The research agrees with the journey I took on this a few years back.... The trick is therein to find a straight GL4. I didn't have any luck at CDN Tire and the other retail haunts.
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Probably pushing the limits
- Thread starter DPittman
- Start date
I rarely have any luck at CDN tire or the rest of the consumer drive retailers (you know, the lowly consumer, doesn't own a lathe, sits and watches sports and the Kardashians? 
). but nowardays its easy to break free from big retail, temples to the common sku. Seems like there are many G4 options on amazon
). but nowardays its easy to break free from big retail, temples to the common sku. Seems like there are many G4 options on amazon
DPittman
Ultra Member
Here is one product that claims to be safe on brass gears. The company website lists several Calagary retailers.
www.redlineoil.com
MTL® 75W80 GL-4 Gear Oil
Popular for BMW (before 1993), Honda and Acura, Ford Focus, late-model Mini Cooper, Dodge & Jeep NV 1500, 3500, and 5600
So, my colleague got back to me.
As usual in such matters, the answer is "It depends". LOL! That was always one of my own favorite answers!
Anyway, he says that you can't really go by the ratings that individual oil suppliers provide because they are not independently certified and are usually biased. Actual performance varies from manufacturer to manufacturer. The best assurance one can reasonably accept is lubes sold by very large companies (with their own labs) certified for use in their relevant products.
The defining test procedure is established by the ASTM in D-130. But it costs money to buy the document and test samples. However, he says that it's easy to do yourself.
Decent copper is readily available in plain old water pipes and old pennies. Thin sheets can be made in an ordinary shop press. All you need is the oil, a polished copper plate with an freshly exposed surface (very fine polishing followed by degreasing to remove wax, oils, or grease) and an oven & thermometer. If you know you particular operating temperature you can also use that but be careful to compensate for your actual ambient temp VS your real maximum. The chart below (copied from the article below) can be used to compare results.
Anything with 2a or higher is bad. 1a or b are good.
He also suggested these web articles written by a fellow he knows who wrote them for an independent group whose work is focussed on lubrication.
www.machinerylubrication.com
www.machinerylubrication.com
My takeaway? For gear sets containing brass or bronze, buy a good GL1 or GL3 gear oil. GL4 is probably ok but only at low temp. Stay away from GL5. Be careful of low cost oils at places like Canadian Tire. Car and truck dealers are probably a better place to buy gear oil. Every 10°C increase in temp doubles the corrosion rate so keep your gear boxes cool and don't let them overheat.
Thanks to everyone for the opportunity to learn something. Anyone disagreeing is welcome to do so. But we will probably have to agree to disagree cuz I totally trust my colleague.
As usual in such matters, the answer is "It depends". LOL! That was always one of my own favorite answers!
Anyway, he says that you can't really go by the ratings that individual oil suppliers provide because they are not independently certified and are usually biased. Actual performance varies from manufacturer to manufacturer. The best assurance one can reasonably accept is lubes sold by very large companies (with their own labs) certified for use in their relevant products.
The defining test procedure is established by the ASTM in D-130. But it costs money to buy the document and test samples. However, he says that it's easy to do yourself.
Decent copper is readily available in plain old water pipes and old pennies. Thin sheets can be made in an ordinary shop press. All you need is the oil, a polished copper plate with an freshly exposed surface (very fine polishing followed by degreasing to remove wax, oils, or grease) and an oven & thermometer. If you know you particular operating temperature you can also use that but be careful to compensate for your actual ambient temp VS your real maximum. The chart below (copied from the article below) can be used to compare results.
Anything with 2a or higher is bad. 1a or b are good.
He also suggested these web articles written by a fellow he knows who wrote them for an independent group whose work is focussed on lubrication.
Monitoring Active Sulfur in EP Gear Oils
Extreme pressure (EP) gear oils are used to minimize wear and scuffing in automotive and industrial applications under high load conditions, especially where high peak or shock loads are...
www.machinerylubrication.com
The Effects of EP Additives on Gearboxes
Oil additives offer a wide range of benefits, but in some circumstances they can actually be harmful to the machines in which they are added. For example, let’s look at worm gearboxes. These...
www.machinerylubrication.com
My takeaway? For gear sets containing brass or bronze, buy a good GL1 or GL3 gear oil. GL4 is probably ok but only at low temp. Stay away from GL5. Be careful of low cost oils at places like Canadian Tire. Car and truck dealers are probably a better place to buy gear oil. Every 10°C increase in temp doubles the corrosion rate so keep your gear boxes cool and don't let them overheat.
Thanks to everyone for the opportunity to learn something. Anyone disagreeing is welcome to do so. But we will probably have to agree to disagree cuz I totally trust my colleague.
Here is one product that claims to be safe on brass gears. The company website lists several Calagary retailers.
MTL® 75W80 GL-4 Gear Oil
Popular for BMW (before 1993), Honda and Acura, Ford Focus, late-model Mini Cooper, Dodge & Jeep NV 1500, 3500, and 5600
Just picked up a quart of this stuff at the Parts Source. $26
Brent H
Ultra Member
Further to @Susquatch 's information:
M/T FLUID & GEAR OIL WEIGHT API CLASSIFICATION
Amsoil Long Life FGR 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Amsoil Severe Gr SVG 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Amsoil M/T Fluid MTF 5W-30 1A Light Orange
Amsoil MT & Gear MTG 75W-90 GL4 1B Dark Orange
Castrol Hypoy C 80W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Castrol SYNTEC 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Citgo Citgear Std XD 75W-90 GL4 1B Dark Orange
Delo Gear Lubric ESI 80W-90 GL5 2A Claret Red
Delo Trans Fluid ESI 50W 2A Claret Red
GM Synthetic Axle 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Lucas 75/90 Synthetic 75W-90 GL5 4B Graphite Blk
Mobil 1 Synthetic 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Mopar Synthetic w/Mopar LS additive 75W-90 GL5 4A Trans Black
Pennzoil Gearplus 80W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Pennzoil Synthetic 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Red Line MT-90 75W-90 GL4 1A Light Orange
Red Line NS Gear Oil 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Red Line 75W90 GL-5 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Royal Purple Max-Gear 75W-90 GL5 4A Trans Black
Torco SGO Synthetic w/Torco Type G LS add 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Valvoline High Perf 80W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Valvoline SynPower 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
You can see from the chart that there is a big difference in the oils and how they react to copper. Also remember - the temperature plays a key factor so some oils will be perfectly fine for the average Joe and the application they are used in.
M/T FLUID & GEAR OIL WEIGHT API CLASSIFICATION
Amsoil Long Life FGR 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Amsoil Severe Gr SVG 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Amsoil M/T Fluid MTF 5W-30 1A Light Orange
Amsoil MT & Gear MTG 75W-90 GL4 1B Dark Orange
Castrol Hypoy C 80W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Castrol SYNTEC 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Citgo Citgear Std XD 75W-90 GL4 1B Dark Orange
Delo Gear Lubric ESI 80W-90 GL5 2A Claret Red
Delo Trans Fluid ESI 50W 2A Claret Red
GM Synthetic Axle 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Lucas 75/90 Synthetic 75W-90 GL5 4B Graphite Blk
Mobil 1 Synthetic 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Mopar Synthetic w/Mopar LS additive 75W-90 GL5 4A Trans Black
Pennzoil Gearplus 80W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Pennzoil Synthetic 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Red Line MT-90 75W-90 GL4 1A Light Orange
Red Line NS Gear Oil 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Red Line 75W90 GL-5 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Royal Purple Max-Gear 75W-90 GL5 4A Trans Black
Torco SGO Synthetic w/Torco Type G LS add 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Valvoline High Perf 80W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
Valvoline SynPower 75W-90 GL5 1B Dark Orange
You can see from the chart that there is a big difference in the oils and how they react to copper. Also remember - the temperature plays a key factor so some oils will be perfectly fine for the average Joe and the application they are used in.
DPittman
Ultra Member
I can't tell what the picture is of? Am I the only one?View attachment 18283
This what I syringed out of my band saw gear box today. Doesn't look too healthy to me
Why the heck don't they put drain plugs in these things
Gear box oil LOL. Should have poured it into something else before taking the pic.
View attachment 18283
This what I syringed out of my band saw gear box today. Doesn't look too healthy to me
Why the heck don't they put drain plugs in these things
I agree. I wouldn't be happy with that either. But who knows, that bandsaw might just outlive you!
If you think that's bad, you should see my Bush-Hog. It's 8ft wide and prolly 1500 pounds. It has a 75hp two chamber Gearbox on it with......... NO F&]$#%g DRAIN!!! If you leave it outside (like everyone does), condensation driven by temperature cycles results in water in the gear oil. The only way to drain it is to flip it upside down!
View attachment 18283
This what I syringed out of my band saw gear box today. Doesn't look too healthy to me
Why the heck don't they put drain plugs in these things
Hey Craig, that's ugly looking gear lube you removed, any evidence of brass/bronze filings?
I have a King Canada 4"x6" with very low mileage should really replace my gear lube as well. Are you pleased with using MotoMaster Extreme SAE 80W - 90 gear oil?
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No filings that I can see, just real sludgy and dark. Maybe some fine fine brass/bronze particles in it.
I'm using this https://www.redlineoil.com/mtl-75w80-gl-4-gear-oil not the MotoMaster stuff.
Thanks Craig, unsure who carries Red Line MTL 75W80 GL 4 Gear Oil in MJ although Peavey Mart might. Where did you get yours from?
I got it at a PartSource store. That link I provided has a suppliers list, it will tell you if there are any suppliers near you.
PartSource store closed out in MJ this past year for reason(s) unknown to me.
Perhaps Walley-Mart might carry it, need to look around some.
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Former Member
Guest
For the cut you are doing, you should use a 4/6 tooth or even coarse if you can get it. Watch for scraf build up in the teeth as it will jump the blade of the drive wheel, don't apply to much pressure for the same reason.
I regularly cut 12"x1" 6061 bar stock.
Best blades (custom made length) from Industrial Bandsaw Service in Mississauga. Great prices, high quality blades, well made.
I regularly cut 12"x1" 6061 bar stock.
Best blades (custom made length) from Industrial Bandsaw Service in Mississauga. Great prices, high quality blades, well made.