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Machinist tool/ Narex 0-24” Universal Boring & Facing Masterhead, $3000, Kitscoty, AB

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I agree it's a boring head in a cat-40 style arbour. But very hard to believe the original cost was that much.

Given the plethora of new stuff out there, he will have to eat some serious crow to sell it. I bet it ends up in the trash or in a grab box with other stuff.
 
Susquatch said:
I agree it's a boring head in a cat-40 style arbour. But very hard to believe the original cost was that much.

Given the plethora of new stuff out there, he will have to eat some serious crow to sell it. I bet it ends up in the trash or in a grab box with other stuff.
Click to expand...
It's not just a boring head. It faces. While the head is turning, if you hold the top knurled ring, the cutter moves outwards. Think of it as a power cross-feed on your lathe. I think you can also set stop limits.

This is great when you need to machine a cavity, or a boss.
 
thestelster said:
Yeah, for most it's not worthwhile. But, I'd love to have one, or the Wohlhaupter version (even more expensive!)
Click to expand...

Well, if you think it's worth that much, I'd still bookmark that offer and then watch and wait. I bet it goes for a few hundred or less a few months from now.
 
Susquatch said:
Nice update Stel. I somehow knew there had to be more to it than just boring.

The question is, is it worth 3000? I think not!
Click to expand...
Not to you, obviously. If a guy needs one, it represents a pretty steep discount from new!

I have managed to accumulate not one, but two Wohlhaupter Boring and Facing heads, at far less than the usually eye-watering prices commonly asked, by dint of carefully watching what was posted on ebay for a LOT of years. In the end, I got what I was really after, a UPA-2 model with an integral Morse 2 shank, that sold for cheaper than it could have, because it had a rather badly made adapter over the original MT2 shank, to convert it to a larger straight shank size. That it was on the original shank was only JUST visible in one of the photos.
My other Wohlhaupter head is a UPA-1 size, with a special order 3/4 inch straight shank on it (not listed as a normal option in any of the catalogs I have seen).
 
trevj said:
If a guy needs one, it represents a pretty steep discount from new!
Click to expand...

Wow, even discounted I bet it was big bucks!

But now I'm insanely curious. Tell me Trev, what kinds of jobs would make a fellow need one?
 
Susquatch said:
Wow, even discounted I bet it was big bucks!

But now I'm insanely curious. Tell me Trev, what kinds of jobs would make a fellow need one?
Click to expand...
You can bore a bearing hole and face the countersink in a single set-up. You can also backface the inner surface.

Using some jiggery-pokery with the feed rates, you can also bore a hole with a taper. You set the feed rate per revolution on the head, and with the feed rate adjusted on the mill table, you can create a repeatable taper. Boring groves for circlips, retaining rings, and O-rings is also made pretty easy.

As you may be aware, you can drill a hole, and have it come out neither at an exact size, or at an exact location. Boring gets you both! Especially important for gear meshing, where too close or too far apart leads to early failure.

If you look through the manuals for these heads, you soon see a LOT of varied operations that can be done.

EG: https://www.alliedmachine.com/Suppo...anuals/102166_ba_UPA_4_4S5_5_5S6_6_6S7_GB.pdf

and

 
trevj said:
You can bore a bearing hole and face the countersink in a single set-up. You can also backface the inner surface.

Using some jiggery-pokery with the feed rates, you can also bore a hole with a taper. You set the feed rate per revolution on the head, and with the feed rate adjusted on the mill table, you can create a repeatable taper. Boring groves for circlips, retaining rings, and O-rings is also made pretty easy.

As you may be aware, you can drill a hole, and have it come out neither at an exact size, or at an exact location. Boring gets you both! Especially important for gear meshing, where too close or too far apart leads to early failure.

If you look through the manuals for these heads, you soon see a LOT of varied operations that can be done.

EG: https://www.alliedmachine.com/Suppo...anuals/102166_ba_UPA_4_4S5_5_5S6_6_6S7_GB.pdf

and

Click to expand...

You had me flop mouthed with variable feed rate per revolution. I didn't realize it had that ability. That feature alone helps explain the high cost.

Thanks Trev
 
Susquatch said:
You had me flop mouthed with variable feed rate per revolution. I didn't realize it had that ability. That feature alone helps explain the high cost.

Thanks Trev
Click to expand...
Yeah, that stuff takes up space inside the head, so it tends to me more integrated in the larger size boring and facing heads.

When you look at the exploded diagram of a Boring and Facing head, beside that of a plain Boring Head, you start to see why the costs skyrocket, out of proportion to the weight of the tool!

And, on top of all that, as @Ian Moss states, they are simply a really nicely made, and as a tool to use, they feel and act like they are well made, and that makes using them, a right pleasure!
 
If you want to make a shop version, Graham Meek's design was featured in HSM. I think I have the issues but have not sat down to CAD it.

I lurked for a Wohlhaupter for quite a few years, but generally people know what they are worth. They fetch big bucks is in good condition & matched or convertible to typical N-Am R8 which is not common in Europe. The internals are significantly more involved than the typical leadscrew style, so if its clapped out that could be challenging. Somewhere in YouTube land is a teardown/repair. And unless you get lucky with an export mdel, the tooling shanks are metric but that's not insurmountable to us machinists. There is also a Taiwan version which is decent but still spendy.

homeshopmachinist.net

July/August 2016 issue Volume 35, Number 4 - Home Shop Machinist

[…]
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I live on an island with no industry so getting decent old iron takes time effort and travel. However it sometimes does pay off as people don't look here nor do they want to travel here. Such was the case with my acquisition of a Narex boring/facing head. An old guy ( I'm going to have to stop saying that as I realize that I'm only a few years younger than "old guys" now) was shutting down his shop at the other end of the island. He wanted $900, we agreed to meet up at the geographic halfway point and he said he would some other bits and pieces too. So as well as the Narex I got Mitutoyo 10ths dti, a Bison 3 jaw chuck
$600US insert drill bit, and boxes of good drills and taps and other commercial grade goodies all thrown in for the original $900. The other thing I got for free is the lesson of just how much nicer quality is over Chinesium.

John
 
@PeterT, I waited a Looong time to get my UPA-2. The UPA-1 was a lucky hit with a Buy it now price that I could afford to splurge upon! I would suggest looking out for a UPA-3 or equivalent Narex, as once you get up to that size, readily changeable, replacement shanks become available (if at eye watering prices!). I got my boring heads out of England, and while it was before Ebay enforced getting their own cut of the postage with their shipping program, it was quite affordable and fast.

@jorogi , yeah, in comparison to the downgraded, race to the bottom quality of a lot of the Chinese import tooling that was built down to a price, rather than up to a quality standard (which costs $$$, no matter where you are!), using even pretty tired "Good" gear is a nice treat! I usually work on the idea that if i pay near new Retail 'Import' prices for a dcent used quality item, I have got myself ahead a step!

Prolly butchering his name, but IIRC, Stephan Gotteswinter had a teardown and lube video a while back.
 
Susquatch said:
I agree it's a boring head in a cat-40 style arbour. But very hard to believe the original cost was that much.

Given the plethora of new stuff out there, he will have to eat some serious crow to sell it. I bet it ends up in the trash or in a grab box with other stuff.
Click to expand...
I paid $2700 for a used Narex about 10 years ago. I would happily do it again. If you have used the 100 dollar chinese boring bars, this is so far superior and accurate that there is no comparison. It came with an R8 arbor, and when I switched to the Lagun CAT40 spindle I had to cobble something together as the CAT arbor is between 5-6 hundred...so I'm in the market for an arbor yet.
 
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