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Car Rust

YotaBota said:
I wouldn't bother, they have drastically changed the formula and it didn't work worth a sh_t on my Tacoma. I cleaned the frame but as the instructions say "leave a little rust". Two days later the rust was breaking thru, I haven't gone under the truck lately but I'll guess the rust is still coming thru. This was two years ago.
YMMV

YotaBota

Post in thread 'Rust Converters, Fact or Fiction'

Time for an update. The truck is on the road but I can't say I'm pleased with the frame.
I bought LocTite Extend because my research showed it was the best compromise of all the products out available. I followed the instructions to the letter, brushed on two coats and within two days the rust was bleeding thru. Talked to the local LocTite rep and he sent me another bottle to try, it was better but rust still bled thru within a week. I ended up putting on five coats of the stuff in a couple of places and the rust is still bleeding thru. So I used the rest of the bottle and covered the...
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Well that's disappointing. It was back in Edmonton in 2003 that I last used it so it was a while ago.
 
We had a service truck that carried diesel fuel, engine/hydraulic oil and grease to service our forestry machines in the bush. It was an 85 chevy 4x4 that was beaten pretty badly. From the cab forward was rotten, from the cab back it was like new. It was the funniest thing to see. I guess 20 years of oil and fuel spillage, probably from the used oil pails/filters was enough to keep the rust away.

On my own vehicles I use fluid film, or a wax/oil mix. Both work well, even on existing rust. You just have to keep up with it.
 
Darren said:
We had a service truck that carried diesel fuel, engine/hydraulic oil and grease to service our forestry machines in the bush. It was an 85 chevy 4x4 that was beaten pretty badly. From the cab forward was rotten, from the cab back it was like new. It was the funniest thing to see. I guess 20 years of oil and fuel spillage, probably from the used oil pails/filters was enough to keep the rust away.

On my own vehicles I use fluid film, or a wax/oil mix. Both work well, even on existing rust. You just have to keep up with it.
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My dad's truck, a 1968 Ford F100 spent so much time on gravel roads that been freshly oiled that it had about 3/8" of tar on the undercarriage. When it died with 480,000 miles, it had zero rust.
 
Be careful of doing rust repairs and then just putting primer on, not all primers seal the surface they are on. Some will/do let moisture though to the metal. The paint put on top of them does the sealing. As stated above, many of the rust areas have really started on the back side of the metal. I think all? automotive body have recesses and grooves/seams to catch and hold moisture and road crud/salt, generally in hard to get at places.
I have also noticed? a lot of steel now seems to rust faster/sooner/easier then used to, is there a difference in the steels or is it the air having more stuff/contaminates in it. Thinner car body metal does not help.
Not trying to start something, maybe just didn’t pay attention to it before.
A friend used to spray his cars under side with gear oil and in side panels he could get at, gave them “a special smell”.
 
Typical rust in the pinch spot welds around the wheel openings where these panels are 'beat on' by, well everything from the tires. The next worse place is the bottom of the Rocker panels at the pinch/drip rail where its less noticeable but a significant safety point as it covers the structural integrity of the vehicle. The only way to properly fix this is to completely cut out and weld in a patch panel from a rust free car (I would not recommend patching the rocker panel as that would need a complete replacement panel to be legal iirc).

However,

You can slow it down with rust spray (the light creeping oil such as the red can of 'Rust Check') but as there is already rust it will not stop it. Personally I have my vehicle professionally rust proofed as soon as I buy em for the inside panels (yes they must drill holes in the vehicle) and use the 'Rust Check' for outside area's like mating surfaces, window moldings, door handle moldings, connection seams like bumper covers to body panels...etc

The only recommend in your case is to knock off as much of the rust including under any bubbled paint as you possibly can (you will find pinholes or bigger rust holes from the inside), find some kind of epoxy primer to spray on before your actual colour match. And somehow get some of that light creeping spray oil in behind the pinch welds and respray often.

As others have said, the rust is there now and unless completely cut out it will not be stopped completely.
 
Bandit said:
I have also noticed? a lot of steel now seems to rust faster/sooner/easier then used to, is there a difference in the steels or is it the air having more stuff/contaminates in it. Thinner car body metal does not help.
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I think you are right. The fact is that cars are about the most recycled product there ever was. Scrap steel makes the steel both better and worse. The process of rolling thinner sheet metal doesnt help.

I don't think the air quality has any major affect on the results. But road salt and air humidity certainly does.

I agree with earlier comments on the heavy undercoating. I think the waxy oils are better.

Over the last two years, @Dabbler and I have collaborated on some testing of a variety of anti-corrosion products on some farm equipment. Like so many other projects, interest fades rapidly once the problems are solved. So we didn't finish or publish a report.

What I can say is that the degree of rust protection provided by various products is remarkable. After a lot of discussion, we decided to test the following products on my furrow plow blades after plowing brings the blades to highly polished bare steel.

Old engine oil
Grease
WD40 Corrosion Inhibitor
Fluid Film
Liquid Wrench Corrosion
TriFlow rust preventor
Rust Check
Krown rust protection

Keeping in mind that this was just one set of anecdotal tests using products that were all very casually applied, the summary recommendations are as follows:

Long term outdoors exposure - use Fluid Film sprayed or brushed on liberally once a year. The level of protection and low cost make the difficulty of removal worth the effort.

Long term Indoor exposure - use WD-40 Corrosion Inhibitor once a year. It is expensive but is more easily wiped off, provides superior corrosion protection, and also adds good lubrication. If cost is a factor, use Fluid Film but be prepared for some cleanup effort when you want to use the tools.

Here are the cost factors from back then. I'm sure they have changed since then:

Fluid Film is $20 in a 1/3 Litre Spray Can (what I used) @Crappy Tire. A 3.7L pail is $120. Amazon has the same price for the spray cans, but the Pail is only $82.

The WD-40 Corrosion Specialist is $32 for a 6.5oz (1/5 Litre) spray can. (About double the cost of Fluid Film per unit volume in small quantities.) as far as I know, it isn't available in pails.

I recently noticed that Fluid Film has a "Black" protective film now. Another experiment for next year.

Last but not least, here is an extensive thread well worth reading for anyone with rust problems 'Rust is the Enemy':

Susquatch

Thread 'Rust is the Enemy'

Humidity is a constant challenge living here in SW Ontario. Humidity breeds rust like an invasive species.

I saw a thread just now by @Johnwa about this VERY COOL Collet Box he made. I am SOOOOO jealous! Not just because the box is REALLY COOL, but also because I'd be terrified of putting my collects into an enclosed container of any kind in the hot humid climate I have here in SW Ontario.

https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.com/threads/collet-box.3590/unread

I've tried to handle humidity and rust in numerous ways by:

1. Keeping tools and bits well oiled. Spray oil is awesome...
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Being from California, I have little to contribute here, but I do have one thing to add. When priming raw metal or a fresh weld, I use ZRC (zinc rich coating, cold galvanize). It's not just a sealant (it may not seal at all), but it provides some galvanic protection to retard corrosion.
YMMV
 
As expensive as having a body shop replace panels, and it is, I'll put it in perspective. My diesel pickup replacement is now over 100K . In 2008 the original leasee paid 68K. He left the bill of sale in the glove box.
 
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