Another Oil Thread

[terry_g]

I am long overdue to replace the oils in my lathe. It still has the oil from the factory in it from 2009.
Its a Busy Bee tools CT043n lathe. I would estimate between the headstock feed transmission and
apron seven litres at the most. The local Petro-Canada has Hydrex XV semi synthetic multi
viscosity oil in 4 litre jugs. I don't want to buy a 20 litre pail of 46 hydraulic oil.
Is it safe to use a multi viscosity oil in a gear box?

 

[Dusty]

@terry_g for what it's worth I've used MotoMaster Anti Wear Hydrauliqic Oil ISO A-32 on my BB B2227L lathe for over 15 years without any complaints or issues. Recommend you price it out at Canadian Tire. That's a long time to run one's lathe on factory oil, question your lathe needing 7 seven liters per oil change?

 

[terry_g]

I just drained the headstock, feed transmission and apron. I got about 3 litres out of it.
I took the cover off the headstock and was it ever dirty. there was a layer of mud on
the bottom. I mopped it out with brake clean and rags, It took me quite a while.
I'm going to pass on the multi viscosity oil.
I'm off to Canadian Tire. They have 5 litre jugs of grade 32.

 

[Dusty]

I just drained the headstock, feed transmission and apron. I got about 3 litres out of it.
I took the cover off the headstock and was it ever dirty. there was a layer of mud on
the bottom. I mopped it out with brake clean and rags, It took me quite a while.
I'm going to pass on the multi viscosity oil.
I'm off to Canadian Tire. They have 5 litre jugs of grade 32.

@terry_g do keep us posted on how things turn out, hopefully no harm done. Good luck!

 

[That-Guy]

Do you know what viscosity the manufacture calls for? 32 seems light to me. I'd be aiming at a ISO68, which is 20w or a SUS of roughly 300. I've recently just ran into this issue with an old mill of mine and went off the deep end learning about oil. In my standard modern gear head it calls for a 30w, and at the time all I had around was 30W non detergent Valvoline engine oil. Been just fine. I would recommend against using multi viscosity oils. Its really too bad we cant seems to buy Mobil DTE reasonably here in Canada, at least around my area.

 

[Tecnico]

Do you know what viscosity the manufacture calls for? 32 seems light to me. I'd be aiming at a ISO68, which is 20w or a SUS of roughly 300. I've recently just ran into this issue with an old mill of mine and went off the deep end learning about oil. In my standard modern gear head it calls for a 30w, and at the time all I had around was 30W non detergent Valvoline engine oil. Been just fine. I would recommend against using multi viscosity oils. Its really too bad we cant seems to buy Mobil DTE reasonably here in Canada, at least around my area.

View attachment 44783

Thanks for posting that table, a lot of good information in one place.

While on the subject, I just purchased oil for the gearbox of my Standard Modern 1120 which calls for non-detergent SAE 30. The CTC source for straight non-detergent SAE 30 has dried up but I found another by Castrol/Wakefield at Home Hardware. Plenty of stock on the shelf. BTW, don't look at Amazon, the exact same product is on for three times the price, LOL!

D

 

[That-Guy]

SAE 30 has dried up

NAPA will bring it in (Valvoline), and Crescent oil in Hamilton Ontario will get you anything you want (they have their own brand, I use it in the antique tractors that call for odd ball oils). The home hardware lead is great though! We have one of them! Thanks for the info!

 

[Tecnico]

I've been disappointed too many times by NAPA not stocking what they list. I was excited to find that they carry Vactra but really, they don't it's just a listing they can't get according to the local outlet. I got mine via the local Mobil distributor.

I was really surprised to find it (Googled) at HH but one call and there it was on the shelf!

D

 

[CWret]

I changed the gear box oil in my RF45 (clone bench-top mill) after about 5 hours of bresk-in time. The manual recommended ISO68 gear oil which is similar to SAE80 gear oil.
IMO, any gear oil would be better than hydraulic oil. Oil designed for hydraulic systems, like Hydrex XV, is quite different than a gear oil.

Multi-grade oil is likely not necessary. Multi-grades are for machines where the oil temperature is expected to change (increase from cold start up to a much higher normal operating temperature).

FYI - I also replaced the original drain plug for one with a magnet. It is simple and very effective, especially since there is no oil filter.
Like this one:

Amazon.ca

www.amazon.ca

 

[terry_g]

I had a magnet from a Meritor axle on my tool box I put it in in the headstock when I changed the oil.

 

[Jswain]

I changed the gear box oil in my RF45 (clone bench-top mill) after about 5 hours of bresk-in time. The manual recommended ISO68 gear oil which is similar to SAE80 gear oil.
IMO, any gear oil would be better than hydraulic oil. Oil designed for hydraulic systems, like Hydrex XV, is quite different than a gear oil.

Multi-grade oil is likely not necessary. Multi-grades are for machines where the oil temperature is expected to change (increase from cold start up to a much higher normal operating temperature).

FYI - I also replaced the original drain plug for one with a magnet. It is simple and very effective, especially since there is no oil filter.
Like this one:

Amazon.ca

www.amazon.ca

So much controversy on this one with a Google search but I went with gear oil as well.

Seems it is a 50/50 hydraulic oil vs gear oil lol

 

[Bandit]

There a number of oil cross over references that can be found on the web, it may take more then one to find what you need that crosses to something that you can find and buy. But of course you need to know what it came with.
Hydraulic oil is a gear oil in some cases, a gear type oil pump. It is generally not an extreme pressure oil like a gear oil for final drives. Hydraulic oil generally is low/no foaming. See below!
To maybe throw a wrench/whatever into the works, there is a multi purpose oil used in farm equipment and possibly else where called "trans/hydraulic/gear oil" and or other way round wording for the same thing, maybe hard to find in the big city, non farming areas. I have seem it at, UFA, Napa, Can.Tire, Princess, Chevron, Shell, and many etc. And nearly any farm equipment dealer.
I think as nearly any farm equipment runs it and into the many 100s of h.p. into transmissions, hydraulic, and final drives it might be an answer for some.
I may stand to be corrected, however I am not "pushing" a make/brand. So please pick your poison, it may help someone.

 

[That-Guy]

FYI - I also replaced the original drain plug for one with a magnet. It is simple and very effective, especially since there is no oil filter.

This is a great idea!!!!! Going to add that to my lathe.

trans/hydraulic/gear oil

DTF, as I know it, often has extreme pressure modifiers (sulfurs) in it that will destroy a lot of the brass/bronze bushings in some machines.

There a number of oil cross over references that can be found on the web, it may take more then one to find what you need that crosses to something that you can find and buy. But of course you need to know what it came with.

This is entirely correct. There are many people who devote their entire careers to this field, and my small mind could only hope to graze the surface!

The manual recommended ISO68 gear oil which is similar to SAE80 gear oil.
IMO, any gear oil would be better than hydraulic oil.

Mobil DTE is called up on most modern (and semi modern) machines, and it is a hydraulic oil. As was said by Bandit, Hydraulic oil is a kind of gear oil. Think about the pumps and valve bodies. Automatic transmissions are just magic hydraulic systems.... or fun houses full of gremlins. Just to further muddy the waters, old Allis Chalmers tractors required sae30 ENGINE OIL (manual was very specific) in their hydraulic systems.

this is a quote from the Mobil website.
"The Mobil DTE Oil Named Series of lubricants are premium performance circulating lubricants designed for applications where long lubricant service life is required. Specific applications include:

• Land-based and marine steam turbine, hydro turbine and some gas turbine circulation systems, including pumps, valves and other ancillary equipment

• Continuous service in plain and roller bearings and parallel shaft gearing

• Turbines with oil supplied by splash, bath, ring oiling or other mechanical means

• Moderate severity hydraulic pumps

• Compressors and vacuum pumps handling air, natural gas, and inert gases, and with discharge temperatures not exceeding 150C"
(https://www.mobil.ca/en-ca/lubrican.../products/products/mobil-dte-oil-heavy-medium)

I think all I'm trying to say is that oil is far more complicated that it seems, and any oil is better than no oil. With that being said, it is a fascinating and fun area to explore. Just wait until we get on to way oil!!

 

[CWret]

Mobile DTE looks like a very versatile, one-size-fits-all, solution. Thanks.
But if it doesn’t say ‘gear oil’ somewhere on the bottle it’s not going in the gear box.