Car designs suck

[Susquatch]

But I wonder if it considers the possibility that besides the lack of quality there is also a mindset that goes with it?

This is sooooo very true. And it's all subjective.

In more affluent societies when something stops working depending on the replacement cost and what an individual can afford maybe we're too quick to throw away?

My wife is too quick to throw away, and apparently, I am not fast enough.

The car clinics I've looked at very much depend on the demographics. We hobby machinists don't even remotely fit. So there is that too.....

 

[Warlock]

My wife is too quick to throw away, and apparently, I am not fast enough.

I think it has a lot to do with how people are raised. Both the parents and grandparents of my wife and myself never threw away anything away from a used button to a car and everything in between. Only to be junked when it could no longer be repaired or modified. You never know when that old rusted nut and bolt or button will get you out of a bind. The attitude was always give it a try fixing it yourself first and if you screw it up then hire someone to fix it. What do you have to lose. In the neighbourhoods we grew up in everyone was a jack of all trades some better at certain things and if you needed a hand someone would help because the next time it maybe them who would need help at fixing something.

 

[Downwindtracker2]

At work, which was about eleven years ago, were discussing the state of SUVs at lunch, we agreed the only true one left, was the 4 door Jeep Wrangler. I have helped replace flat factory tires on a Suzuki and a Nissan. My brothers Porsche SUV had a flat the first time he drove it on gravel. Both the owners of the Nissan and Suzuki bought tough tires after that.

 

[slow-poke]

I have only had one experience 4 wheelin with a truck. My buddy had what I would call a monster truck hopped up big block in a F150? with huge tires. We were going along a ditch and we came to this swamp. He shook his head a bit and said I don't know. Backed up a way to get a running start and when we hit that swamp it felt like the truck dropped about 5 feet, the water was a ways up the door and he just kept the accelerator to the floor. Couldn't see s**t, for all the wet mud flying and the regular 3 point seatbelt was useless I was being thrown around like a rag doll but the truck kept moving and we came out the other side. Good thing to because if we got stuck I'm not sure how we would have got out of there ( bigger monster truck and winch I guess). Interesting experience. My buddy was half crazy too many stories to tell about that guy, but he's still alive so maybe not that crazy. He could do a one handed chin-up not many people can do that.

 

[Downwindtracker2]

The days of fine logging roads going all over the place are over. Once the timber is out, the roads are not needed. The province then calls for deactivation , sometimes so effective even a tank wouldn't get through. Here n BC it was on those logging roads where the 4x4s shone.

 

[mmcmdl]

We call them Limited Maintenance roads in the Adirondacks . Limited I think means drive at you own risk . As far as new concept cars ........The Camaro and Vega SS look pretty damn cool . Have to wonder if they'll become reality though .

 

[slow-poke]

. As far as new concept cars ........The Camaro and Vega SS look pretty damn cool . Have to wonder if they'll become reality though .

I have to say I like the retro look but I wouldn't be surprised if the new one weighs an extra 1000lbs so performance might be snappy with the V6 it's not going to be fast.

Now if you can shoehorn a V8 in there, might be able to make a go of it;-)

 

[Elektrishun]

Speaking of electric cars...

Watched the CTV National news (check in once a week to see what I am missing) and supposedly electric car sales are "down".

Some guy is interviewed and says we can't give up on electric vehicles because Canada has the minerals needed for making batteries etc. (SRC has a mid-stream processing facility in Saskatoon for this purpose) and this will help us not depend on China.

But I don't believe we have a facility to take the processed minerals to the final steps of making a battery.

Rhetorical question - in the long term is the mining and processing of these minerals going to do more for the economy or the environment?

 

[DPittman]

Speaking of electric cars...

Watched the CTV National news (check in once a week to see what I am missing) and supposedly electric car sales are "down".

Some guy is interviewed and says we can't give up on electric vehicles because Canada has the minerals needed for making batteries etc. (SRC has a mid-stream processing facility in Saskatoon for this purpose) and this will help us not depend on China.

But I don't believe we have a facility to take the processed minerals to the final steps of making a battery.

Rhetorical question - in the long term is the mining and processing of these minerals going to do more for the economy or the environment?

Good question but likely one that will lead to policy and political discussion.

 

[Tom O]

Come on you know it’s Economy over environment although you’ll get taxed on both.

 

[Elektrishun]

Come on you know it’s Economy over environment although you’ll get taxed on both.

Are you coming from the point of view that if we could see up close and personal all the steps to get to the end goal, producing a battery for an EV, it would become obvious that we haven't improved our environmental impact?

That's what I am wondering. The end product, a battery for an electric car that reduces emissions but how much harm is going to be done before you get there?

In the meantime, the people who are running/investing in the technology keep promoting that we need EVs.

As always, those of us on the outside looking in won't know until years down the road.

 

[Susquatch]

Rhetorical question - in the long term is the mining and processing of these minerals going to do more for the economy or the environment?

I will try to be as non-political and as non-policy as possible and just state some facts that you can accept or turf at your pleasure.

The technically accepted way to assess that question is to do what is called a "Life Cycle Analysis". From cradle to grave. You take into account the inputs and outputs of the mining, refining, transportation, manufacturing, distribution, usage, fuel production, fuel distribution, network needs, recycling, and final disposal etc etc of everything involved. To be fair, some of these zero out when comparing two different products, but most don't.

In so doing, the mud becomes a little clearer. But problems arise when the proponents don't like the answers or take the position that a mature product won't be like that. That's when the politics and the marketing take over.

One thing is for sure. There is no such thing as zero for anything.

 

[Bandit]

So basically, a car/truck that already exists has done its “polluting” other then operation polluting, fuel, lubricants used, tires, and maintenance/repair parts, etc. Oh, did anyone think about lubing motors, and bearings, so wheels will turn, them big fans turning, making electricity, each need some lube too, maybe don’t do away with oil and refineries.
Making a new machine adds to the existing pollution, recycling a machine makes more pollution, to make another machine from the recycled material adds more energy to get there, more pollution.
Do not get me wrong, not saying we should all be driving a model “T” and keeping it running. Just never have managed to figure this all out.
But I know that if no one brought anything new, many companies would be gone, in general, there has been a realization that if you make something that never breaks/needs repair, the economy, that we know fails. To say nothing of the taxes paid, and laws/rules are often made to make sure new “stuff” is produced and BOUGHT. This is before the “Jones got one “ factor is used on/against you! And stuff being made “not repairable”, another boondoggle.
Some of my thoughts, border line I know, please mod/delete as nessessy.

 

[historicalarms]

I swear if you put an IH scout next to a new Bronco, you'd think they were kissing cousins

Just an opinion---we owned one of those old Scouts here on the farm for years, served us well as a hunting buggy and a small chore vehicle in the winter...and after going for a ride in my daughters brand new Bronco last week I wouldnt buy one of those for 1/2 the money---road noise to the extreme in that thing, couldnt carry on a conversation without shouting!!!

 

[Elektrishun]

One thing is for sure. There is no such thing as zero for anything.

Right and but how far from zero is it to produce a battery?

This is what most of us don't know because the finished product is made in a country where supposedly the environmental impact is not as much of a concern as it would be here.

If North America could produce its own battery, start to finish, then we might someday have a better idea just how far from zero it is to get an EV made.

Not taking sides, just posing a question that is currently impossible to answer.

 

[Downwindtracker2]

Now isn't that very Canadian. We have looked at the problem from all sides and without preconceived ideology getting in the way, just looked at the practical aspects of the problem.

 

[jorogi]

Redefining "cyber" space.
Real trucks don't get stuck on grass.

 

[Warlock]

Real trucks don't get stuck on grass.

Hopefully they didn't damage the battery bank. If a Killed In Action (KIA) go-cart battery bank costs $50K to replace I wonder what the cost would be for this one.

 

[Tom O]

From FB

 

[DPittman]

and after going for a ride in my daughters brand new Bronco last week I wouldnt buy one of those for 1/2 the money---road noise to the extreme in that thing, couldnt carry on a conversation without shouting!!!

Well that is surprising (well to me at least) it seems to me most "off road" vehicles now really put an emphasis on luxury and car like interiors. I wouldn't pay half the money either for a new Bronco, but I'd pay that same sum for a brand new IH Scout if I could.