Cast iron bench vise is partially broken (nut limit stop), how to repair? (No brazing equipment)

[a smile]

Cleaning the pliers today found a broken block inside, I do not have brazing equipment, and also can not punch holes (located inside), how should I repair the use of the function?



Who can give me a better solution? I'm sure someone here has experience repairing cast iron!

 

[PaulL]

Can you mill it out from below and use a new piece of steel in through the slot? It looks like alignment, not strength.

 

[140mower]

Can't it be tig welded with silicon bronze rod? I am pretty sure that I remember you having a tig welder.....
Interesting offset design on that vise, I have not seen one like that before.

 

[a smile]

Can you mill it out from below and use a new piece of steel in through the slot? It looks like alignment, not strength.

Unfortunately, this is the force component that is broken, and I can try to clean the other piece, but that area is inside, and neither the drill nor the grinding blade can get close

 

[a smile]

Can't it be tig welded with silicon bronze rod? I am pretty sure that I remember you having a tig welder.....
Interesting offset design on that vise, I have not seen one like that before.

Are you sure cast iron can be argon-welded? How about welding and strength? Is brass electrode OK? I remember 6 years ago argon welding with copper electrode was very difficult, sparks were flying and failed ----

 

[Rauce]

Are you sure cast iron can be argon-welded? How about welding and strength? Is brass electrode OK? I remember 6 years ago argon welding with copper electrode was very difficult, sparks were flying and failed ----

Yes I’ve done it before. The rod is designated ERCuSi-A. You will need get the part clean and pre heat the cast iron. Done correctly, only the rod will melt, the cast iron will get red hot but not form a puddle.

Another option is nickel electrodes for stick welding.

Here is a good video on cast iron vise repair with silicon bronze tig rod:

 

[Proxule]

In my humble opinion, forget the TIG< Unless you are previously proficient in TIG, Then by all means Silicone bronze it, or Aluminum bronze it.

**** Otherwise stick to your old fashioned preheat , nickel electrode ( 55% / 99% nickel ) , post heat, put into service.
Or beg barrow buy a oxy propane setup and braze it with your low fuming bronze ( pre fluxed rods . or not )

Or fusion weld that sucker for a color matching and strength matching repair. ( oxy acetylene setup / plus cast iron rod and flux )

Gluck

 

[historicalarms]

Personally it doesn't look like a repair will improve the function much, appears to be enough height of existing flange to do what it is supposed to do, guide the slider.

 

[Mcgyver]

Done correctly, only the rod will melt, the cast iron will get red hot but not form a puddle.

Sounds like the chemistry/result is a lot like brazing? I mean the parent material is not fused but bonded to bronze. At home I've fixed small CI breaks with braze and its worked well. But easy to have that sort of intuitive prejudice that it just can't be as good as melting the parent materials together.

That bias is unwarranted. A story that sealed the deal for me. Some meathead put far too thick and wide a plate through our roller and busted the main headstock casting. Despite have lots of great welders, our guys having limited to no CI experience, and it was a production machine, so I hired a specialist firm to fix it. These guys are hundreds per hour and travel all over doing cast iron repairs; its all the do.

They convinced me brazing was the way to go. They would not weld it, said too many potential problems and that brazing was just as strong. If you get a good joint that should be true given the tensile strength of the braze.

Anyway, everything I've read says brazing is as good, person experience says its as good and a firm that does nothing but CI repairs says its just as good. A couple years later the rolls are still rolling.

 

[Ironman]

They convinced me brazing was the way to go. They would not weld it, said too many potential problems and that brazing was just as strong. If you get a good joint that should be true given the tensile strength of the braze.

Anyway, everything I've read says brazing is as good, person experience says its as good and a firm that does nothing but CI repairs says its just as good. A couple years later the rolls are still rolling.

If you don't have the equipment, and don't want to buy it to do this repair, take it to a shop and hire them to do it.

 

[Rauce]

Sounds like the chemistry/result is a lot like brazing? I mean the parent material is not fused but bonded to bronze. At home I've fixed small CI breaks with braze and its worked well. But easy to have that sort of intuitive prejudice that it just can't be as good as melting the parent materials together.

That bias is unwarranted. A story that sealed the deal for me. Some meathead put far too thick and wide a plate through our roller and busted the main headstock casting. Despite have lots of great welders, our guys having limited to no CI experience, and it was a production machine, so I hired a specialist firm to fix it. These guys are hundreds per hour and travel all over doing cast iron repairs; its all the do.

They convinced me brazing was the way to go. They would not weld it, said too many potential problems and that brazing was just as strong. If you get a good joint that should be true given the tensile strength of the braze.

Anyway, everything I've read says brazing is as good, person experience says its as good and a firm that does nothing but CI repairs says its just as good. A couple years later the rolls are still rolling.

Yeah it’s brazing but just with a tig torch.

I did a similar repair a few years ago for a friend. He runs a woodworking business with his extended family and someone crashed the big planer and cracked a casting on the side that supports various shafts. He brought it to me and said that parts were unobtainable and that replacing the whole machine would be very expensive.

I tig brazed it, bored out the bushing holes that were cracked through and pressed/brazed in some bushings.

There’s another cast iron repair method I’ve seen before that apparently works quite well. It uses inserts across the crack that are pressed in, peened and ground flush.

 

[historicalarms]

That big ol' Henley lathe that is part of another discussion on here is very top heavy and when the previous owner acquired it, the CI mast that holds the entire top drive ( i estimate close to 1000 lbs) up over the lathe had been broke in a topple over. He acquired the lathe prob close to 20 yrs ago and nickle welded that casting and it has supported the drive ever since.

 

[Mcgyver]

There’s another cast iron repair method I’ve seen before that apparently works quite well. It uses inserts across the crack that are pressed in, peened and ground flush.

That's also what the company I mentioned does. They explained its a great method, quicker/cheaper, but they do brazing for the greatest strength. If it was less critical they said they do the stitching thing, but what was essentially the frame taking all the stress between the rollers needed brazing.

 

[Proxule]

Sounds like the chemistry/result is a lot like brazing? I mean the parent material is not fused but bonded to bronze.

Right, It is very porous, so the bronze mixture ( copper zinc and tin ) bonds well to the CI. The reason I said to skip the TIG method is the fact that old CI that has been in service a wile will tend to be oil soaked and or dirty and will need to be heated and or cleaned well. Several times infact, If the oil keeps seeping out.

Imagine that with a clean tungsten. I also always find I end up melting the parent material just a touch and dipping my tungsten in too far or fumbling the torch around etc etc. I mean I have had many a successful repairs with TIG brazing, But I reserve that only for buildup of CI that's clean - and will see lots of abuse, Thus I will opt for Aluminum bronze.

One thing I have yet to do is brazing with MIG. Sounds like the cats ass, Just preheat and pull the gun trigger until you are done!

End result is the same no matter what you do for us hobbyist, The journey is the only thing that changes, all in good spirits I hope!

 

[Tom Kitta]

I fixed few vises by welding - I use high nickel rod that is marked for welding cast iron. I have a lot of it from auctions. You can pre-heat the whole thing so it welds better. Once you do initial weld with expensive electrode you can weld on top of it with cheap stuff.

Given how thin things are not sure how strong it will all be. You can pre drill it from the bottom of the vise and have pins go through the cast and also connect to the little piece that is broken off by pre drilling it as well.

Lots of work so I would do it only if its a nice vise.

 

[Tincup]

Can you manage silver solder? Get the joint very clean and use Flux. You don't grind the joint, the tighter the gap (no gap) the higher strength you will get. You will also be able to make the repair as close to original as possible. I believe the silver will give higher strength also. I also believe you could heat the joint sufficiently with a propane touch.

 

[fixerup]

Offset bench vise are handy to have in the shop and they are not cheap. Well worth to have it repaired. I hope you find a good solution or someone with experience welding to fix your vise.

The other day I dropped my small drill press vise and it broke in half. I had some ERCuSi mig wire (Blue Demon brand) and some argon gas so I decided to give it a try. It was my first time using this wire and I was looking forward to give it a try. I did a good bevel around the cracked edge. The wire is only .024" dia and I was trying to weld some 1/4" cross section, so the setting on my mig welder were all max out. It didn't flow so well on the first pass, but on the second pass it seemed to have enough heat to flow nicely across the two sections. I then proceeded to grind all the excess weld, it looked ok, no large pores and a decent fillet, but a lot of black soot around the weld. Oil burn off??? I clamped a pipe in the vise and it seemed ok, until I squeezed it a tad more. LOL it broke in half. With a cold chisel I was able to chip the weld off the cast iron clean, like mentioned its more like a glue, no fusion between the metals. If I ever get the urge to try to fix it again I would do has suggested, a good oil burn off with a torch, sand blast the crack and a pre heat before welding. And I would not use my mig with that small wire to weld a 1/4" cross section, I would instead try to braze it together. I do have a small bench vise which was torched brazed 20 years ago and it's still holding together. Maybe because it was done by a professional.

 

[a smile]

Offset bench vise are handy to have in the shop and they are not cheap. Well worth to have it repaired. I hope you find a good solution or someone with experience welding to fix your vise.

The other day I dropped my small drill press vise and it broke in half. I had some ERCuSi mig wire (Blue Demon brand) and some argon gas so I decided to give it a try. It was my first time using this wire and I was looking forward to give it a try. I did a good bevel around the cracked edge. The wire is only .024" dia and I was trying to weld some 1/4" cross section, so the setting on my mig welder were all max out. It didn't flow so well on the first pass, but on the second pass it seemed to have enough heat to flow nicely across the two sections. I then proceeded to grind all the excess weld, it looked ok, no large pores and a decent fillet, but a lot of black soot around the weld. Oil burn off??? I clamped a pipe in the vise and it seemed ok, until I squeezed it a tad more. LOL it broke in half. With a cold chisel I was able to chip the weld off the cast iron clean, like mentioned its more like a glue, no fusion between the metals. If I ever get the urge to try to fix it again I would do has suggested, a good oil burn off with a torch, sand blast the crack and a pre heat before welding. And I would not use my mig with that small wire to weld a 1/4" cross section, I would instead try to braze it together. I do have a small bench vise which was torched brazed 20 years ago and it's still holding together. Maybe because it was done by a professional.

I forgot to tell you the progress of the vice repair, I carefully checked the broken part, it is supportive, but if you do not use a very large clamping force can ignore it, and I never have too much expectations of cast iron force, so I decided to do no repair, continue with the status quo.

Moreover, you may not have noticed that this vice has few use marks, and I rarely use it. Because I have made some tool steel side fixation pliers by myself (the issue of intellectual property is not convenient to disclose), I have used it by myself and gradually found out its defects. I am gradually improving it, and I will have a patent and plan to commercialize it in the future. So the cast iron vise breaking felt strange to me because I hardly ever used it.