Sourcing Replacement Parts

[TheLocalDrunk]

Hey All,
Newbie here again

So I have a typical round column mill. Just like the King PDM-30 but from Modern.

Anyhow. It started to make a loud knocking noise and it looks like the pulley stack on the motor shaft is now kaput.
I wanted to look at all my options. I might be able to bore it out and install a new sleeve.... or might be able to fabricate a new one from scratch. (Both of which would be projects I would post on here asking for advice.....LOTs of advice.)

But the one option I am having issues with is just seeing if I can source out a new stack for a reasonable $

So because it is a cookie cutter mill, are the pulley stacks all the same? Is there a good source for replacement parts for these mills?
Thanks All

Cheers

 

[Janger]

Post pictures of the damage. Did the key break or come loose?

 

[PeterT]

My first call would be to Modern if it has their tag on it & provide them the SR#. Then the fun begins. Even if the machine is no longer produced, you might get lucky & they might be able to find parts as they did for my King. No guarantees of course & who knows about price. If you have the parts 'sketch' with PN#s that would certainly help too. Depending what is kaput & what is required to remedy, next option would be to identify if there is another lookalike model under a different label, like Grizzly for example. That starts to get harder as there are variations & maybe no refund of not the right one.

my post #17 might be useful
https://canadianhobbymetalworkers.com/threads/oz25-collets.1095/#post-10566

 

[TheLocalDrunk]

The Key looks fine. It is just no longer a tight fit between the stack and the motor shaft so there is now a wobble to it. I checked the motor shaft and that seems fine. The top two grooves in the stack show obvious wear to them too (Could be resurfaced but whats the point if the main fit between pulley and shaft is off). So I am not sure if you would benefit at all from a picture asides from seeing which stack I am referencing. But I can if you guys really want to see it. (I might pull it off again to try to create a 3D model of it.

Thanks Peter, I will try to call modern in the morning. I dont have a exploded diagram though so I dont have a parts list for it. Does anyone have one they can send me? Or a URL where I can find one? (I am testing out my google-Fu now trying to find it)

 

[PeterT]

What vintage is it? Something like this?
https://www.kmstools.com/king-industrial-1-1-4-mill-drill-machine-2661

if so, service manual here
http://www.kingcanada.com/detail/milling-and-drilling-machine-PDM-30/870?cid=53&mid=4

Doesnt look like Modern is carrying presently, suspect this is different?
http://www.moderntool.com/products/modern-model-md-930-drilling-milling-machine/

 

[TheLocalDrunk]

Yes. Looks identical to that king one posted. So part 52 or 52-2. I will need to remeasure the shaft but 200$!!!!! Dang it. Might be my first lathe project when I get one.

 

[Tom Kitta]

Check out grizzly as well - they offer similar cookie cutter equipment and they are excellent for hard to find parts for "home-shop" grade equipment.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-Mill-Drill-with-Stand-8-x-29-Table-with-Powerfeed/G0760

Grizzly has exploding diagram with all parts and prices etc.

 

[TheLocalDrunk]

Check out grizzly as well - they offer similar cookie cutter equipment and they are excellent for hard to find parts for "home-shop" grade equipment.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/Grizzly-Mill-Drill-with-Stand-8-x-29-Table-with-Powerfeed/G0760

Grizzly has exploding diagram with all parts and prices etc.

Yarr so on that list it is part 86 or P0705086. But I cant get pricing to come up for it.
(BTW, Powerfeed, droooool)

 

[Tom Kitta]

Try to change yourself into "American" - for some reason they don't ship 95% of stuff to Canada directly - you can still get it to the border and then home using one of these shipping forwarders.

See power-feeds online on eBay / aliexpress. Some weaker powerfeed for bridgeports are now around 170 CAD - not sure how good they are but they are cheap. For your mill you need slightly different style of power feed through then bridgeport style mill.

 

[PeterT]

Looks like you are talking about the idler pulley? If the keyway is OK, yes maybe & bore & sleeve might do the trick. I would also check the runout on the shaft itself if that was a contributing problem or also got distorted somewhere along the line. Let us know how the prices compare, I'm curious.

 

[TheLocalDrunk]

Looks like you are talking about the idler pulley? If the keyway is OK, yes maybe & bore & sleeve might do the trick. I would also check the runout on the shaft itself if that was a contributing problem or also got distorted somewhere along the line. Let us know how the prices compare, I'm curious.

Both Grizzly and King refer to the pulley as the "Motor Pulley"
Same with the parts numbers I referenced above.

My Dad lives down in the states. Guess I could get him to help if needed. But JET one I found in the states was still 150USD. So over 200 CAD landed. I just started talking with Modern, will advise what they say.

 

[TheLocalDrunk]

Oh sorry, I guess I didnt mention.
The Key looks fine, the motor shaft looks fine.

Looks like the hole the motor shaft goes into on the pulley is related to Lindsay Lohan.

 

[Tom Kitta]

So the hole is ... too loose... cheapskate redneck solution would be to add some shimming on the shaft to make the fit more tight so the motor shaft doesn't go all over the place.

The actual pulley and the motor shaft should be a very tight fit - you should need some gear pullers to separate the two.

You can also try using tighter key - so that the key makes the fit very snug - through I am sure some vibration will be present at very high speed.

I never actually had that problem before.

 

[TheLocalDrunk]

So the hole is ... too loose... cheapskate redneck solution would be to add some shimming on the shaft to make the fit more tight so the motor shaft doesn't go all over the place.

The actual pulley and the motor shaft should be a very tight fit - you should need some gear pullers to separate the two.

You can also try using tighter key - so that the key makes the fit very snug - through I am sure some vibration will be present at very high speed.

I never actually had that problem before.

Bingo

Yeah I can pull the pulley off by hand fairly easily. I did think about redoing the key to make it tighter. Will bounce that off my friend that does stuff like that for a living.

 

[historicalarms]

where are you located, I'm surprised somebody hasn't offered to be bought off for a lunch at Timmies or a bottle of Bailys that lives close to you. Enlarging the old pulleys hole a bit (it will need truing up anyways) to accept a new bushing and cutting a bushing wont take much time. Princess prob has a bushing with the proper motor shaft ID for $4 or so. Even if you have to buy a broaching cutter for the proper key fit it will still be somewhat less expensive than the $200 quoted...and it could be up and running in an afternoon instead of waiting for that 'slow boat from China".

 

[historicalarms]

By the way it doesn't have to be a"puller required" tight fit, just a firm sliding fit is required and then a grub screw to tighten it in position so it doesn't "travel" during use.

 

[Tom Kitta]

Well, you don't even need a broach for cutting a keyway if it is just one time thing.

What he can do is enlarge the hole in the pulley by just 1mm on each side. This would make his keyway just 1mm shallower. Then he can put into it a 1mm cut on the side sleeve.

It may not be possible to bore a large hole in the pulley - it would need to be examined whatever such operation is possible.

My red-neck solution that takes 1min to try is to evenly put some tape on the motor shaft and hammer the pulley onto it and see how acceptable it is.

That pulley is cast iron (or aluminium) and is rather fragile - some kind of soft jaws arrangement would be needed to hold it accurately in place while boring it gently out if lathe is used & a 4 jaw. I think better would be to place it directly on a milling table and hold it securely from the top utilising table clamping system. Carefully find out centre of your shaft using edge finders. With lathe I would also mount it with clamping system.

Remember that brand new part is not guaranteed to work 100%. It may also be out of specs or your motor shaft may be out of spec and the pulley was actually OK.

 

[Dabbler]

I had prepared a reply much earlier, but forgot to hit 'post reply'.

I do have to clear up a few things. I have done this 3 times. A pulley that is poorly fitting, or just plain wore out goes loose on the keyed shaft....

As long as there is meat left you chuck it up on the lathe (yes, carefully) and bore it out and cut a bushing with a slit in it matching the keyway slot. This isn't rocket science.

If the pulley is loose, a puller isn't required. Every pulley in a working machine I've pulled hasn't required a puller - but there always is a first time.

please, please *don't* just add a shim. It will make the pulley eccentric, wearing the belts and bearings out quite quickly. (I have repaired one of these - if used long enough it is a major repair. By the time the belt is worn out, there's usually one or 2 bearings pooched as well.)

If you are near Calgary we can get together and have a look at the pulley.

Lastly, pulleys and vee belts are all standard. If you need a quad pulley for a 30 series belt, they are available with some looking. I'd do a repair on what you have for cheap, then source out a permanent one from Gates or Grizzly.

I've had no trouble shipping from Grizz, except they will only send UPS, which is $$$. I usually have them ship to a friend in the US and pick up when I visit.

 

[TheLocalDrunk]

I had prepared a reply much earlier, but forgot to hit 'post reply'.

I do have to clear up a few things. I have done this 3 times. A pulley that is poorly fitting, or just plain wore out goes loose on the keyed shaft....

As long as there is meat left you chuck it up on the lathe (yes, carefully) and bore it out and cut a bushing with a slit in it matching the keyway slot. This isn't rocket science.

If the pulley is loose, a puller isn't required. Every pulley in a working machine I've pulled hasn't required a puller - but there always is a first time.

please, please *don't* just add a shim. It will make the pulley eccentric, wearing the belts and bearings out quite quickly. (I have repaired one of these - if used long enough it is a major repair. By the time the belt is worn out, there's usually one or 2 bearings pooched as well.)

If you are near Calgary we can get together and have a look at the pulley.

Lastly, pulleys and vee belts are all standard. If you need a quad pulley for a 30 series belt, they are available with some looking. I'd do a repair on what you have for cheap, then source out a permanent one from Gates or Grizzly.

I've had no trouble shipping from Grizz, except they will only send UPS, which is $$$. I usually have them ship to a friend in the US and pick up when I visit.

Thanks Dabbler
I live in Copperfield and I work up by the Airport.
I can easily remove the pulley and MIC the motor shaft.

 

[Downwindtracker2]

If you use a credit card, Grizzly will only ship parts UPS to the card address, an ouch. Guess how I know.You may have to hit a bearing store for the step pulley, they don't seem stock them anymore at CT, or even hardware stores . BTW check you shafts they may be metric