Buffalo/Canadian drill press

[combustable herbage]

I picked up this drill press for a little winter project, its the same as this buffalo Junior but the casting shows Canadian Blower and forge co. and the front label shows The Canadian Fairbanks Morse Co Ltd so I guess it was the same as the buffalo but made here in Canada. Everything moves, the motor is very quiet and smooth, they were had a strap from a tie down as a belt so needles to say that doesn't work well, luckily I have some belting I believe will work, the quill moves nicely as does the table and swivel My hope is to clean it up referb it a bit and use it for doing the odd holes maybe find a corner for it.





These look like just oil soaked felt wadded up inside very cool snap lids very cool old emerson moter.




Edit I am adding the picture from the vintage page but correct orientation I hate looking at it sideways.

 

[whydontu]

Why does new iron lack the style of old iron? It can’t cost much more to cast this shapely lump of cast iron as compared to the boring no-frills style of any current equivalent to this example of cool.

 

[trlvn]

That old Emerson repulsion-induction motor is super cool. I've never seen a lubrication system like that.

Are the pulleys oriented properly for 2-speed operation? I'm guessing the idlers will 'automatically' go to the right place depending on where the belt is running?

Craig

 

[Tom O]

It’s probably spring loaded

 

[140mower]

Why does new iron lack the style of old iron? It can’t cost much more to cast this shapely lump of cast iron as compared to the boring no-frills style of any current equivalent to this example of cool.

Agreed..... My old wore down machines of days gone by may be slow as molasses this time of the year, but it only gives me more time to enjoy an era when a little elegance and style were incorporated into everything, even machine tools.

 

[Former Member]

Why does new iron lack the style of old iron? It can’t cost much more to cast this shapely lump of cast iron as compared to the boring no-frills style of any current equivalent to this example of cool.

Form Function Cost and Style!

In years gone by form and style sold, provided it functioned (though sometime functioning suffered a little because they didn't fully understand what it did stress wise. Also why old machines are heavier.

Now most times it comes down to function and cost, style is nice paint job and stickers, form is what the market wants that they can provide for the least cost possible.

 

[combustable herbage]

That old Emerson repulsion-induction motor is super cool. I've never seen a lubrication system like that.

Are the pulleys oriented properly for 2-speed operation? I'm guessing the idlers will 'automatically' go to the right place depending on where the belt is running?

Craig

Its a very interesting motor for sure, for the speeds the idler has two indents with a pin and a spring, you loosen the bolt and it can go in 2 positions it looks like I won't know for sure till I make up a belt for it. When I saw it I couldn't resist having a look at it and when everything moved it was coming home with me.
But alas the gods have figured out I have a bit of time on my hands and this morning woke up to a cold house, our well pump packed it in this morning and we are on geothermal so water is needed luckily there is an electric back up for heat but no water.

 

[Dan Dubeau]

Why does new iron lack the style of old iron? It can’t cost much more to cast this shapely lump of cast iron as compared to the boring no-frills style of any current equivalent to this example of cool.

Computers. Everything starts as a cad model these days. Straight lines, rigid snaps, and fillets. Hands and eyes naturally make things that are appealing to hands and eyes. Drafting boards and french curves produced drawing that are aesthetically pleasing to the eye, leading way to Patternmakers shaping patterns with their hands making pattern pleasing to the touch. A person making a pattern for a tool casting will put their hands all over it during production. If a corner is too sharp, it'll get rounded more. If lines don't look right from the operators perspective somebody will make that change. Humans aren't involved at that level in machine production anymore. That's far to costly. You can see that design progression in the evolution of the automobile through the 80's and 90's. It wasn't all CAD and computers that ruined it, but their involvement certainly didn't help the cause for curves. They say design evolved away from the curves and swoopiness because the market wanted it, but I think it was more of a case of the people being fed what was cheaper and easier to produce and being told that's what they wanted like always.

It IS coming back, kinda. 3d modeling software has evolved greatly over the years, and you're starting to see a great deal of organic shapes being produced again in consumer products and appliances. You'll never see it again in machine tools though . Too many guards and enclosures now protecting people from themselves.

I'm very fortunate to have worked with a bunch of really good older Patternmakers when I started my career. First couple shops I work in still did a fair bit of pattern work, but the game had changed by then, from the hand carved and shaped patterns off of mylars, to cnc cut renshape and resin pours. I loved all the old stories though.

That's my take on it anyway. I love the old curvy tools. I hate straight, sharp and boxy stuff.

 

[whydontu]

Computers. Everything starts as a cad model these days. Straight lines, rigid snaps, and fillets. Hands and eyes naturally make things that are appealing to hands and eyes. Drafting boards and french curves produced drawing that are aesthetically pleasing to the eye, leading way to Patternmakers shaping patterns with their hands making pattern pleasing to the touch. A person making a pattern for a tool casting will put their hands all over it during production. If a corner is too sharp, it'll get rounded more. If lines don't look right from the operators perspective somebody will make that change. Humans aren't involved at that level in machine production anymore. That's far to costly. You can see that design progression in the evolution of the automobile through the 80's and 90's. It wasn't all CAD and computers that ruined it, but their involvement certainly didn't help the cause for curves. They say design evolved away from the curves and swoopiness because the market wanted it, but I think it was more of a case of the people being fed what was cheaper and easier to produce and being told that's what they wanted like always.

It IS coming back, kinda. 3d modeling software has evolved greatly over the years, and you're starting to see a great deal of organic shapes being produced again in consumer products and appliances. You'll never see it again in machine tools though . Too many guards and enclosures now protecting people from themselves.

I'm very fortunate to have worked with a bunch of really good older Patternmakers when I started my career. First couple shops I work in still did a fair bit of pattern work, but the game had changed by then, from the hand carved and shaped patterns off of mylars, to cnc cut renshape and resin pours. I loved all the old stories though.

That's my take on it anyway. I love the old curvy tools. I hate straight, sharp and boxy stuff.

I think you’re dead on. Yesterday I was making a cam lever to pull up a suction cup mount for a hand-operated Wear-Ever food processor. I just couldn’t get my CAD program to produce the correct curve on the cam. Easy enough to locate the pivot, and the flat sections for tighten and release, but I just couldn’t draw a good-looking arc to connect the two. Cut the blank flats, drilled the pivot hole. Ten minutes with a file got a nice smooth curve connecting the two. Hands and eyes.

 

[PeterT]

Computers. Everything starts as a cad model these days. Straight lines, rigid snaps, and fillets.

Not sure I agree. CAD modelers have been able to swervy-curvey since they were first conceived. AutoCad came out in what, 1982? That's 42 years already. Spline curves were present right alongside other basic drawing constructs. Later 3D modelers provide even more power related to patternmaking & casting - scaling, offsetting, shelling, non uniform mirroring, draft angle compensation, mass/material metrics... I think it stems from the guy on the end of the mouse & what the Marketing department deems what will sell.

But there are some glimmers that some portion of society may be returning value to design taste & uniqueness in conjunction with function. Usually its wealthy people who can afford customization, but not always. You can see it with some young-ins too. Even if it means a different case color or 3DP for the ubiquitous cell phone, but hey gotta start somewhere. My buddy finished his B&W developers class at local art college. I was shocked to hear they haven't long ago removed the darkroom equipment. But he was the single old man, remainder of class was all young people. Bringing in film or digital conversion onto film & rediscovering some prior era technology.

 

[Susquatch]

Computers. Everything starts as a cad model these days. Straight lines, rigid snaps, and fillets.

Perhaps it is people. Engineers in particular. Harder to do stress analysis on curved parts. Engineers like straight lines. Architects like curves.

Those older beautiful machines probably came from a craftsman's thoughts about how to make things. That got ruined by the next generation of engineers like me who didn't want to deal with the complicated math.

But there is lots of hope on the horizon. And it will likely come from computers. They have been able to draw curves for ages. But only recently have computers that are capable of solids stress analysis become affordable to companies that make machines.

Thanks to computers I hope we will soon see beautiful strong affordable machines once more.

Then again, maybe not. We still don't have affordable rapid prototyping of metal parts and not every machine shop can do cast iron castings, so maybe that easy to get flat plate and boxy machines will stick around for a few more decades after all.

 

[Dan Dubeau]

Perhaps it is people. Engineers in particular. Harder to do stress analysis on curved parts. Engineers like straight lines. Architects like curves.

Those older beautiful machines probably came from a craftsman's thoughts about how to make things. That got ruined by the next generation of engineers like me who didn't want to deal with the complicated math.

But there is lots of hope on the horizon. And it will likely come from computers. They have been able to draw curves for ages. But only recently have computers that are capable of solids stress analysis become affordable to companies that make machines.

Thanks to computers I hope we will soon see beautiful strong affordable machines once more.

Then again, maybe not. We still don't have affordable rapid prototyping of metal parts and not every machine shop can do cast iron castings, so maybe that easy to get flat plate and boxy machines will stick around for a few more decades after all.

I do. I can go from an idea, to a 3d printed pattern, to a cast aluminum part without ever leaving my house, all for under $1000 (not counting my laptop), and generally within a couple hours if I'm hustling. I'm size limited at the moment, and limited to just Al right now, but working on that.....

It's still not a perfect process, but I can produce some decent enough results for my needs in a pretty short period of time. I think in one example I started modeling around 8am, and had aluminum parts by about 2-2:30 in the aft. If I had better molding sand it would be even better. But even cheap playsand with kitty litter clay binder "works", and patterns straight off the printer produce workable results. Filling and smoothing the patterns produce way better results though, but adds significant time to the process. Just depends on ones expectations and goals of the project.

I know curves and splines have been integral parts of cad since the beginning. BUT it takes an artistic eye to make it work. Perhaps that's the part that was lost over the years.

 

[Susquatch]

I know curves and splines have been integral parts of cad since the beginning. BUT it takes an artistic eye to make it work. Perhaps that's the part that was lost over the years.

That was the intent of my comment about engineers and architects.

And I wasn't thinking aluminium. I was thinking cast iron and cast steel.

 

[Susquatch]

BUT it takes an artistic eye to make it work. Perhaps that's the part that was lost over the years.

Perhaps it is also education. I don't think many artistic minds make it into technical education programs. That's a shame if you ask me.

 

[Dan Dubeau]

It's a very multifaceted problem/situation. No one reason or answers, but an interesting discussion.

Imagine a perfect world where everyone found employment to their greatest core competencies. Where money and profitability weren't always the driving factor of decisions either.....

 

[140mower]

magine a perfect world where everyone found employment to their greatest core competencies. Where money and profitability weren't always the driving factor of decisions either.....

...... It's called, self employed. It's almost the perfect situation, except, my boss is a prick.....

 

[Susquatch]

...... It's called, self employed. It's almost the perfect situation, except, my boss is a prick.....

Now I have to go change. I just pissed myself laughing! God you are funny sometimes!

 

[whydontu]

...... It's called, self employed. It's almost the perfect situation, except, my boss is a prick.....

On the other hand, quite often the boss says “screw it, it’s not busy, take the rest of the day off to play in the shop”

 

[Tom O]

I do. I can go from an idea, to a 3d printed pattern, to a cast aluminum part without ever leaving my house, all for under $1000 (not counting my laptop), and generally within a couple hours if I'm hustling. I'm size limited at the moment, and limited to just Al right now, but working on that.....

It's still not a perfect process, but I can produce some decent enough results for my needs in a pretty short period of time. I think in one example I started modeling around 8am, and had aluminum parts by about 2-2:30 in the aft. If I had better molding sand it would be even better. But even cheap playsand with kitty litter clay binder "works", and patterns straight off the printer produce workable results. Filling and smoothing the patterns produce way better results though, but adds significant time to the process. Just depends on ones expectations and goals of the project.

I know curves and splines have been integral parts of cad since the beginning. BUT it takes an artistic eye to make it work. Perhaps that's the part that was lost over the years.

Try some grouting sand for casting it’s way finer for a better finish.

 

[Dan Dubeau]

Try some grouting sand for casting it’s way finer for a better finish.

I've seen that recommended before. I think the next batch of greensand will be from a foundry supply here in On. I want to use what the pros use, and eliminate variables. Once I get better and more experience then I'll start playing around more.