well but same as you again I very seldom use the plate....however the belt part is probably the most used machine in the shop, everything that comes out of the lathe or mill usually gets a "burr removal" slight touch to the belt.

again as you I find the 4" belt a bit of a pain on some weird shaped pieces so also have a 1" wide belt machine that the rollers are somewhat smaller dia., allowing tighter inside curve work.

for 99% of the 4" belt work I just use the hardware available 400 grit belts but a buddy of mine located some 1100 grit belts somewhere in Calgary and gave me a few that if you want to get real nasty edges on a knife or similar object there your huckleberry. Even the wore out 400 grit belts will work for tuning HSS cutting bits but damn those 1100 grits are smooth.

 

[Tom O]

Has anybody tried citric acid baths for removing scale?

 

[Brian H]

I had a o at making my own 2 x 72 belt grinder. Works very well and fit well into my budget! I just couldn't justify the cost of the commercial units out there. I like the variety and cost of belts available.
I'm still making various tooling and accessories to go along with it

 

[CalgaryPT]

What a beautifully clean shop. Nice job on the grinder.

 

[Brian H]

What a beautifully clean shop. Nice job on the grinder.

Thanks. Keeping it that clean is always a chore, it always seems there are several projects on the go and there inevitably in the way of each other. I usually do a good clean up every month or so (usually takes all weekend too...LOL)

 

[CalgaryPT]

Well you win an award from me. Sorry to say that isn't worth much. But congrats. It's beautiful.

 

[Chicken lights]

Would you guys build or buy a tool rest/table for your sanders?
If you guys vote for building one....I’ll take volunteers to step up...

 

[Janger]

Has anybody tried citric acid baths for removing scale?

I’d like to know more about that...

 

[Janger]

I had a o at making my own 2 x 72 belt grinder. Works very well and fit well into my budget! I just couldn't justify the cost of the commercial units out there. I like the variety and cost of belts available.
I'm still making various tooling and accessories to go along with it

Nice build Brian H. ! Questions...

• Are those skate board wheels?
• Did you crown any of the wheels?
• How do you adjust tracking? Did you have trouble with that?
• Is that a 1750 rpm motor? Is the speed ok?
• What kind of plate do you have behind the sand to press against? It's hard to see. Steel?
• Would you mind posting a few more pictures ?

I really like this sander after going to look a bunch of them at KMS tools:

There is this King Industrial at KMS 3" x 79" belt 2HP 220V 10Amp. $950 A metal working product not wood repurposed. Looks good. not a very wide belt.​

https://www.kmstools.com/king-industrial-3-x-79-metal-belt-sander-141967​

​

Making something could be a good project... hmmm. What are the unexpected difficulties to anticipate?

 

[PeterT]

I don't quite get the KMS.
- (red arrow) has a round wheel by the work plate making an odd profile... as opposed to most sanders like BtianH's where the belts runs in front of a backing plate & thus makes a natural 90-deg to whatever thickness of work is presented to it. What am I missing here?
- (green arrow) does this open up or somehow swivel around to expose the straight section of belt? I don't see any provisions to mount a platten.

 

[CalgaryPT]

I don't quite get the KMS.
- (red arrow) has a round wheel by the work plate making an odd profile... as opposed to most sanders like BtianH's where the belts runs in front of a backing plate & thus makes a natural 90-deg to whatever thickness of work is presented to it. What am I missing here?
- (green arrow) does this open up or somehow swivel around to expose the straight section of belt? I don't see any provisions to mount a platten.

My Ellis is the same. The small radius at front is almost insignificant for up to 1/8" stock. The green arrow door does open, and you use it to get 90 degrees as needed or for wider stock. The material rest should fold away (or be removable), giving you access to the bottom radius on the belt—super handy for fabricators that want to develop or smooth a curve on stock such as tubing. It's used a lot by custom motorcycle and car makers, as well as artists/metal sculptors like Kevin Caron.

 

[PeterT]

aha, thanks for the under the hood shots Peter

 

[Brian H]

Nice build Brian H. ! Questions...

• Are those skate board wheels?
• Did you crown any of the wheels?
• How do you adjust tracking? Did you have trouble with that?
• Is that a 1750 rpm motor? Is the speed ok?
• What kind of plate do you have behind the sand to press against? It's hard to see. Steel?
• Would you mind posting a few more pictures ?

I really like this sander after going to look a bunch of them at KMS tools:

There is this King Industrial at KMS 3" x 79" belt 2HP 220V 10Amp. $950 A metal working product not wood repurposed. Looks good. not a very wide belt.​

https://www.kmstools.com/king-industrial-3-x-79-metal-belt-sander-141967​

​

Making something could be a good project... hmmm. What are the unexpected difficulties to anticipate?

Yes, they are skateboard wheels (amazon purchase)
I crowned the tensioner wheel. I used a hydraulic piston for tensioing the pulley making belt changes quick and easy
Yes it is a 1750 rpm motor with a 6" drive pulley.It is made from a piece of 7" 4140 shaft so there is a bit of weight so it acts like a flywheel.
I have a piece of 1/2" plate for a platten that has been ground flat and smooth.
I will take some close up pictures and download them for you.
I looked at several designs and integrated what I liked from all the different models I looked at

 

[Brian H]

Nice build Brian H. ! Questions...

• Are those skate board wheels?
• Did you crown any of the wheels?
• How do you adjust tracking? Did you have trouble with that?
• Is that a 1750 rpm motor? Is the speed ok?
• What kind of plate do you have behind the sand to press against? It's hard to see. Steel?
• Would you mind posting a few more pictures ?

I really like this sander after going to look a bunch of them at KMS tools:

There is this King Industrial at KMS 3" x 79" belt 2HP 220V 10Amp. $950 A metal working product not wood repurposed. Looks good. not a very wide belt.​

https://www.kmstools.com/king-industrial-3-x-79-metal-belt-sander-141967​

​

Making something could be a good project... hmmm. What are the unexpected difficulties to anticipate?

Janger,
I did my best to get pictures to answer your questions. Let me know if you want a pic of anything specific

 

[Chicken lights]

Janger,
I did my best to get pictures to answer your questions. Let me know if you want a pic of anything specific

Very nice work!

 

[Janger]

Very Cool project Brian. Inspiring.

 

[John Conroy]

Nice job Brian! My belt sander speed is too slow to remove serious amount of metal as it is designed for wood so I may decide to build one like yous some day. How thick is the frame plate everything is fastened to?

I'm thinking of getting rid of the disc sander part and playing with pulley ratios to get more speed. I dont know how many feet per minute would be safe so some trial and error may be required, or possibly a variable speed motor so it could be used for wood and metal.