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Proxxon Rotary?

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Premium Member
#1
My crummy Dremel, well it's not crummy just not very durable, has given it up. After limping through with a sticky collet, partly wrecked collar wrench thing, now the shaft lock button is broken. I can't keep the shaft fixed and change tools with the button - it just slips. I was pushing it a bit hard with a diamond bit and some fire brick making a hole when I think I melted the button internals. This tool is good for brief simple light weight tasks, not what I tend to do with it. Grinding, high loads, long use. I need something better.

My spouse has a Foredom with a pretty big external motor and rotary shaft. It's a good tool but pricey at $350ish. None on kijiji. People keep them I think cause they're good. I don't want to use hers though cause I'll beat on it and she makes jewelry, nice clean delicate stuff.

Proxxon has a few different models. A plastic housing one and a metal housing one. Reviews are solid. Anybody have one? Any other suggestions?

$120 Proxxon 38472 FBS 115/E Precision Rotary Tool

$200 Proxxon 38481 Professional Rotary Tool IBS/E
 

PeterT

Ultra Member
Premium Member
#3
I here ya. I've gone through Dremels over my modeling years, but I punish them too. I kept saying when the last one dies I might look into a Foredom. Never had one but they look solid. They have so many types of handles & tooling accessories. I've always wanted to mount one in a lathe tool post to do light duty grinding & polishing. I see pictures of that setup. It has relatively high rpm, not sure about bearing class or longevity. Big bucks like you say though. I see some deals on ebay but generally they float around these $C prices.
http://www.leevalley.com/en/home/Search.aspx?action=n
http://www.gessweincanada.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=foredome&Search.x=0&Search.y=0

Sorry cant help you on the Proxxon, but looks semi decent. I like the collet range because a lot of the grinding/polishing shanks are oddball sizes.
 

PeterT

Ultra Member
Premium Member
#6
When I say 'picked up' I meant 'physically lifted' the Makita, not purchased. Its almost 4 pounds. I figured it was too heavy to be used the way I'm using the Dremel, but really they are 2 completely different tools, light duty & heavy duty. I wondered out loud if an aftermarkey Foredome-like snake drive could be hooked up to the Makita collet so you could hold a lighter tool & have the motor unit resting on the bench (essentially a Foredome). Haven't seen that, so maybe there is a good reason why not.
 

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Premium Member
#7
I landed on this mini die grinder from princess. http://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/micro-air-die-grinder/A-p8239493e
It works with my compressor and was inexpensive. At some point I will get an electric die grinder, thanks @Alexander for the recommendation. That Makita is $150 new at Home depot. Seems to be cheapest there.

I've come to understand there is a big disconnect from what the manufacturers of air tools say is required and what is actually required for the tool to be useful. For my compressor, rated 5.3 cfm @ 90 psi, no rotary tools will work for more than about 8 seconds before the tank needs to refill. I get 8 seconds of useful tool time and then it takes 45 seconds to refill. And that's turning the regulator all the way up to 125 psi. I've tried two different tools too. Pointless to me. That's for a 2HP 10 gallon compressor. Rotary tools are typically rated at 4 cfm but internet research and first experience shows you need probably triple that figure at a minimum. People with air tools seem to already know this... I guess I do now too.

I think this means you need a $1400 power supply to operate rotary tools effectively. 220V and 5HP or more, and a big tank. Like Josh's new setup. The tank size and max pressure is also key factor. The top 10% or 20% of the tank volume is the useful part of the tank, below that the pressure is below the required tool pressure. So if your air tool is pulling 15 CFM the narrow volume above 90PSI is the only effective capacity of your tank. So you need a big tank, it needs to be as high as pressure as possible, and the pump needs lots of recharge capacity. Expensive tools are better. What else is new.

Might as well buy electric equivalents. Electric Die Grinders, Angle grinders, Dremels, Sanders, etc. The one main difference I see is the air tools are smaller and could get in to smaller spaces like under the hood. Air tools are easier to hold and perhaps lighter too.
 
Last edited:

Jwest7788

Well-Known Member
Administrator
Premium Member
#8
I landed on this mini die grinder from princess. http://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/micro-air-die-grinder/A-p8239493e
It works with my compressor and was inexpensive. At some point I will get an electric die grinder, thanks @Alexander for the recommendation. That Makita is $150 new at Home depot. Seems to be cheapest there.

I've come to understand there is a big disconnect from what the manufacturers of air tools say is required and what is actually required for the tool to be useful. For my compressor, rated 5.3 cfm @ 90 psi, no rotary tools will work for more than about 8 seconds before the tank needs to refill. I get 8 seconds of useful tool time and then it takes 45 seconds to refill. And that's turning the regulator all the way up to 125 psi. I've tried two different tools too. Pointless to me. That's for a 2HP 10 gallon compressor. Rotary tools are typically rated at 4 cfm but internet research and first experience shows you need probably triple that figure at a minimum. People with air tools seem to already know this... I guess I do now too.

I think this means you need a $1400 power supply to operate rotary tools effectively. 220V and 5HP or more, and a big tank. Like Josh's new setup. The tank size and max pressure is also key factor. The top 10% or 20% of the tank volume is the useful part of the tank, below that the pressure is below the required tool pressure. So if your air tool is pulling 15 CFM the narrow volume above 90PSI is the only effective capacity of your tank. So you need a big tank, it needs to be as high as pressure as possible, and the pump needs lots of recharge capacity. Expensive tools are better. What else is new.

Might as well buy electric equivalents. Electric Die Grinders, Angle grinders, Dremels, Sanders, etc. The one main difference I see is the air tools are smaller and could get in to smaller spaces like under the hood. Air tools are easier to hold and perhaps lighter too.
Something to keep in mind also, electric drive tools make a lot of sense for something like a die grinder. Why run a 220V 25A compressor motor to fill up a tank, when you could instead run a 120V 3.5A die grinder, without ever running into tank issues. Way less energy, and you avoid air limitations. Having said that, air is awesome too.

Do double check the actual PSI rating as well. A lot of tools call for 90PSI, which gives much more working time than running the same tool at 125PSI


Expensive tools are better. What else is new.
Haha, A constant struggle for sure.

JW
 

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Premium Member
#9
Follow up: I bought a used 2" Dewalt Die grinder, it's a beast and works well. I also bought a small black and decker RTX rotary tool to use with my dremel brushes etc for delicate stuff. It seems to be as good as the dremel for $40ish.
 

Janger

(John)
Administrator
Premium Member
#10
I landed on this mini die grinder from princess. http://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/micro-air-die-grinder/A-p8239493e
It works with my compressor and was inexpensive. At some point I will get an electric die grinder, thanks @Alexander for the recommendation. That Makita is $150 new at Home depot. Seems to be cheapest there.

I've come to understand there is a big disconnect from what the manufacturers of air tools say is required and what is actually required for the tool to be useful. For my compressor, rated 5.3 cfm @ 90 psi, no rotary tools will work for more than about 8 seconds before the tank needs to refill. I get 8 seconds of useful tool time and then it takes 45 seconds to refill. And that's turning the regulator all the way up to 125 psi. I've tried two different tools too. Pointless to me. That's for a 2HP 10 gallon compressor. Rotary tools are typically rated at 4 cfm but internet research and first experience shows you need probably triple that figure at a minimum. People with air tools seem to already know this... I guess I do now too.

I think this means you need a $1400 power supply to operate rotary tools effectively. 220V and 5HP or more, and a big tank. Like Josh's new setup. The tank size and max pressure is also key factor. The top 10% or 20% of the tank volume is the useful part of the tank, below that the pressure is below the required tool pressure. So if your air tool is pulling 15 CFM the narrow volume above 90PSI is the only effective capacity of your tank. So you need a big tank, it needs to be as high as pressure as possible, and the pump needs lots of recharge capacity. Expensive tools are better. What else is new.

Might as well buy electric equivalents. Electric Die Grinders, Angle grinders, Dremels, Sanders, etc. The one main difference I see is the air tools are smaller and could get in to smaller spaces like under the hood. Air tools are easier to hold and perhaps lighter too.
more "science" on why yours, and mine, air tools suck.